Everyone has given great answers regarding hip drop. Good scientific
bio-mechanical reasoning. I'm just wondering if it was "information overload"
for Steve who asked about it in the first place. We understand it all because
we've been doing it forever but I think Steve must be a newbie or he wouldn't be
asking about it in the first place.

The "art of coaching" is the part where a good coach can explain everything that
was said but in clear layman's terms so the athlete can understand and then
apply what coach said.

I have found that sometimes I have to have a new racewalker overemphasize the
hip drop motion and hip rotation so they get the FEEL of racewalking as opposed
to just fast walking. A good exercise I have them do is to cross their arms
with hands on their shoulders and then walk utilizing the hips, really
exaggerating the motion of the hips, so that they get the FEEL of the hip
rotation. Its utilized as a drill.

But I always explain that true hip rotation and so-called "hip drop" happens
very quickly and should not be forced when actually training. I got the feeling
from Steve's question that he thinks its something that lasts a short while and
he will feel it and then can do something about it. Alot of new rwers I coach
have that same idea as well.

In coaching elite collegiate race walkers and local masters I have found there
are two types of new walkers:

one-those who have the correct form and technique already, good hip rotation, it
just comes naturally to them.
two-those who have no hip rotation, they walk fast but are not racewalking, and
despite my best cajoling, can't master the hip rotation aspect. I put them
through drills, stretching routines that would make any yogi jealous, force them
to watch endless video of elite walkers, I've even made some guys take salsa
dance classes with their wives to learn to loosen their hips!, but alas, some
never master the technique. It is at that point I sit them down and have a
serious talk about reality and perhaps adjusting goals.

I guess the conclusion I've come to is that either someone can do it or they
can't. Not everyone was meant to racewalk at an elite level because it does
have a specific technique component. If you have to think about it then its
going to be harder for you. If someone wants to "racewalk" for fun and fitness,
thats one thing, but to employ all the high end bio-, physio-, techno- elements
that have been mentioned, I think you probably already have the basic form and
technique in your repetoire.

Its like karaoke. Lots of cats try but it only comes naturally to a select few.
I know I suck at karaoke, no amount of vocal lessons 'gonna change that, but at
least I'm realistic about my ability, and just have fun with it. :)

Chris






>
> Steve Patat:
>
> I am still trying to understand hip drop. When I make my stride I do get
> a
> feel that I am getting hip rotation(back and forward movement). I am not
> sure my stride is longer in the rear. I get no feel for the hips moving
> up
> and down.(Sometimes I get a feeling they move out. I try to keep that at
> a
> minimum.) So I do not think I have any hip drop. I am reading Jeff's new
> book which has a very detailed description of how the hips should move.
> I am
> just not sure why the hip drops. Could someone take a shot and explain
> why
> the hip should drop? Should it be a noticeable movement and is it
> something
> that should come as a natural movement or should I try to create the
> drop?
> Also, is it something I should be concerned about? Again, I thank all
> for
> your help.
>
>
>
> Tom Eastler:
>
> Don't create a hip drop!!!! It takes us years to retrain those who have
> exaggerated hip drop to minimize it. There is no advantage to having hip
> drop...since the hip that "drops" in single support phase (standing on
> just one leg) is the unsupported hip which is supposed to be rotating
> forward and bringing the unsupported leg with it, and the more that hip
> drops the higher one has to lift the unsupported leg to get the foot to
> swing through with the leg. Hence more drop equals more knee bend and
> less rotation of hip girdle around the spine (so called "hip
> rotation"). It is the "hip rotation" that allows us to gain inches per
> stride over having no rotation at all (like so many, many racewalkers).
> Hip drop is anathema (highly accursed). The sway that Jeff mentions
> occurs when in the single support phase ever so slightly with or without
> hip drop....when it occurs with hip drop id is often exaggerated and is
> doubly cursed...it serves no useful purpose in that case and tends to
> direct muscular energy in the wrong direction (sideways).
>
>
>
> Michael Roth:
>
> To further what Tom said, any excess hip movement (up, down, in, out) is
> the
> result of poor mechanics caused by weak glute, hip & core muscles and
> accentuated by poor coaching.
>
>
>
> Brent Bohlen:
>
> I've been thinking about this some. Here are my thoughts on the purpose
> of the hip drop: The hip drop is on the side opposite the straightened
> leg, but first let's think about the hip on the side of the body where
> the leg is straightened at the time of heel strike. As the body moves
> over the straightened leg, the hip on that side of the body necessarily
> rises. Imagine that the straightened leg is a board. Visualize placing
> one end of the board on the ground and holding the board so it is not
> quite vertical (just as your leg is not quite vertical at heel strike).
> Then visualize moving the board into a vertical position (just as your
> leg moves to vertical as your body moves forward over the leg). As you
> move the board into a vertical position, the top end of the board will
> move farther from the ground until the board is vertical, and then will
> move closer to the ground as the board moves past vertical. This is
> exactly what the hip does on the straightened leg side of the body.
>
> Now let's think about the other side of the body, where the leg is
> advancing from behind the body. Let's assume that you don't have any hip
> drop and that side of the hip stays parallel with the hip on
> straightened-leg side of the body. If you do that, then your whole body
> will rise as your straightened-leg hip rises. You will be spending
> energy moving your center of gravity up. This is wasted energy.
>
> But, if you allow your hip to drop on the advancing-leg side of the body
> by exactly the same amount that your hip rises on the straightened-leg
> side of the body, the point in the middle of your body between the two
> hips will not rise. Consequently, your center of gravity will remain the
> same distance from the ground all through the stride. You won't waste
> energy moving your center of gravity up and down (and your head will
> move parallel to the ground, not bounce up and down like a runner or
> jogger), and you can focus your energy on moving your body forward. Thus
> the proper hip drop makes you a more efficient racewalker.
>
>
>
> Dave McGovern:
>
>
>
> From The Complete Guide to Racewalking (1998)
>
> A hip drop should occur naturally after push-off: As the rear leg comes
> forward,
>
> and the foot loses contact with the ground, the hip is no longer
> supported so it
>
> drops slightly. This natural effect does not need to be learned,
> exaggerated,
>
> or fretted over. I don't know why so many coaches bother confusing
> their
>
> athletes by talking about it.
>
>
> I'll probably have more to say on the subject in my forthcoming book,
> The
> Complete Guide to Competive Walking (2009, I hope!) The only thing I
> would add
> now is that not only is the advancing hip not supported by that leg,
> that leg
> also weighs about 30-35 lbs. and is hanging from that side of the hip so
> it
> causes it to drop down. If you have a lot of lower back flexibility and
> relatively loose pelvic ligaments, the hip will drop a lot, if you
> don't, it
> won't End of story. Put your effort into pelvic rotation, not drop.
>
>
>
> Tim Seaman:
>
> The section that you are referring to is on page 19-21 in Race Walk
> Clinic - in
> a Book, and while the diagrams might make it seem that there is a lot of
> "drop",
> in fact, the goal is to limit the drop as much as possible. We are just
> showing
> you what the hip does, and although it is a big diagram, it is actually
> a very
> small "drop".
>
> It is impossible to limit all of the drop because as the swing leg comes
> forward
> the hip is more relaxed and it does drop slightly. The more side to side
> or up
> and down movement you have, the less eficient you will become. You want
> to
> think about the hips moving forward and you want to work on the
> flexibility of
> the hip flexors so that the rear foot will be able to stay on the ground
> longer.
> If the hips have excessive hip "drop" we do give you some exercises to
> correct
> this and other hip issues in Chapter 6.
>
> If you look at the picture of Denis Nizhegorodov on page 19, you will
> see superb
> hip flexor flexibility. The reason that we chose that picture was
> because you
> can see the rear foot on the ground very far behind the body and you can
> see the
> opposite hip is still coming forward.
>
> You should not think about the hip dropping at all, only moving forward.
> The
> hip will drop slightly naturally.
>
>
>
> Ray Sharp:
>
> I'm, going to have to agree with Mr. Bohlen and disagree with all the
> other
> esteemed commentators, successful athletes, coaches and learned racewalk
> scholars all. I accept their verdict and would not recommend that anyone
> follow my advice when the preponderance of opinion is in the other
> direction. My ideas are outdated, as I formed them while training with
> the
> Mexican team in 1980 - eons ago!
>
> But!!! The reason I think hip drop is something important to think about
> is
> this - the straight, supporting leg, when at vertical, is longer than
> the
> bent leg swinging forward. It is desirable to bend the advancing leg
> quite a
> bit, not as much as a runner does, but enough to shorten the lever and
> make
> the foot get forward quicker. If the hips are level, the foot will come
> through too high, which is inefficient because the center of gravity is
> raised, and also because it gives the appearance of lifting. The best
> walkers, at least the ones who appear legal, have flexible hips that
> include
> some vertical motion along with the front to back motion and the
> rotation at
> the spine the causes the feet to land in line. To repeat, the purpose of
> the
> hip drop as the leg swings forward, and the shoulder drop on the other
> side
> that happens naturally for balance, is to allow foot of the swinging leg
> to
> stay low, skimming just above the ground, and then the leg flicks
> straight
> at the instant of contact and the hip begins to rise. A point on the hip
> joint moves in all three planes - front to back, up and down, and across
> the
> body like a sine curve seen from above. Ignoring the last of these for a
> second, think about it in 2 dimensions: The hip will move in a curve
> like
> the sine curve or more accurately like one of those cycloid things. But
> let's simplify further, by fixing the walker on a treadmill so we can
> just
> look at the motion in 2 dimensions relative to the walker's center. OK,
> it's
> an ellipse (oval), with both a front to back and an up and down motion.
>
> Now, to the place we can all agree on - if you increase your front to
> back
> motion, the ellipse will be longer than it is tall, and your stride
> length
> will increase.
>
>
>
> Dave McGovern:
>
> I don't think anyone is disagreeing that hip-drop exists or has its
> place.
> The point is that it shouldn't be forced or overemphasized. Your
> analysis of
> the bent knee driving forward and the need to keep the foot low to the
> ground are correct. But you're missing the action of the foot itself.
> When
> the feet are used properly (when the athlete pushes all the way to the
> toes
> and the rear foot leaves the ground oriented vertically/perpendicular to
> the
> ground) the foot will come through and under the body toes pointed down.
> This allows for a great deal of knee bend (about 90 degrees) with the
> toes
> coming through only millimeters above the surface of the road or track.
> Athletes who have a lot of natural hip-drop (Philip Dunn) can bring the
> foot
> through with the foot in a less-than toes-down orientation (Philip
> brings
> his foot through parallel to the ground when it's under his body.) But
> this
> comes back to Ray's statement that knee drive is important for speed.
> Philip
> has a very smooth style, and his amazing amount of hip mobility is a big
> part of it. But his legs drive through much straighter than those of
> most of
> his competitors, so he's throwing a longer lever with more apparent
> mass.
> Lack of sufficient knee bend (related to foot orientation under the
> body)
> could explain why Philip's mile/3k/5k/10k and even 20k times never
> matched
> the level of his great 50k success.
>
> Ray Sharp:
>
> With the proper foot action at push off, the hip, thigh and knee will
> begin
> driving forward in the last instants before the toe rolls to the end and
> leaves the ground. I don't mean that the knee will bend early, because
> driving the hip and knee back are the key to power and stride length.
> But
> just at the end, the hip and knee will snap forward just a few
> milliseconds
> perhaps before the toe leaves the ground. In a simplified version, the
> leg
> is like a pendulum, but the truth is much more complex, and the impulse
> of
> the forward motion begins with the core muscles to the hip flexors and
> so on
> down the chain in a crack the whip type motion, with the hip and knee
> moving
> forward slightly sooner than the toe. That means the toe will "drag"
> forward
> pointing down, a bit behind or out of phase. Just before heel impact,
> the
> toe will be pulled up by the muscles on the front of the shin, ankle and
> foot, while (guess what) the hip and knee have begun their backwards
> path,
> still slightly ahead of the foot, which is moving forward. This means
> the
> knee will have moved back (relative to the walker, not relative to the
> ground) enough to straighten the leg as the heel strikes.
>
> These are complicated motions. We simplify them so we can explain them
> to
> other people, and also so we can focus on a few key points when we walk.
> When I have too much hip drop, like when I am tiring and my body is
> "sagging" and sinking too much into the hyper-extended knee by rolling
> too
> much along the outside of the foot, it makes the shoulder of my forward
> swinging arm drop too much and pulls my head to that side, giving me a
> side
> to side motion that the coaches and judges (Dave, Tom, Jeff, Tim,
> Michael)
> want us to avoid. If thinking about hip drop causes excessive side to
> side
> motion, it should be discouraged or dampened a little bit. Obviously,
> forward motion is the goal.
>
> If you think back to Ernesto Canto, he had a very quick and efficient
> motion
> with the knee bent quite a lot on the recovering leg, but his head went
> side
> to side. I think Jefferson Perez and the current women's Olympic
> champion
> (afraid I'll spell her name wrong) are better models, because they
> achieve
> the desired hip motion without much head motion.
>
>
>
> Dave McGovern: Hip Drop - how to tell if you have it
>
> Put on a shirt that is a very different color than your walking shorts.
> Tuck the shirt in. This creates a roughly horizontal line between your
> shorts and your shirts that is easy to see. If you wear the waist band
> at or above the top edge of the hip bones (pelvic girdle), pull the
> shorts down a little so the waist band goes across the top edge of the
> hip bones. The goal is to have the line between you shorts and your
> shirt to be on the top portion of your hips. Have a friend/spouse/coach
> observe you from behind while you are race walking away from them. If
> you have any hip drop, the observer should see the up/down motion of the
> line between your shorts and your shirt. As a side benefit, you can
> detect the dreaded hip sway (side to side movement) from these
> observations too - just concentrate on the outside edge of either hip.
>
> Hip rotation is easy to see too especially if you have access to a
> treadmill. If you have a pair of shorts or warmup pants with a vertical
> stripe down each side, wear those. Otherwise paperclip a small white
> square to the waist band on each side of your shorts. Tuck your shirt
> in, and position the waist band as described above for detecting hip
> drop. Have a friend/spouse/coach observe you from the side while race
> walking. Because your body stays in the same place while walking on the
> treadmill, any forward and back movement of the vertical stripe or white
> square is easy to see. You can still see it from a race walker going by,
> but it will take a few times for a novice observer to see it, because
> the race walkers body is moving too, and the hip rotation motion is
> relative to the race walkers body. If the amount of forward motion looks
> different than the amount of backwards motion, have the observer move to
> the other side. This difference could be real, or it could be an
> illusion. As a side benefit, you can see the relative sizes of the "in
> front of the body" portion of the stride and the "behind the body"
> portion of the stride.
>
> If you do either of these on a treadmill, it makes it easier for the
> observer, because the body of the race walker is not moving away from
> the observer and the background objects are not changing. This gives the
> observer a longer time to detect what is going on -- very useful for a
> novice observer.
>
> If the observer records what they see with a video camera, you'll be
> able to see it too.
>
>
>
>
>
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>