Okay, sure, but it's okay to wander off topic a bit and Andrew has
been studying Systema for 10 years, which is longer than just about
anyone I know, including most of my instructors. In retrospect, I am
not sure if Andrew realized I was only describing my own class
experience which was not intended to be applied to the greater world
at large. Based on my own experience in Edgar's class, gender is not
a factor. Willingness to learn, dedication to training, time spent on
the training floor, and individual psychology are much greater
factors in the skill a student will acquire. It is not so different
from any skill: practice more, and you will generally become more
skilled than someone who practices less. This is not to say you can
beat everyone in the entire world because you practice more than your
fellow students.

I can try putting it another way: we have dozens of students at
Fighthouse but only 5 of us are dedicated to the training, show up
regular and have been doing so for years. It is no big mystery why we
are more skilled than those students who have less training. It does
not mean we have natural advantages or are somehow better people. It
does not mean we would always prevail if one of our fellow students
sought to inflict violence upon us (which is unlikely). Nor does it
mean that we are more skilled than everyone in the entire world
beyond the few dozen students that train at Fighthouse. It simply
means we have more hours of training than our classmates and
therefore more skill. We began training before they did and train
more frequently than they do. It's a pretty simple equation. But it
only applies within our group of students. Everyone in the world
beyond is an unknown factor, as far as I am concerned, and I am not
willing to make assumptions about them.

I may have seemed a bit sharp in my reply (it's AM in NYC, time for a
second cup of coffee), but please keep in mind that Andrew has
substantial military experience and more years of Systema that some
of the senior instructors, and so I think, even if it's off the topic
of the thread, it's okay to post other opinions and meander a bit off
the original thread.

*Vsego nailuchshego* (best wishes),
Rachel



--- In systema_group@yahoogroups.com, sean davis <sadavis7154@...>
wrote:
>
> With all due respect,
>
> I applaud the zeal that both of you bring to the forum, it is a
testament of both, your passion for the System ,and a credit to your
self development. However, I must say to you dear Andrew, Rachel was
responding to questions that I directly posed to her, so please be
easy. It wasnt a challenge to men, or an endeavour to launch a
campaign for a battle of the sexes. ;)
> Rachel i deeply thank you for they very concise letter you wrote
in response to my questions. I will aply apply the jewels you have
expounded when and where needed. I wish to continue future further
dialouge if thats is order.
>
> Friendly greetings and best wishes on the journeys of you both,
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Sean
>
> rkxyz <rklingberg@...> wrote:
> QUOTE:
> However a better skilled woman especially in systema can definitely
> overcome a poorly skilled man, that's what is so good about Systema.
>
> Here you are saying exactly what I said in my original post. I do
not
> understand why you simultaneously agree and disagree.
>
> QUOTE:
> Whilst I agree that some women make excellent fighters, my
experience
> in and out of the armed forces has shown me that men are naturally
> built like natural weapons(due to natures design)and therefore an
> equally trained men is at an advantage in a physical encounter over
a
> woman.
>
> That assumption could easily get you killed. You must also take
into
> account whether one combatant is armed and the other is not, their
> determination to succeed, whether or not they will sacrifice their
> own life to take your own, whether one person is more fatigued,
> dehydrated, cold, hot, or injured than the other, and whether both
> are alone or have additional support, if one person is familiar
with
> the terrain and the other is not, how well each of them handle
> adrenaline and fear... if you take a look at Vlad's "Ability to
> Fight" chart: http://www.new-pony.com/systema/RMA.jpg there's
nothing
> on there about gender or build, although "physical shape"
> and "physical condition" do appear, and I guess you could say those
> are loosely tied to gender.
>
> If you have a man and a woman with exactly the same amount of
> training, precisely the same level of skill and overall physical
well-
> being, squaring off face-to-face, neither will be surprised, and
> neither is armed, then I completely agree, the man has the natural
> advantage of strength. If you can guarantee that every conflict
will
> be as such, it would be foolhardy to think that a woman has an
> advantage. I guess it depends on what sort of conflicts you
encounter
> and whether they would ever fall outside this face-to-face, equal
> skill, no suprises, no weapons, perfectly matched in every way
except
> for the natural differences of the sexes. For some people, that may
> be the only conflicts they need to train for, but my experience
with
> being assaulted does not fit this description.
>
> I stand by my original post, Andrew: individual psychology is more
of
> a factor than gender. Of course, anyone is free to disagree, and
> quite a few men believe they have a natural advantage. 9.5% of
> murders committed in the U.S. between 1976-2005 were committed by
> women against men. Natural advantage is no guarantee of survival,
and
> those male victims of murdering women are testament to that.
>
> Perhaps a more humble person would concede that the inexperienced
men
> in my class can easily prevail over me, but I can only base my
> assumption on what I've learned from training with them. I can't
> speculate about what they might do; I have to consider what they
have
> actually done. Skill acquired through Systema training is more of
an
> advantage than gender. Thus the smallest guy in my class, who is
> considerably shorter, lighter and less strong than the big muscular
> guys, has no disadvantage when training with them because he has
more
> skill due to his many years of training. His natural physiology is
> smaller, lighter, and less muscular than many female practitioners
> I've know. It is only through training and acquiring skill that his
> natural "disadvantage" becomes less significant that his skill.
>
> Vlad once said, "don't give the other guy too much credit." IMHO
it's
> a mistake to assume that you can prevail over anyone, whether it's
> based on your skill, gender, or any sort of natural advantage you
> feel you have. But neither is it sensible to assume that everyone
can
> destroy you. There is no way to predict the outcome of any given
> conflict. We all know it's not the same as training in a class
where
> your partners do not intend to take your life. But there's no way
to
> simulate life-threatening situations without the actual threat of
> death. Still, it's pointless to say that it's all useless and we
have
> learned nothing from Systema merely because we haven't used it to
> preserve our lives in a true survival situation. My entire class
are
> civilians and we do the best we can. Assumptions about any natural
> advantage or disadvantage do not serve us well. The Systema mindset
> is flexible, not predefined.
>
> Forgive me for being arrogant. That's only my opinion and everyone
is
> free to disagree.
>
> *Vsego nailuchshego* (best wishes),
> Rachel
>
> --- In systema_group@yahoogroups.com, "Andrew Martini"
> <7thphoenix@> wrote:
> >
> > Hello Rachel,
> >
> > Nice Post!
> >
> > Vladimir's "Let every breath" is essential in understanding how
to
> control
> > your body/mind properly for sure.
> > I've been training in Systema for about 10 years now, and whilst
I
> agree
> > with a lot of what you're saying, I think you have to be more
> realistic also
> > in your rating of said self's abilities.
> >
> > It is vastly different training with fellow students that do not
> have an
> > intent of harming you and are somewhat cooperative compared to the
> > individual intent on hurting you at all costs on the street.
> >
> > Systema does a great job in preparing you to flow in every which
> way so you
> > can overcome your would be attacker or at least survive.
> >
> > However, I would fall far short of making the assumption that
every
> man you
> > train with could not deal to you in a life an death situation if
> they had
> > to.
> >
> > The success in survival and an mounting an attack is definitely
90%
> > psychological, as mentioned on prior occasions Systema frees the
> individual
> > of those panic attacks and mental blocks which are responsible in
> making so
> > many individuals freeze during an attack.
> >
> > Letting your Body/mind react instinctively.
> >
> > The development of Systema and the Russian fighting arts is, like
> all
> > fighting arts, traced to the warriors of Russia and more recently
> to the
> > commando units .aka Spetsnaz.
> >
> > The Russians have always understood the importance of the
body/mind
> > connection on on natural flow, so I wouldn't lump this principle
> with the
> > new age concept.
> >
> > It has been around for centuries.
> >
> > Whilst I agree that some women make excellent fighters, my
> experience in and
> > out of the armed forces has shown me that men are naturally built
> like
> > natural weapons(due to natures design)and therefore an equally
> trained men
> > is at an advantage in a physical encounter over a woman.
> >
> > However a better skilled woman especially in systema can
definitely
> overcome
> > a poorly skilled man, that's what is so good about Systema.
> >
> > You stated that a lot of guys try to come in all commando style,
> and whilst
> > that may be true especially in Canada and the U.S.A I also have
> seen many
> > women that cannot and do not flow well at all when training in
> > Systema.Theytry to force techniques and use whatever physical
> > attributes they have ,
> > this is especially true of women that have ring experience or
have
> trained
> > in traditional Karate/Muay Thai or wrestling.
> >
> > Spetznaz troops move very freely flowing in and out of an attack
> and often
> > disrupting the attacker and overcoming the would be opponent,
> regardless of
> > their size.
> >
> > They are adept at dissolving an attack even before the proponent
> has fully
> > launched into a full flight assault.
> >
> > Because they have mastered themselves first, they are masters of
> their
> > mind/body, they totally understand who they are and the
environment
> around
> > them and the laws which govern who they are and the how the
> universal
> > principles apply to themselves and everything they interact with.
> >
> > I wholly and heartily recommend every individual training in
> Systema to read
> > and watch "Let every breath" as a first but extremely essential
> step in
> > helping you become a master of your body/mind and your own
Universe.
> >
> > It may sound new age but actually it has been around since the
> beginning of
> > mankind and is a fundamental concept that has been and is
enacting
> itself
> > all around us all the time.
> >
> > Systema helps you tap into this, thus freeing you from your
limits
> and you
> > will become one with it.
> >
> > Happy training.
> >
> > Cheers!
> >
> > -Andrew
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/7/07, rkxyz <rklingberg@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > > In response to your question, I have been training 3X a week
for 3
> > > years and 10 months. I remember the date so exactly because I
pay
> my
> > > class tuition on the 15th of every month. I live in NYC and
train
> at
> > > Fighthouse with Edgar Tsakouls http://www.fighthouse.com
> > > I think individual psychology is more of a factor than gender. I
> > > guess women have one advantage in that strength is rarely an
> option
> > > in a class full of men, and there are very few women in Systema
> and
> > > in martial arts in general. So women have to learn the skills,
we
> > > have no choice if we want to excel. Sure, it can be a bit lonely
> > > sometimes, being the only woman at a seminar of 50 men. At the
> 2005
> > > training camp, there were about 95 men and only 5 women. But
> that's
> > > more of a social reason than a practical one. Most guys are
nice,
> a
> > > few feel humiliated that a woman with a lot of training is a
> better
> > > fighter than a man with almost none. In general, Systema guys
are
> > > decent, gentlemanly types who respect women who can fight
rather
> than
> > > feel threatened by them.
> > >
> > > I wouldn't say Systema is easier for me because I am a woman.
It's
> > > easier for me because I was able to learn to relax more quickly
> than
> > > some other students. This is the single hardest thing to learn.
> You
> > > can pick up the other foundations of Systema, the breathing,
> constant
> > > movement, and correct posture. But you simply cannot force
> yourself
> > > to relax. Systema is 90% psychological. If it wasn't, I would
not
> > > have come this far. At the risk of sounding arrogant, I'm one of
> > > Edgar's top students, I rarely miss class. The last time I
missed
> a
> > > Systema class November of 2006. So because I am diligent, I have
> > > learned more than students who train sporadically or only once a
> > > week. But I am neither strong, nor fast, agile, certainly not
> > > aggressive, I have no desire to "beat" anyone, in fact, I'm
> actually
> > > a shy person. Systema is so effective that even though most of
the
> > > guys are bigger, stronger, more competitive, and have a lot more
> > > invested in "winning," very few are any match for me. This is
not
> a
> > > testament to my superior skills. It's just that diligent Systema
> > > training will have that effect on anyone! And I have a great
> > > teacher :)
> > >
> > > The most important thing, in my opinion, is to relax mentally
and
> > > physically and to use proper breathing as described in Let Every
> > > Breath. Don't try to "do" something to your training parter.
Let
> the
> > > movements of the attack guide your defense. Sooner or later it
> will
> > > all blend together. By defending, you also learn effective
> attacks.
> > > It's a very small difference between attack and defense, very
> often,
> > > it's simply a matter of who starts the engagement. Anything you
> use
> > > to defend can also be used to attack and vice-versa.
> > >
> > > Lots of guys want to go all commando, they get lured into
Systema
> by
> > > its connection to the special forces and the military. Systema
is
> > > extremely brutal and effective, yet it is not possible without
> what
> > > some would consider the more New-Age-y side: breathing and
> > > relaxation. My advice is to not overlook these key components of
> > > Systema simply because they don't appear dramatic or exciting.
> Don't
> > > be shy about coordinating breathing to movement. I have seem
many
> > > students who do not progress because they are unwilling to
explore
> > > the so-called "softer" side of Systema: relaxation and
breathing.
> > > These are the very things that may save your life if you are
held
> in
> > > a tight joint lock or sustain a mortal wound and feel your
> strength
> > > ebbing away. I always remember that Vlad told me Systema is 90%
> > > psychological and that means that whatever movements and
> techniques
> > > you practice, ultimately it's your own psyche that will aid your
> > > survival.
> > >
> > > Hope this helps. Good luck with your training and *vsego
> > > nailuchshego* (best wishes),
> > > Rachel
> > >
> > > --- In systema_group@yahoogroups.com <systema_group%
> 40yahoogroups.com>,
> > > sean davis <sadavis7154@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > thanks a million Rachel,
> > > > I will do that. How long have you trained, where are you
located
> > > and was you treated differently being a woman in the system? Or
> did/
> > > does it come easier to you than it does with men, We have a
> tendency
> > > to use strength where grace is needed. Sorry if im asking to
many
> > > questions
> > > >
> > > > Sean
> > > >
> > > > rkxyz <rklingberg@> wrote:
> > > > Hi,
> > > > Have you tried the training partners section of Vlad's site:
> > > > http://www.russianmartialart.com/main.php?page=partners
> > > > If there's nobody listed nearby, try posting a question to the
> > > forum,
> > > > they might know of another student in the Frankfurt area.
That's
> > > > probably your best chance of finding someone in your area.
> > > > Good luck and best wishes,
> > > > Rachel
> > > >
> > > > --- In systema_group@yahoogroups.com <systema_group%
> 40yahoogroups.com>,
> > > sean davis <sadavis7154@>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > hi im living in germany, Frankfurt area which is west
germany,
> > > all
> > > > schools for systema are in east a great distance from where i
> > > reside. I
> > > > was hoping someone may know of someone who may be a certified
> > > trainer
> > > > are at least trained in the art. living in the area (hessen)
> Anyone
> > > got
> > > > any clues?
> > > > > thanks
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------
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