Switchover means that the fearful or aggressive behaviors have been
extinguished and replaced by affiliative, friendly or even playful
alternatives.

You must be able to see it. So, it's not mystical.

For Jane,
In the case of the tongue chewing, you would no longer be seeing that
behavior you would be seeing behavior that did not look like stress. You get
to define the behaviors you want to see. But, you must describe them in
terms that can be observed.

You can't say, for example "She's no longer stressed" or She's no longer
chewing her tongue"

You must say something like "Her ears are up and alert" "Her mouth is quiet"
Make sense?

Dolores

did I miss an email Laurel?

No- this was back when I tried to explain my understanding and she pointed out I had missed it.  Is there a way to “see” this- you have all described (somewhat mystical) experiences...if this is science, is there a scientific way to define it?
--
Jane
Bookends Farm
E. Ryegate, VT
www.bookendsfarm.com
www.bookendsfarm.blogspot.com/

 
 

----- Original Message -----

From: Jane Jackson

To: zenhorsemanship@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 9:04 AM

Subject: Re: [zenhorsemanship] a definition

 

Well, as Laurel pointed out- we missed the “switchover” (is that what you call it?)  
--
Jane
Bookends Farm
E. Ryegate, VT
www.bookendsfarm.com
www.bookendsfarm.blogspot.com/

CAT stands for Constructional Aggression Therapy. We use it for horses by modifying the A to stand for Approach. It was a technique originally designed for exceptionally fearful or aggressive animals, especially those who might be tempted to stuff emotions to work for a “normal” reinforcer, such that they later explode.  Due to their exceptional fear, the best reinforcer for them is actually the removal of whatever is causing their fear.

In its very basic form CAT uses Negative Reinforcement in an operant way to effect change in behaviour: To extinguish some behaviours that are not beneficial to the horse and replace them operantly with others. The tricky part to focus on is that we remove the object of distress during CAT trials because this is perceived by the horse as a reward.

We are guiding the horse to find the answers in the environment so that a human is not needed to create the change. This means that during CAT trials we do not click and treat. Rather, we give the horse distance when he shows us something that is consistent with a change in perception of the distressing situation.

The therapeutic goal of CAT is enabling. It aims to support the animal to change its perception of certain things, thereby enabling it to display new behaviours in certain earlier distressing situations. In other words our role is to facilitate change.

Now an analogy –

CAT can be likened to a dance (to borrow a phrase). In my dance, there is a prelude - whereby permission is given to take the lead. The partner approaches his potential dance partner and offers a hand. The shy lady demurs a moment. The potential partner waits for her. She gets up, fully understanding that this IS a partnership. He has given a reason to be trusted.

The horse has to feel comfortable with my choice of dance first before I can hope to take the lead. The horse will tell me when I can approach and lead and only when the horse tells me this have I any hope to build on the positive relationship. To that end it can be seen that our partnership starts with active listening.

.

--- In zenhorsemanship@yahoogroups.com, doris boyer <pablopolkaprisca@...>
wrote:
>
> My feeling s are quite mixed. , tending towards hopeless, sadness
>

  Dear Doris!
This is the crux of it all is it not? When we start to listen with ears, eyes
and heart we suddenly realize our horses have opinions and not always the same
wishes as we?
I want to RIDE...but some days my horse doesn't want to at all... I can then
choose to do as almost every horse owner do: ignore the horse and tack him up
and ride saying he is lazy;-) Or I have to readjust my wishes to be something
both me and my horse seems to want..

The problem is when we have started to see and hear we have a very hard time
ignoring our horses. Sometimes I feel a bit jelous of people who shamelessly
uses their horses for whatever they want themselves... but I always remember
that I do not WANT to do that any longer;-)

I waited for three years to become so close with my Jazz as you describe you are
with your horse! Do not despair, enjoy all the things you CAN do with her and
feel that she likes it!
And sometimes it helps greatly to just STOP focusing on the problem, as if the
horses feel we are not content with them and therefore they get very tense as
soon as we approach "the problem" once again....
Jazz was like that: if I was full of my wanting to hug her and scratch her she
became VERY suspicious...and honestly I can feel the same...as when someone you
do not really know shows very clearly that he or she WANTS something from you...
like a persistent but unwanted suitor;-) In the end I TOLD Jazz that I loved her
and were going to go ON doing that but that she did NOT need to love me back at
all...
That took the pressure away... (someone saying needs and wants can't be felt as
pressure?? ;-)

Hang in there, you will work it out in the end, between the two of you!

Ulrika (who now gets kisses from her Jazz...after four years;-)

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Dolores Arste <darste3@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Thank you Cindy for the update. You are doing such a good job with porter.
>
> We did arrive in Hatfield. All is well. The boys are having a great time.

Glad you arrived without incident. :)

> Did I mention that our friend used a stocking over her mare's nose when she
rode. That for some reason stopped the shaking. Since he likes it when you
cradle his nose I remembered the stocking.

You did tell me that and it's a common suggestion on the headshaking
list. I tried it. NOT a pretty situation. Nor was a fly mask with nose
cover. And in truth, he didn't like, or maybe I should say, "trust" me
touching his nose or chin at first. We clicked it. Very short, brief
contact. Very calm approach. Now I am working on inviting him to
target those face parts to my hands. He is moving into them much more
willingly than at first. I could probably introduce the stocking
gradually, now that he is more comfortable with me handling his face,
but I haven't gone there for now. I think there are other, bigger
issues to address, and frankly, I think trying to put panty hose on
his nose might well undo the trust we've built right now.

The theory on the stocking is that having some physical contact or
pressure on the nose gives the nerve something else to respond to,
besides the purported zingy sensations that prompt the shaking.

Thanks for mentioning it though. I may consider it again further down the line.

Cheers,
Cindy

>>The Fear DVD is wonderful and works really well. So what I really think
>>you are asking is why use CAT instead of the CT method.

Actually what I'm asking is "why all the fuss?"  It's not THAT different.
But the two "sides" make it sound like the other side can't possibly
understand. ugh<<

Exactly. I can't answer this one. Remember what Alex said about the dead
slilence when Jesus presented to Clicker Expo? It's almost like you need to
have or know of the animal that needs CAT to be willing to give it a try.

I'm not even going to venture a guess as to why when even at that level of
teacher, there was no dialog on the subject.

Warmly,
Dolores
--