Hi Pat,
yes, the worrying thing is I can see how a lot of these 'training
gurus' go on these 30 day diet plans, then set themselves up as vegan
dietary experts "Why yes I have been vegan, so I understand all your
issues", then when it all goes 'pear-shaped' (hopefully not
literally!), people are left thinking the diet is bad when in fact
it's these people with no experience in this specific field that are
actually leading them along the wrong path. You can already see these
trainers beginning to jostle for position as the market place grows
for these sorts of diets. I'm expecting things to get more muddled
over the next few years as more 'gurus' begin to enter the fray &
start muddying the waters with their own various twists on vegan
dieting, mass building etc.
Sticking to people who know what they're doing is the best defence
against being led down inappropriate pathways that are likely to
emerge over the next few years.

Pete Ryan www.veganbodybuilding.org

2009/7/8 Pat Reeves <pat@...>:
>
>
> Hi Pete!
> Practitioners well-versed in Nurititional and Functional Medicine (like me!)
> can identify how an individual could eat to improve any malady - including
> achieving overall body weight and optimal lean to fat tissue.
> No 'one-size' programme suits all - as you specify - achieving/perfecting an
> individual programme is normally within the domain of an experienced
> practitioner. We all continually learn! Love, Pat.
>
> 2009/7/8 Vegan Bodybuilding <pete@...>
>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>> I can give you the basic theory behind it, but to be honest exactly
>> how any fat loss/fat gaining occurs exactly is still a mystery, no one
>> knows for sure (the easiest way to tell a liar in the fat loss scene
>> is when someone says they understand the exact mechanisms of fat
>> loss-the basics are common sense, 'less calories in, less body
>> weight', but HOW that works exactly still isn't understood).
>> The idea expounded by low carbers revolves around insulin. Insulin is
>> a major anabolic drug, in certain situations it can stimulate muscle
>> gains, in other situations fat gains. Having low carbs in the body
>> (low glycogen stores) also means lower water storage, therefore less
>> weight.
>> Stage one of a low carb diet is water loss. As you have use up your
>> stored carbs (glycogen stores), water basically pours out of you.
>> Within reason, whatever you eat your bodyweight will drop, so for the
>> first few days you get a real drop in scale weight (every gram of
>> glycogen holds 3 grams of water within the body).
>> Next comes the theory behind the longterm fat loss. There are
>> probably other versions out there, but the most common I've come
>> across is that you need insulin to add fat to the body. Therefore, no
>> matter how much fat you eat you won't be able to add much stored fat
>> as there will be no insulin to initiate the response of turning eaten
>> fat into stored bodyfat. Also as the carb levels are so low your body
>> starts using other fuels to keep the body going & so the fat is burned
>> as fuel & not stored. A couple of problems with this is that the
>> other main food ingested is protein & protein also illicits an insulin
>> response (not to the extent of carbs, but it's there). The second
>> area of fat loss involves controlling calories. By cutting out an
>> entire food group you limit your options & so, even without planning,
>> you are likely to have cut your calories somewhat. So the low carb
>> people suggest that the lower insulin & lower calories are the 'double
>> whammy' needed to start & maintain fat-loss.
>>
>> There are other camps that use a similar theory, some theories suggest
>> eating high carb & high fat meals at separate times & not combining
>> both in a meal, others suggest carb cycling (high carb/low carb days),
>> still other control carbs to a lower level (but above what you'd call
>> low carbs)...the list goes on. In my option most of them work if
>> utilised as explained in their writings. Most diets do work, the real
>> issues are can you sustain that form of eating. If you can't, then
>> it's pointless trying to do it because as soon as you go back to
>> eating 'normally' the weight will just pile back on. What you want is
>> to find a way to eat that causes a weight change, but is enjoyable
>> enough that you can do it for life, without feeling deprived, that is
>> because what you are looking for is a 'lifestyle change', not a a
>> quick-fix diet. I usually suggest you change as little as possible to
>> a normal diet to achieve your goals.
>> My basic advice for building an eating planning is to start with the
>> lightest changes you can make, like removing the junk from all but 1
>> or 2 re-feed meals a week (these should be planned-like when I went to
>> the opening of the new vegan café 'Vbites', I knew I'd eat some junk).
>> That is often enough for most people, just removing the junk &
>> exchanging it for quality food, whether this is a lowering of calories
>> or the fact that the better food gets the body functioning better than
>> it was (or a combination of the 2) I'm not sure, but often even with
>> little, or no change in calories, just cleaning up the diet can
>> somehow make the body change it's fat to lean mass ratio (that is, the
>> weight on the scales stays the same, but the lean mass goes up & body
>> fat goes down-& the clothes sizes shrink even though the scales say
>> you are the same weight!). From there if you aren't losing the weight
>> you slowly begin making things slightly tougher (giving every change
>> several weeks to see any effect) until you start losing fat (as I
>> suggest using heavy [for you] weight training as part of a fat loss
>> program I don't tend to look at bodyweight lose, but fat loss).
>> In my opinion only 2 groups probably need to think about low carb
>> dieting. Those into bodybuilding where some form of strict carb
>> control can really help get that fat down to well below the single
>> digits, or those with metabolic issues & no other form of diet appears
>> to work.
>> I have noted that a certain % of the population do seem to thrive on
>> various forms of carb control, this may be because a certain % of the
>> human race is 'programmed' with that survival feature for times of
>> carb deprivation [ice ages, etc], so for a few it might be an option
>> worth exploring? This is purely theory on my part, from observation.
>> If you do intend to experiment, please bear in mind that
>> phyto-nutrients (the chemicals in plants) are some of the most
>> important substances we eat & no chemist or pill can replace them as I
>> doubt we know 1% of these vital chemicals. Eating fresh fruits &
>> veggies are the only guaranteed sources of these vital products, so
>> even if you do plan to take some form of carb control, be sensible &
>> plan your eating so you a lot of whole plant food into you. Also to
>> keep the thyroid & other bodily functions working correctly you do
>> need to re-feed with at least one very high carb meal weekly or you
>> might well suffer from health issues.
>> The above is not a comprehensive coverage of all the variations in the
>> low carb diet, nor all the reasons why low carbers claim their diets
>> work, but only the one's I find most likely given todays research
>> (well the stuff I've read on it anyway).
>>
>>
>> Pete Ryan www.veganbodybuilding.org
>>
>> 2009/7/8 jont2002 <jont2002@... <jont2002%40yahoo.com>>:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi Pete,
>> >
>> >> Anyone can get down to a normal weight range with some carbs included
>> >> & it's only those needing to cut fat to the bone need to worry about
>> >> cutting back carbs (barring junk & refined carbs they should be at a
>> >> minimum for everyone).
>> >
>> > I have never understood this. Why would eating more fat make you less
>> > fat? Why would eating carbohydrates, which have to be converted to fat
>> > to be stored on your body, more likely make or keep you fat than eating
>> > the fat itself?
>> >
>> > AFAIK, 97% of the energy from fat can be stored as fat on your body,
>> > whereas about 75% of the energy from carbohydrate can be stored as fat
>> > on your body (about 25% of the energy is consumed to do the conversion
>> > to fat). I also understand that by weight, fat has 2.25 times more
>> > energy than carbohydrate and that the human body prefers to consume the
>> > energy from carbohydrate immediately rather than store it. Thus,
>> > supposedly, if you consume 100 grams of fat, 97 grams (873 calories)
>> > will likely be stored as fat, but if you consume 100 grams of
>> > carbohydrate (far less calories, but same mass), 33 grams (300 calories)
>> > may be stored as fat if you overeat enough to cause that.
>> >
>> > By carbohydrates, I am not talking about junk carbohydrates; I am
>> > talking about natural plant-grown carbohydrates in vegetables, fruit,
>> > and starches.
>> >
>> > I can look up references for that if you want, but it is basically all
>> > coming from Dr. McDougall and his references. If the above is true, and
>> > assuming you are not going into keytosis, I don't understand why eating
>> > a higher range of fat would cause you to lose fat. Can you explain? Or
>> > can you forward your prior explanations (I am sure many people have
>> > asked you this before)?
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> --
> Pat Reeves, Practitioner of Nutritional and Functional Medicine.
> For latest info on living foods and courses, please view my website
> www.foodalive.org or email me at pat@....
> FULL MEMBER OF THE BRITISH ASSOCIATION FOR APPLIED NUTRITION AND NUTRITIONAL
> THERAPY. Registered with Nutritional Therapy Council.
> *"MY LONG-AWAITED BOOK - "A LIVING MIRACLE" IS NOW AVAILABLE - PLEASE SEE
> WEBSITE FOR DETAILS"*
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>