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Questions re: Observers   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #730 of 872 |
Re: [wafcjr] Questions re: Observers

There seems to be some confusion here:

The "Observer" is an official -- akin to a referee -- whose authority comes from the tournament rules and the agreement of the two teams.  The "Observer" must be an impartial official, not a casual spectator or a coach.  So, you're right that a coach cannot name himself an ad hoc "Observer" during a game, or exercise any authority over the outcome of a play under the Observer rules.

In fact, the Observer rules are irrelevant to the situation you're talking about.  The relevant rule is the Spirit of the Game, which says that players and coaches should treat opponents as they would want to be treated, that fair and safe play is more important than winning.  If we're adhering to the Spirit of the Game, then we're not making dangerous plays.  If we're adhering to the Spirit of the Game, then coaches, when they see dangerous plays, won't react with ultimatums, but with cool-headed conversations and explanations to opposing coaches or captains about what is and isn't safe.  If we're adhering to the Spirit of the Game, then we'll react with respect when coach requests that we play more safely.  If we're adhering to the Spirit of the Game as coaches/captains, then we'll bench our own player if he can't play safely, before an opposing coach even has to ask.

Finally, a coach is responsible for the safety of his or her players.  If an opposing team really is refusing to play safely -- and there is no good reason this should ever happen -- then it's a coach's responsibility to keep his or her players from continuing the game.  Again, this has nothing to do with the Observer rule; it's a matter of a coach's basic responsibilities.  How do we "count" the game, then?  In the case of WAFC Jr., I think the league director(s) should figure out what happened and make a case-by-case call on how to score it; my own opinion is that they should give the benefit of the doubt to the coaches who err on the side of safety.


--bvh.



On 9/28/07, Ben Finkelstein <benf@...> wrote:

In a league game last spring, one school's coach (that is, faculty
supervisor, not player-captain) ejected an opposing player for what he
deemed a dangerous, deliberate foul. The opposing team felt that this
was inappropriate, but the coach stated that play would not resume if
the player he had ejected remained on the field.

This raises a number of questions.

As I read the Ultimate rules, specifically Paragraphs I.C and I.D and
Section XVIII, an Observer may have the authority to eject players,
but only when granted that specific authority under the event
organizer's rules or by agreement of the two captains prior to an
individual match. The WAFC Jr. Rules posted on this site do not
mention Observers, and indeed state, under "Self-Refereeing," that
"Players resolve their own disputes." I infer that there are no
special league rules that empower Observers.

It is understandable that a school may desire that a faculty member
somehow supervise its club's games, but perhaps this could be done
without one side's coach taking on any or all of the powers of an
Observer (especially a self-appointed one). Should situations like
this be worked out by the captains, with the coaches' roles being
limited to conferring with their own captains?

My view at last season's game was that, there having been no pre-game
agreement regarding ejection of players, the opposing team would have
been entitled to claim a forfeit and, if it wished, continue play as
an unofficial scrimmage. (I didn't volunteer this thought at the time,
as my view was and is that the players should have worked things out
themselves.)

Suppose one captain tells the other, before the game, that his team
may play only if its coach has the power under Paragraph XVIII.B.4 to
eject players for hard fouls? Absent a league rule permitting such a
demand, the general rules would seem to allow the other captain to
claim a forfeit in lieu of agreeing to that condition. Which side
would be violating the Spirit of the Game? Maybe both!

My son won't be playing in the Spring league this season, so I'm just
throwing this out as a question that might be of general interest.




Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:34 pm

berend42
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In a league game last spring, one school's coach (that is, faculty supervisor, not player-captain) ejected an opposing player for what he deemed a dangerous,...
Ben Finkelstein
benf_dc
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Sep 28, 2007
3:47 pm

There seems to be some confusion here: The "Observer" is an official -- akin to a referee -- whose authority comes from the tournament rules and the agreement...
Berend Van Heuvelen
berend42
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Sep 28, 2007
4:34 pm
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