I agree with Jan on several points:
-Beginner class is a comfort to some beginners and originally was
created as a way to draw more people in. So, we can keep the beginner
series, and just point out that there are also other entry points.

-I think a general marketing concept is that an incentive is something
you give free ON TOP of the main product you are selling (e.g. a free
book or gi, [but I'm not suggesting that], or like Bruce Bookman
advertises, a free private lesson) or you give just a little taste for
an intro price--which we already do with the beginner series. I agree
that people value what they pay for and are more likely to stick through
the difficult first weeks if they have made a financial investment.

-Also, we don't want to invest a lot of energy in someone who is just
doing something for free and will drop it when it's no longer free.

-It would be nice to figure out a way to help people keep coming who are
financially challenged. I know we generally grant concessions to those
who ask. I'm not sure pay-per-performance is the way to go. When
there's more money (or donors) it would be nice to have scholarships
available for people to attend seminars who wouldn't otherwise go due to
financial constraints. Then they could come back and share one thing
they got from the seminar.

Thanks for all the thoughtful...thoughts. Keep 'em coming.

Christy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jan Keller [mailto:jkell@...]
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 4:28 PM
To: Joe Ewing; rupertberk@...;
seattleschoolofaikido@yahoogroups.com
Cc: davidmkaplan@...; jainr@...; johnpengmd@...;
allankaplan@...; Purdy, Christina; lmortensen@...;
mikeu1@...; robbypellett@...; zeesyzygy@...;
fjvega@...; vkgadi@...
Subject: RE: All-Dojo Meeting ideas & the Yahoo Group

It's great to see all these ideas coming out. I would like to offer a
few ideas, some of them in contrast with previous suggestions, but all
in the same spirit :-) I'll mix in my rationale as I describe them:
* Many beginners like something consistent that they can follow, and
find a multiplicity of teachers confusing right at first. The ones who
don't feel this way already have an option--join the dojo and start
training. So in my view, removing the Beginners series just takes
something away, it doesn't add anything. That said, we could offer
people who want to start training *outside* the Beginner series a
discount for the first month, or maybe just drop the "registration fee."
Also, we could emphasize to everyone who inquires about training that
the option of just jumping in and training is a great way to start.
* I think we need to think carefully before making the Beginner Series
free. (Certainly it's okay to try this.) I used to think that making
something free would really draw people, but my actual observation is
that putting a bit of money down increases people's commitment and
interest. And when you charge money for something, it says "This is
something valuable." I actually think that in a majority of cases,
having paid some money can help get people through the first challenging
weeks (falling down that first 25 times, etc.). This is paradoxical,
but it's actually what I see in people's behavior.
* People usually train because they like training, not because they want
some money back. That said, I do think there are people who must limit
their training because money is tight. Perhaps we could do more to
offer training-related opportunities that come with a discounted dues
rate--people who are having tight finances might train more. For
example, a student could show a stretch that he or she has found
beneficial, and explain how it helps, during 12 warmups during the year.
Or a student could commit to training for 10 minutes after every class
where this is feasible, as part of generating excitement and energy in
the dojo. Videotaping is another responsibility that could warrant a
discount--but we should try to give the person training so they don't
have to figure the camera out by themselves.
* This is an idea that I do think would help, but involves work on our
parts (myself included). We could re-energize the idea of inviting a
guest instructor every other month, and really make an effort to get
everyone on the mat for those nights. The Seattle area is full of
wonderful teachers, and bringing them in just extends the 'diversity'
aspect of our dojo. (Here's another discounted dues idea: commit to
showing up, and encouraging others to show up, for 90% of the guest
instructor nights.) When we have a guest instructor, at the end of
class, a (regular) instructor might potentially say, "I plan on working
with the ideas we saw in this class next NNNday-- so show up and we'll
explore this some more then." This would extend the energy from the
guest instructor night to another night.
* Another idea that involves work--we could offer demonstrations in high
schools, community colleges, or other venues. People who see Aikido
often get excited about it, and some would come into the dojo to try it
out.

I'll see you on Oct 21st -- keep the ideas coming-- Jan


-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Ewing [mailto:jbe-kkr@...]
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 7:53 PM
To: rupertberk@...; seattleschoolofaikido@yahoogroups.com
Cc: davidmkaplan@...; jainr@...; johnpengmd@...;
allankaplan@...; CPurdy@...; Jan Keller;
lmortensen@...; mikeu1@...;
robbypellett@...; zeesyzygy@...; fjvega@...;
vkgadi@...
Subject: Re: All-Dojo Meeting ideas & the Yahoo Group

Lori was surprised to hear that we have a yahoo group and it made me
wonder if other members would be too. How can we most easily spread the
word of this forum, as it is ideal for this kind of discussion?

In talking with Yvonne, it made me realize that a lot of the most
exciting developments re: our re-energizing the dojo may actually take
place during this kind of discussion BEFORE the meeting itself. It
would be great to include as many as possible in these conversations.

(Thrilling, isn't it - seeing something new be born?) - Kim

On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 14:38:30 -0700 "Rupert Berk"
<rupertberk@...>
writes:
> John,
> Thanks for re-stimulating this discussion.
>
> I think the idea of a more mainstreaming approach with the beginners
> is worth a try. It certainly will change things up. It seems we'll
> have to agree about, among other things, what constitutes the beginner

> curriculum in that world. I'm fine with there being no standardized
> curriculum, but others may not agree.
>
> Not all beginners will prefer the mainstream approach. In the past,
> several beginners have expressed that they feel more comfortable in a
> class of only beginners when they are just starting. But that's ok;
> people have different preferences.
>
> As for the discounted first month new member rate, I'm also happy to
> try that (I also prefer discounted to free).
>
> I'm completely against the profit-sharing idea, though. I really can't

> see this serving to re-energize the dojo.
>
> I look forward to more discussion at the all-dojo meeting.
>
> If, as David suggested, we agree to send an "idea file" to the entire
> dojo, just send an email to seattleschoolofaikido@yahoogroups.com. It
> will go to all 23 people signed up.
>
> If any of your students have not yet signed up, have them send an
> email to seattleschoolofaikido-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> (the above subscription info is on our website)
>
> If you would like to send an email to yudansha, send it to
> ssayudansha@yahoogroups.com. Most of still prefer to reply-to an old
> email, but this is always an option.
>
> -Rupert
>
>
>
>
> -Rupert
>
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "David Kaplan" <davidmkaplan@...>
> To: "'Jain Rutherford'" <jainr@...>,"'John Peng'"
> <johnpengmd@...>,"'Joe Ewing'" <jbe-kkr@...>
> CC:
> il.com>,<fjvega@...>,<vkgadi@...>
> Subject: RE: John's ideas - & All-Dojo Meeting
> ate: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 13:33:13 -0700
>
> This is great. Discussion. Perhaps it would be useful to put these
> and other thoughts together for input through the website Yahoo list
> so that all the people in the Dojo (at least those who have signed up)

> can think about them prior to the meeting. It wouldn't take but a bit

> of trimming from the existing e-mails here to create an "idea file"
> that can be circulated as it is used.
>
> Thanks for taking the time to articulate your ideas, John.
>
> David
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: Jain Rutherford [mailto:jainr@...]
> Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 1:09 PM
> To: John Peng; 'Joe Ewing'
> Cc: rupertberk@...; allankaplan@...;
> CPurdy@...; davidmkaplan@...; jkell@...;
> lmortensen@...; mikeu1@...;
> robbypellett@...; zeesyzygy@...; fjvega@...;
> vkgadi@...
> Subject: Re: John's ideas - & All-Dojo Meeting
>
>
>
> Thanks for all the ideas, John. This is good fodder for the all dojo
> meeting. Brainstorming and "thinking outside the box" are what we
> need to do to get re-energized and re-vitalized.
>
>
>
> Looking forward to an interesting discussion with everyone.
>
>
>
> Jain
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: John Peng <mailto:johnpengmd@...>
>
> To: 'Joe Ewing' <mailto:jbe-kkr@...>
>
> Cc: Jain.Rutherford@... ; rupertberk@... ;
> allankaplan@... ; CPurdy@... ;
> davidmkaplan@... ; jkell@... ;
> lmortensen@... ; mikeu1@... ;
> robbypellett@... ; zeesyzygy@... ; fjvega@...
> ; jainr@... ; vkgadi@...
>
> Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 12:39 PM
>
> Subject: RE: John's ideas - & All-Dojo Meeting
>
>
>
> David k and I chatted after class today, and thought that perhaps
> "free 1st month" may trivialize the value of it, and perhaps some
> nominal fee like $20 might hold more weight with potential students.
> Either way (cost or free), the principle is the same: get people to
> walk in the doors and step on the mat. Once on the mat, the hope is
> that our sense of community, energy, and enthusiasm keeps them coming
> back begging for more.
>
>
>
> We need to lead them like ushiro.tempt the with the rear hand,
> encourage them to come around and actually try to grab it. If the
> hand holds no energy or no intent, then there is really no reason to
> pursue it.
>
>
>
> Let's get students pursuing the training in that way. Subtle.
> Teasing.
> Provocative. Interesting. Challenging but not impossible.
> Exciting
> without being intimidating. We need to be open enough to allow people

> to flow into our space at their own sense of time and intensity, and
> then stay open so they stay in that moment.
>
>
>
> I could go on and on, but I think I've made my points.
>
>
>
> Thanks to all who actually read the whole thing. :-)
>
>
>
> - john
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>
> From: Joe Ewing [mailto:jbe-kkr@...]
> Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 7:43 AM
> To: johnpengmd@...
> Cc: Jain.Rutherford@...; rupertberk@...;
> allankaplan@...; CPurdy@...;
> davidmkaplan@...; jkell@...;
> lmortensen@...; mikeu1@...;
> robbypellett@...; zeesyzygy@...; fjvega@...;
> jainr@...; vkgadi@...; johnpengmd@...
> Subject: Re: John's ideas - & All-Dojo Meeting
>
>
>
> Wow, John. You go. This is chockful of ideas I would love to talk
> about with you all.
>
>
>
> I also talked to Lori - She'll do a poster for our State of the Dojo
> meeting
> - and she has a perspective to offer of someone who can't come as much

> as she'd like. -- Kim
>
>
>
> On Sat, 1 Oct 2005 22:01:27 -0700 "John Peng"
> <johnpengmd@...>
> writes:
>
>
>
> So, I've been contemplating our current state of affairs, and forgive
> me in advance, as this will be a fairly lengthy reply.
>
>
>
> First, I wanted to thank jan, jain, Christy, and mike for running the
> beginner's series since eric left. I think jan and jain deserve
> particularly strong praise for constraining their own
> training/practice time for the benefit of new beginners. I know
> Christy and mike still do their own early morning thing, but I believe

> jan and jain were solely doing beginner's series for the past few
> years, and it is to be commended.
>
>
>
> Having said that, I do think that the beginners series should end.
>
>
>
> Let me back up and say that if we view our financials and ask
> ourselves "why is membership down?" (we know rent is going up). "what

> do we offer the seattle aikido community that makes us unique enough
> for people to come here?" "how can we boost membership, particularly
> and specifically by attracting new students?" "how can we encourage
> people to even walk in the door, and then, how can we encourage them
> to stay long term in our community?"
>
>
>
> So, I believe the strength and uniqueness of our aikido
> community/school is the diversity of our yudansha. Yet, by limiting
> beginners/new students to the beginners only classes, we also limit
> their exposure to the various yudansha that make our school unique.
> This wouldn't be a problem if all our yudansha could come to each
> others' classes, but we know logistically that that is very
> difficult/impossible. Thus, it would benefit prospective students to
> be able to attend any and all classes. I strongly believe we should
> NOT be limiting beginners to any classes, but in fact, we should be
> encouraging them to attend ALL classes. Indeed, it costs us nothing
> to have more people in our classes.in fact if I could, I would pay
> people out of my pocket to attend because it raises the energy per
> class.
>
>
>
> Here is my proposal:
>
>
>
> Let's offer for beginners only FIRST MONTH OF TRAINING FREE, ATTEND AS

> MANY CLASSES AS YOU WISH! That's right, first month FREE. It costs
> us nothing (that is to say, we are going to be training anyway), but
> the potential upside is huge. Think about it.we usually allow
> visiting aikidoka to train for free 1 time, and then charge them mat
> fees thereafter. Why not allow people who are on the fence about even

> starting aikido the chance to sample it at our school at no risk to
> them.
>
>
>
> Moreover, by knowing that people are training for FREE, it encourages
> the yudansha that run the classes to keep the classes fresh,
> interesting, and engaging for all of our students, because we are
> trying to encourage them to stay long term. We want to excite,
> energize, and motivate people to WANT to train. We want to tease them

> by showing them the skills they COULD acquire through diligent
> training. We do NOT want them to do 4 weeks of a limited curriculum
> and have them think aikido is just basic movement.we want them to
> IMAGINE THEMSELVES TRAINING AT HIGHER LEVELS!
>
>
>
> All of us yudansha modify our classes to the level of our students.
> We
> always have. Nothing really changes. It does require that we pay
> selective attention to the beginners in our classes, and not totally
> intimidate them by doing koshi nage on day 1, but I believe we are
> aware enough of that.
>
>
>
> Using the example of this "soft ukemi craze" that frank and jan are
> doing, let me say that the allure of that training is that aikidoka
> that have been fearful of high falls can do 1 hour if that training
> and FEEL LIKE THEY CAN DO IT! They realize they can't do it all the
> time, and they need a special "set up" to allow it to happen, but it
> energizes people into wanting to train so they can get that "good
> feeling" more often! Or as david would say, "doing aikido makes me
> feel beautiful". Well, I want all of us that train to not only have
> that feeling, but try and recreate that in our potential new community

> members.
>
>
>
> We need people to walk in our front doors folks. Lets make it as easy

> as possible. I feel totally confident that after 1 month of exciting
> energizing creative training that we can encourage them to be members
> thereafter. Give them a free taste, and hook them for life.
>
>
>
> We can even go a step further financially and create a profit
> sharing plan
> for our community members. Have it a benefit of training more.
> Here's what
> I propose:
>
>
>
> At the end of the year, if we have made more that 10% net profit, we
> give
> that back in the form of dividend/dues refunds to an itemized split
> of ALL
> COMMUNITY MEMBERS WHO HAVE TRAINED AT LEAST 50 CLASSES FOR THE YEAR.
> What I
> mean is, if you disinclude yudansha (because we don't pay dues), and
> you
> exclude people who attend less than 4 classes/month, you split the
> profits
> with the rest on a per class basis.
>
>
>
> Example:
>
> Annual Income for 2006= $21,000
>
> Expense = $20,000.
>
>
>
> net = $1000. 10% of net = $100 into the dojo savings account.
>
>
>
> $900 available for dues rebates.
>
>
>
> If we had 50 eligible people attend a total of 450 classes, we could
> offer a
> $2 per class rebate to people. Which is to say, the more you train,
> the
> more you could get back. So If I attended 100 classes for the year,
> I would
> earn back $200 in dues. THE MORE I TRAIN, THE MORE POTENTIAL I HAVE
> FOR
> GETTING A REBATE!
>
>
>
> We could of course adjust these figures to meet our needs, but the
> principle
> is to incentivize members for training, so that the more they train,
> the
> greater potential they have of seeing a financial return. Super
> casual
> people do not benefit, but hardcore community members really gain.
>
>
>
> This also encourages community members to get their friends to
> train,
> because the better the dojo does financially, the better we all do.
> The
> more students we have, the greater chance we have of seeing monthly
> dues
> decrease. THIS IS IN FACT HOW A CO-OP IS SUPPOSED TO BE RUN.
> Strength in
> numbers, share the wealth.
>
>
>
> I realize that some of these ideas seem revolutionary, but we are
> NOT in it
> for the money. We are here to train aikido, each for our own
> viable
> reasons. We all have our own separate goals and agendas, but I
> would hazard
> a guess to say that we would all love to see more people in each
> class.
>
>
>
> So in summary, my thoughts are:
>
>
>
> 1. end the beginners series as it stands.
> 2. all new dojo members get their first month of training
> FREE, for any
> and all classes. Encourage them to train with as many instructors
> as they
> can and in as many classes as they can.
> 3. yudansha: energize your classes, your training, and
> yourselves so
> we can show off what makes our school unique. Don't feel
> constrained. By
> working on what you want to work on, your potential long term
> students get a
> vision of what motivates you to continue training, and how you keep
> it going
> year after year after year. They get a role model for how to
> practice
> lifelong aikido that is fresh, fun, and invigorating.
> 4. profit sharing for dues paying members. The more you
> train, the
> more you could get back at the end of the year.
>
>
>
> Thank you all for listening, and discuss, please. :-)
>
>
>
> - john
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>
> From: Rutherford, Jain [mailto:Jain.Rutherford@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 8:02 AM
> To: Rupert Berk (rupertberk@...); Allan Kaplan
> (allankaplan@...); Christy Purdy; David Kaplan
> (davidmkaplan@...); Jan Keller; John Peng; Laura Mortensen;
> Mike
> U.@home; Robby Pellett; Zenith (zeesyzygy@...); Francisca
> Vega
> (fjvega@...); jain; kim roberts
> Subject: FW: Updated Sept Board minutes
>
>
>
> Here's the final version of the Yudansha/board meeting minutes from
> Kim.
>
> Jain
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Ewing [mailto:jbe-kkr@...]
> Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2005 7:52 AM
> To: cpurdy@...; fjvega@...; Rutherford, Jain;
> jainr@...; mike.ullmann@...;
> mikeu1@...;
> zenith_san@...
>
> Subject: Sept Board minutes
>
>
>
> Here they are! Please review and suggest changes.
>
> A delight to be with you all, as always. - Kim
>
>
>
>