according to another site i was browsing in beltran has already
signed with the yankees

is this forum free to join???

Blanked 'em!  Let's shoot for a .500 season next week.

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, rocketstars-inc@w...
wrote:
> GO TEXANS !!!
>

GO TEXANS !!!



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dec. 27, 2004, 1:39AM
Beltran impressed by Steinbrenner, Yanks
Associated Press

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico — Carlos Beltran was impressed by George
Steinbrenner after meeting with the Yankees owner earlier in the
week, and told a newspaper in Puerto Rico that he would not be
intimidated by playing in New York.


The free-agent All-Star center fielder who led the Houston Astros
within one win of their first World Series, talked with Steinbrenner
in Tampa, Fla., on Tuesday.

"The meeting with Steinbrenner was very good," Beltran said in a
story published in Friday's edition of Primera Hora newspaper. "He
is a professional person, super-educated. I've let them know my
interest, and they have interest, too, about me joining their team."

The Yankees — and Astros — clearly will have some competition in the
race for the prized outfielder. Beltran said the New York Mets,
Detroit Tigers and Chicago Cubs have also shown interest.

"The Mets have been very aggressive," he said. "So far, they haven't
made any offers. I think we'll have a meeting very soon to talk
personally."

No meeting with the Mets is scheduled, but will probably take place
the week of Jan. 23.

Beltran thinks he would be prepared to play in a high-profile
baseball environment, such as New York.

"In all the places, when you do something good, the people applaud
you. When you do something bad, they boo you," he said. "That
happens in all the big league parks."

The All-Star outfielder batted .417 in the NL championship series
for the Astros with four home runs, five RBIs and four steals after
hitting .455 with four homers and nine RBIs in the division series.
If Houston doesn't reach an agreement by Jan. 8, the Astros would be
ineligible to re-sign him until May 1.

"As a baseball player, I want to be treated fairly — based on what
I've done in my career," Beltran said. "Of course, the opportunity
to win is bigger than the economic thing. I want to be part of a
winning team. I will consider every team."

To all of you, Merry Christmas. And if you're not Christian, there's
still no reason you can't have a good day today. Wish my a happy
your day, and I'll wish you a happy mine: Merry Christmas, and may
it be spent warm and snug with your family!

The sky is not falling. Yet.

On the pitching front: Yeah, it's a little dodgy, but all is not lost. Pettitte
should be back and healthy, and Brandon Backe is still around and young enough
to be a workhorse. Acting like Miller was a must-have is a mistake. He hasn't
pitched since June, and even then he was 7-7 with an ERA over 3. Yeah, maybe
it's because he was hurt, but then, how are his first few games back going to
be? Right. What we really need to do is work on getting some middle relief.

On the Kent front: Move Biggio to second base, put clutch hitter Lamb in left,
save 11 million dollars to give to Beltran. Done and done.

On Beltran: we've offered him $16 million for six years, and, maybe more
critically, we've offered to make him the face of the Astros. If he doesn't take
it, he's a moron and we can do better for less. There's been a lot of talk that
the Astros aren't making a "serious" play to keep Beltran, but in the end, we
don't have a Steinbrenner budget, and we can't replace him with the new young
thing when he tears his ACL playing flag football in two years (damn you,
Berkman). The Astros are being aggressive, but sensible. Maybe it's not
exciting, but they are looking to the good of the franchise.

So. Worry about relief pitching and prepare to hate Beltran's guts for being a
weasel if he goes to the Yanks. But don't write off the 'stros yet.



texas_musician <texas_musician@...> wrote:

It's not even a rebuilding phase. If it were, we'd still have
Miller, he's young enough! Grrr...

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, "A.J.G"
<aaron_girdner@y...> wrote:
>
> This is turning out to be a horrendous offseason.  I'm confused as
to
> what's really going on: Does Drayton want a championship team or
just
> a silly contender (the role we usually play)?  If the Astros'
Brass is
> in a rebuilding phase, which I can understand, why toy with us?
Just
> let the Yanks take Beltran; Clemens can retire; and the Astros can
> fight for second/last place in the NL Central.
>
> Honestly, I can't see what incentives the Astros have that would
make
> Beltran want to come back.  If he wants to be part of a REAL,
> competitive team, he may as well sign with the Yankees -- spare us
the
> drama.  Besides, at this point, with the loss of Kent and Miller --
> plus the signings of some questionable players -- even if Beltran
> signed with us, our team would be 'Okay/Better than Okay' at best,
IMO.
>
> Seeing as we haven't gone after any quality players besides Beltran
> and Clemens, I've come to the conclusion that we are
> dead-in-the-water.  Maybe something spectacular will happen in the
New
> Year, but I doubt it.  So, Texas_Musician, I too am becoming a
> defeatist.  Hopefully, we are wrong.  Depending on how this
offseason
> turns out, I may never care much for the 'Stros.  It seems as
though
> the Astros' front office lets its fans down.  They are banking too
> much on Clemens and Beltran.  If they were serious about a
> championship team, they wouldn't just pursue those two guys -- it's
> too much of a risk.
>
> To sum it up, I think Drayton is going to make 'a significant
offer'
> to Beltran (but that's it).  If he bites, good for the Astros.  If
he
> doesn't, the Astros will rebuild this season, allowing Lane, Burke,
> and a few others to get some solid playing time.  Either way,
since we
> didn't go after anybody new, our team is still going to have its
> problems; and we may, or may not, win the Central -- at best, a
repeat
> of last year.  Unfortunately, I think it's going to be harder for
the
> Astros to get the Wild Card this season.  The Dodgers and Giants
will
> battle it out for the NL West title; while the Braves will win its,
> and St. Louis will take the Central, again.  The NL West's 2nd
Place
> team will probably be the Wild Card.
>
> Okay, I've written enough.  I'm getting depressed thinking about
the
> possible future of the Astros.




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________________________________
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www.nevernevermind.blogspot.com

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dec. 23, 2004, 1:43AM

Beltran shown the money
Astros sparing no expense over coveted free agent
By JOSE DE JESUS ORTIZ
Copyright 2004 Houston Chronicle


The only thing missing was the Brinks truck. Armed with a "very
substantial offer," letters from some of Houston's top civic
leaders, a video presentation and a book outlining the virtues of
Houston living, Astros owner Drayton McLane gave his recruiting
speech to All-Star center fielder Carlos Beltran for two hours
Wednesday.


McLane, Astros general manager Tim Purpura and president of baseball
operations Tal Smith hosted Beltran and his agent, Scott Boras, at
the team's spring training facility in Kissimmee, Fla. After a tour,
McLane ushered the parties to the conference room to make his offer
and recruiting pitch a day after Yankees owner George Steinbrenner
led a similar meeting with Boras and Beltran in Tampa, Fla.

Although the Astros declined to divulge the offer, industry sources
say Beltran's price topped $16 million per year based on the offers
he has received and the current market. It is clear the Astros
offered at least a six-year, $96 million deal.

"It's a very, very substantial offer and one that we feel is
certainly competitive, although we have no way of knowing that,"
Purpura said.

"I think we're at a point with this negotiation where we have
entertained offers from everyone," Boras said via phone. "We're
moving at a much more rapid pace."

Drawing on some of the same techniques he used last year while
recruiting Roger Clemens, McLane emphasized the Houston community's
desire to have Beltran in an Astros uniform.

"We were just showing his great leadership and accomplishments,"
McLane said of the postseason highlight video. "And we were trying
to show him all those signs from fans saying, 'We love Carlos.' "

Beltran also received a book of about 250 e-mails the Astros have
received from fans urging the club to re-sign Beltran, who is
considered by baseball officials the top free agent.

Beltran returned to his home in Puerto Rico, and Boras returned to
his home in California on Wednesday afternoon. McLane and Purpura
expect to hear back from Boras after Christmas to resume
negotiations. The Astros have until Jan. 8 to sign Beltran or lose
all negotiating rights until May.

"I think certainly out of respect for Carlos and all of us and our
families," Purpura said, "we have agreed to put this thing aside and
spend the holidays with our families."

The Yankees have been considered the Astros' top competition for
Beltran, who hit 38 home runs with 104 RBIs and 42 stolen bases
between the Astros and Kansas City Royals this year. Beltran, 27,
saved his best for the playoffs, hitting .435 with eight home runs,
14 RBIs, nine walks and six stolen bases over 12 games while leading
the Astros within a win of the franchise's first World Series berth.

Economically, the Astros broke down the tax rate in Texas, where
there is no state income tax. New York residents pay city and state
income taxes along with their national income tax.

On the loyalty front, McLane pointed out that he has stuck by aging
veterans Craig Biggio and Jeff Bagwell, who have the majors' longest
active tenure as teammates.

"He could be the next generation," McLane said of Beltran.

McLane compared Beltran to Bagwell, who signed a five-year, $85
million deal in 2000.

"Drayton came in an addressed one issue," Boras said. "The issue is
this is one franchise player.

"He said, 'I kept a franchise player in Jeff Bagwell in Houston.
Carlos is a franchise player, and we intend to keep him in
Houston.' "

jesus.ortiz@...

It's not even a rebuilding phase. If it were, we'd still have
Miller, he's young enough! Grrr...

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, "A.J.G"
<aaron_girdner@y...> wrote:
>
> This is turning out to be a horrendous offseason.  I'm confused as
to
> what's really going on: Does Drayton want a championship team or
just
> a silly contender (the role we usually play)?  If the Astros'
Brass is
> in a rebuilding phase, which I can understand, why toy with us?
Just
> let the Yanks take Beltran; Clemens can retire; and the Astros can
> fight for second/last place in the NL Central.
>
> Honestly, I can't see what incentives the Astros have that would
make
> Beltran want to come back.  If he wants to be part of a REAL,
> competitive team, he may as well sign with the Yankees -- spare us
the
> drama.  Besides, at this point, with the loss of Kent and Miller --
> plus the signings of some questionable players -- even if Beltran
> signed with us, our team would be 'Okay/Better than Okay' at best,
IMO.
>
> Seeing as we haven't gone after any quality players besides Beltran
> and Clemens, I've come to the conclusion that we are
> dead-in-the-water.  Maybe something spectacular will happen in the
New
> Year, but I doubt it.  So, Texas_Musician, I too am becoming a
> defeatist.  Hopefully, we are wrong.  Depending on how this
offseason
> turns out, I may never care much for the 'Stros.  It seems as
though
> the Astros' front office lets its fans down.  They are banking too
> much on Clemens and Beltran.  If they were serious about a
> championship team, they wouldn't just pursue those two guys -- it's
> too much of a risk.
>
> To sum it up, I think Drayton is going to make 'a significant
offer'
> to Beltran (but that's it).  If he bites, good for the Astros.  If
he
> doesn't, the Astros will rebuild this season, allowing Lane, Burke,
> and a few others to get some solid playing time.  Either way,
since we
> didn't go after anybody new, our team is still going to have its
> problems; and we may, or may not, win the Central -- at best, a
repeat
> of last year.  Unfortunately, I think it's going to be harder for
the
> Astros to get the Wild Card this season.  The Dodgers and Giants
will
> battle it out for the NL West title; while the Braves will win its,
> and St. Louis will take the Central, again.  The NL West's 2nd
Place
> team will probably be the Wild Card.
>
> Okay, I've written enough.  I'm getting depressed thinking about
the
> possible future of the Astros.

This is turning out to be a horrendous offseason.  I'm confused as to
what's really going on: Does Drayton want a championship team or just
a silly contender (the role we usually play)?  If the Astros' Brass is
in a rebuilding phase, which I can understand, why toy with us?  Just
let the Yanks take Beltran; Clemens can retire; and the Astros can
fight for second/last place in the NL Central.

Honestly, I can't see what incentives the Astros have that would make
Beltran want to come back.  If he wants to be part of a REAL,
competitive team, he may as well sign with the Yankees -- spare us the
drama.  Besides, at this point, with the loss of Kent and Miller --
plus the signings of some questionable players -- even if Beltran
signed with us, our team would be 'Okay/Better than Okay' at best, IMO.

Seeing as we haven't gone after any quality players besides Beltran
and Clemens, I've come to the conclusion that we are
dead-in-the-water.  Maybe something spectacular will happen in the New
Year, but I doubt it.  So, Texas_Musician, I too am becoming a
defeatist.  Hopefully, we are wrong.  Depending on how this offseason
turns out, I may never care much for the 'Stros.  It seems as though
the Astros' front office lets its fans down.  They are banking too
much on Clemens and Beltran.  If they were serious about a
championship team, they wouldn't just pursue those two guys -- it's
too much of a risk.

To sum it up, I think Drayton is going to make 'a significant offer'
to Beltran (but that's it).  If he bites, good for the Astros.  If he
doesn't, the Astros will rebuild this season, allowing Lane, Burke,
and a few others to get some solid playing time.  Either way, since we
didn't go after anybody new, our team is still going to have its
problems; and we may, or may not, win the Central -- at best, a repeat
of last year.  Unfortunately, I think it's going to be harder for the
Astros to get the Wild Card this season.  The Dodgers and Giants will
battle it out for the NL West title; while the Braves will win its,
and St. Louis will take the Central, again.  The NL West's 2nd Place
team will probably be the Wild Card.

Okay, I've written enough.  I'm getting depressed thinking about the
possible future of the Astros.

Hi there,
How's it going? :-)
I just thought some of you might be interested to know, that there
is this great sports site that recently got started a few months ago
(about 1 year old to be exact), who are looking for some
knowledgeable posters, to help fill the void. It's a really friendly
community, and the people who are behind site, are extremely
friendly and helpful. The site covers everything baseball, football,
hockey, and basketball...including general forums, and off-topic
areas. I just thought I would let you know this, in case you're
interested. We  have an arcade too.

Here's the link to the site where you can reach it:

FORUMS PAGE: http://www.ptpsportsnetwork.com/forums/index.php?act=idx

Anyway, I truely appreciate your time, and courtesy. I hope you take
the time to join
Thanks! :-)

know one thing this has been a weird offseason with great players
either being let go or leaving teams

I feel attendance shrinking already. Who the hell is running this show?

texas_musician <texas_musician@...> wrote:
Have you ever known me to be a defeatist? Have I ever expressed
dismay over the Astros' prospects?

But now: Kent is gone, Miller is gone, Beltran is meeting with
Steinbrenner on Tuesday, and if the team doesn't even bring him
back, Clemens will have no motivation to stay, either.

Be realistic: Chris Burke can not and will not replace all four. He
won't even replace one of them this year! This is bad. If we
miraculously keep Clemens and Beltran, woo-hoo. But if we don't,
Pettite and Oswalt will not unto themselves a pitching staff make.
We had problems when it was just Oswalt and Clemens this year,
right? And Pettite isn't as good as Clemens! And what if he got
injured again? Starting pitching was a real problem, and it looks
like it might get worse.

Three strikes and you're out. The Astros have two, and are looking
at four.




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hate to say this boys but compelling resigning Biggio may have cost us a lot
more than the Hun

-----Original Message-----
From: jdurbinpa@... [mailto:jdurbinpa@...]
Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 7:07 AM
To: houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Houston's Brand of Baseball] I Have A Bad Feeling About
This



I agree with you on this. I will always be an astro but things are looking
bad right now. All these other teams are making moves and we are going
backwards. For everything that went good last offseason and during the
season, this
offseason has been ugly. I was not upset when they let Kent go. I know Burke
will
not equal up to Kent but he should be a solid player. I felt they would use
the money for Beltran or someone else if they had a feeling that they would
not
get Beltran. I don't think with getting rid of Miller and really not doing
anything else that we will get Beltran. The Yankees are going to win every
free
agent battle if it comes to being just about money. The only way a team like

the Astros to get a player like a Beltran is for the player to  love of the
city and to have a chance to win a world championship. Something that looks
a lot
harder to do right now. Also, no Beltran/Miller = no Clemens. They still
have
time to pull up the grade but right now the Astros have an F in my book for
the offseason.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





Yahoo! Groups Links

I agree with you on this. I will always be an astro but things are looking
bad right now. All these other teams are making moves and we are going
backwards. For everything that went good last offseason and during the season,
this
offseason has been ugly. I was not upset when they let Kent go. I know Burke
will
not equal up to Kent but he should be a solid player. I felt they would use
the money for Beltran or someone else if they had a feeling that they would not
get Beltran. I don't think with getting rid of Miller and really not doing
anything else that we will get Beltran. The Yankees are going to win every free
agent battle if it comes to being just about money. The only way a team like
the Astros to get a player like a Beltran is for the player to  love of the
city and to have a chance to win a world championship. Something that looks a
lot
harder to do right now. Also, no Beltran/Miller = no Clemens. They still have
time to pull up the grade but right now the Astros have an F in my book for
the offseason.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Have you ever known me to be a defeatist? Have I ever expressed
dismay over the Astros' prospects?

But now: Kent is gone, Miller is gone, Beltran is meeting with
Steinbrenner on Tuesday, and if the team doesn't even bring him
back, Clemens will have no motivation to stay, either.

Be realistic: Chris Burke can not and will not replace all four. He
won't even replace one of them this year! This is bad. If we
miraculously keep Clemens and Beltran, woo-hoo. But if we don't,
Pettite and Oswalt will not unto themselves a pitching staff make.
We had problems when it was just Oswalt and Clemens this year,
right? And Pettite isn't as good as Clemens! And what if he got
injured again? Starting pitching was a real problem, and it looks
like it might get worse.

Three strikes and you're out. The Astros have two, and are looking
at four.

Miller not offered contract by Astros

December 20, 2004
HOUSTON (AP) -- The Houston Astros cut injured pitcher Wade Miller
when they did not offer him a 2005 contract by Monday's deadline.

Miller was 7-7 with a 3.35 ERA in 15 starts this year before going
on the disabled list June 29 with a season-ending rotator cuff
injury. He becomes a free agent Tuesday.

In his first two full seasons with the Astros, Miller was 31-12 from
2001-02. He pitched through right forearm pain in 2003, but still
went 14-13 with a 4.13 ERA in 33 starts.

When the Astros signed Roger Clemens and Andy Pettitte last
offseason, the 28-year-old Miller was dropped to the No. 4 spot in
the rotation behind those two and Roy Oswalt.

The Astros offered contracts to Oswalt (20-10, 3.49 ERA in 36
games), outfielder Lance Berkman, infielder Mike Lamb and right-
handed pitchers Brandon Duckworth, Pete Munro, and Tim Redding.

Berkman has hit .303 for the Astros with 156 home runs and 535 RBIs
the past six seasons. Lamb, acquired from the New York Yankees in
March, hit .288 with 14 home runs and 58 RBIs in 2004.

Duckworth was 1-2 with a 6.86 ERA for the Astros in 2004. Munro was
4-7 with a 5.15 ERA in 21 games in 2004, and Redding went 5-7 with a
5.72 ERA.

Updated on Monday, Dec 20, 2004 10:12 pm EST

Baseball fans, don't forget to tune in LIVE online,
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Artie recap all the Hot Stove activity, right here at
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show and we'll read your thoughts on the air--sound
off on Mulder, Hudson, Pedro, Sexson, Sosa,
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est.

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I read the 'Stros weere pondering Wade Miller for Carlos Lee (before Lee was
traded to MIL).  Thoughts?

-----Original Message-----
From: texas_musician [mailto:texas_musician@...]
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2004 1:39 AM
To: houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Houston's Brand of Baseball] HouChron: Astros face decision on
whether to retain Miller




Dec. 18, 2004, 1:03AM

Astros face decision on whether to retain Miller
Righthander's shoulder injury has team mulling options carefully
By BRIAN MCTAGGART
Copyright 2004 Houston Chronicle

As the Monday deadline approaches to tender contracts to major-
league players under a team's control, the Astros are weighing the
pros and cons of bringing back righthanded pitcher Wade Miller for
next season.

Miller, who went 7-7 with a 3.35 ERA last season but didn't pitch
after June 25 because of a frayed rotator cuff, is eligible for
arbitration but isn't expected to begin throwing off a mound until
next month.

The Astros don't want to go to arbitration with Miller, who doesn't
want to be non-tendered considering he's trying to come back from a
shoulder injury.

Miller avoided arbitration last year by agreeing to a one-year, $3.4
million deal for 2004, a $2,875,000 raise over the $525,000 he made
in 2003.

Monday's 11 p.m. deadline will affect other arbitration-eligible
players such as Lance Berkman, Roy Oswalt, Pete Munro, Tim Redding,
Brandon Duckworth and Mike Lamb.

If those players aren't tendered contracts through which the parties
at least hope to exchange arbitration figures, they will become free
agents.

"You're always trying to look at who to keep on the roster and who
to take off the roster," Purpura said. "Those are important
decisions."

Players such as Berkman and Oswalt are no-brainers to be tendered
contracts, but Miller's injury puts the Astros in a difficult spot.

Miller, 28, has been a workhorse for the Astros, winning at least 14
games in three consecutive seasons from 2001-03. But he began
experiencing pain in his shoulder June 15 of this year in a start
against the Chicago Cubs and made just two more starts before
shutting it down for the season.

Although he didn't have surgery, the Astros have received promising
news from team doctors regarding Miller's prognosis. Because he
won't begin throwing until January, the Astros will have to make a
decision on him by relying on MRIs and physical exams.

"It's tough, just because you don't have enough information,
particularly in Wade's case," Purpura said. "All the information so
far is good. What we've heard from doctors is pretty good, but he's
not throwing. If he was throwing and able to get on the mound, you'd
have a whole lot more confidence going into it."

Miller's agent, Robert Garber, didn't return phone calls Friday.

If healthy, Miller would be a key figure in a formidable Astros
rotation that includes Andy Pettitte, Oswalt, Brandon Backe and
possibly Cy Young Award winner Roger Clemens, who hasn't decided if
he'll return.

But Miller could get more than $3 million in arbitration, which
might be too big of a risk for the Astros. Purpura said he has had
discussions about a new contract for Miller for next year.

"We're in a situation where we've got to be careful what we do,"
Purpura said. "Number 1, we want to have a pitcher that will help us.

"Number 2, financially we're don't need to get in situations of
paying somebody to sit on the DL all year.

"He makes a significant amount of money, and that would be difficult
for us to be in that situation where we would have all the risk of
him not pitching."

Meanwhile, Purpura doesn't expect to have any dialogue with Scott
Boras, the agent for free-agent outfielder Carlos Beltran, until
next week. The two sides haven't spoken since Tuesday, on the heels
of the winter meetings.

brian.mctaggart@...








Yahoo! Groups Links

Hi there,

How's it going? :-)

I just thought some of you might be interested to know, that there is
this great sports site that recently got started a few months ago, who
are looking for some knowledgeable posters, to help fill the void.
It's a really friendly community, and the people who are behind site,
are extremely friendly and helpful. The site covers everything
baseball, football, hockey, and basketball...including general forums,
and off-topic areas. I just thought I would let you know this, in case
you're interested. We have an arcade too.

Here's the link to the site where you can reach it:

FORUMS PAGE: http://www.ptpsportsnetwork.com/forums/index.php?act=idx

Anyway, I truely appreciate your time, and courtesy. I hope you take
the time to join
Thanks! :-)

There's been a bevy of Hot Stove activity and the
Power Hour is set to re-cap tomorrow night at 7 pm,
est.

Tune in live at
http://www.am1240wgbb.com/live.html.html as we run
through all the moves: Mulder and Hudson are moving
on, Pedro's in NY and the Unit may be on his way!!

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Dec. 18, 2004, 1:03AM

Astros face decision on whether to retain Miller
Righthander's shoulder injury has team mulling options carefully
By BRIAN MCTAGGART
Copyright 2004 Houston Chronicle

As the Monday deadline approaches to tender contracts to major-
league players under a team's control, the Astros are weighing the
pros and cons of bringing back righthanded pitcher Wade Miller for
next season.

Miller, who went 7-7 with a 3.35 ERA last season but didn't pitch
after June 25 because of a frayed rotator cuff, is eligible for
arbitration but isn't expected to begin throwing off a mound until
next month.

The Astros don't want to go to arbitration with Miller, who doesn't
want to be non-tendered considering he's trying to come back from a
shoulder injury.

Miller avoided arbitration last year by agreeing to a one-year, $3.4
million deal for 2004, a $2,875,000 raise over the $525,000 he made
in 2003.

Monday's 11 p.m. deadline will affect other arbitration-eligible
players such as Lance Berkman, Roy Oswalt, Pete Munro, Tim Redding,
Brandon Duckworth and Mike Lamb.

If those players aren't tendered contracts through which the parties
at least hope to exchange arbitration figures, they will become free
agents.

"You're always trying to look at who to keep on the roster and who
to take off the roster," Purpura said. "Those are important
decisions."

Players such as Berkman and Oswalt are no-brainers to be tendered
contracts, but Miller's injury puts the Astros in a difficult spot.

Miller, 28, has been a workhorse for the Astros, winning at least 14
games in three consecutive seasons from 2001-03. But he began
experiencing pain in his shoulder June 15 of this year in a start
against the Chicago Cubs and made just two more starts before
shutting it down for the season.

Although he didn't have surgery, the Astros have received promising
news from team doctors regarding Miller's prognosis. Because he
won't begin throwing until January, the Astros will have to make a
decision on him by relying on MRIs and physical exams.

"It's tough, just because you don't have enough information,
particularly in Wade's case," Purpura said. "All the information so
far is good. What we've heard from doctors is pretty good, but he's
not throwing. If he was throwing and able to get on the mound, you'd
have a whole lot more confidence going into it."

Miller's agent, Robert Garber, didn't return phone calls Friday.

If healthy, Miller would be a key figure in a formidable Astros
rotation that includes Andy Pettitte, Oswalt, Brandon Backe and
possibly Cy Young Award winner Roger Clemens, who hasn't decided if
he'll return.

But Miller could get more than $3 million in arbitration, which
might be too big of a risk for the Astros. Purpura said he has had
discussions about a new contract for Miller for next year.

"We're in a situation where we've got to be careful what we do,"
Purpura said. "Number 1, we want to have a pitcher that will help us.

"Number 2, financially we're don't need to get in situations of
paying somebody to sit on the DL all year.

"He makes a significant amount of money, and that would be difficult
for us to be in that situation where we would have all the risk of
him not pitching."

Meanwhile, Purpura doesn't expect to have any dialogue with Scott
Boras, the agent for free-agent outfielder Carlos Beltran, until
next week. The two sides haven't spoken since Tuesday, on the heels
of the winter meetings.

brian.mctaggart@...

Perhaps, Soriano to the Cards since they've lost Renteria and Womack?

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com,
"femalebaseballfan2004" <femalebaseballfan2004@y...> wrote:
>
> havent heard about that rumor

havent heard about that rumor

If Clemens comes back and Pettite and Miller come off the DL, we'll
have three #1 starters and a #2 (Miller). Backe provides us with
long-term security Clemens won't, but at least for the next year or
two he wouldn't be crucial. If we are unable to keep Beltran, we'll
need another new offensive powerhouse threat. I'd like to keep
Beltran and Clemens, but if that can't be done, this trade might not
be such a bad thing instead.

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, "matrixenos"
<matrixenos@h...> wrote:
>
> I don't think the Stros will acquire him if and perhaps unless we
> don't acquire Beltran and have some spending room.  Backe is a
young
> gun and seems to have promise, although I haven't read much about
him
> as a starter as of yet.  If he isn't a starter, the pen looks good
for
> him...maybe even as a set-up, imho.  He and Qualls can duke it out.
>
> As well, I haven't seen anything on these rumors on the web
(besides
> this current Fort Worth blip).  We'll see!
>
> --- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, Lisa
> <lisa775712002@y...> wrote:
> > I for one hope this isn't true. I happen to like Backe and I
think
> his attitude is good for the team. He has a lot of spirit and
> sometimes the Astros need a little spunk in the dug out.
> > Lisa
> >
> > "Brier, Bennett" <bennett.brier@m...> wrote:
> > What's anyone know about this rumor?
> >
> > Alfonso Soriano (2B) TEX - Dec. 13
> >
> > Rumors of a Soriano-for-Brandon Backe trade circulated on Sunday,
> but the
> > Astros
> > aren't expected to make any trades until Roger Clemens' and
Carlos
> Beltran's
> > situations
> > are resolved, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reports.
> >
> > ROTOWIRE RECOMMENDS: Texas continues to listen to offers for
> Soriano, but
> > doesn't
> > appear to be actively looking to trade him.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
> >
> >
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Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> >  Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I don't think the Stros will acquire him if and perhaps unless we
don't acquire Beltran and have some spending room.  Backe is a young
gun and seems to have promise, although I haven't read much about him
as a starter as of yet.  If he isn't a starter, the pen looks good for
him...maybe even as a set-up, imho.  He and Qualls can duke it out.

As well, I haven't seen anything on these rumors on the web (besides
this current Fort Worth blip).  We'll see!

--- In houstonsbrandofbaseball@yahoogroups.com, Lisa
<lisa775712002@y...> wrote:
> I for one hope this isn't true. I happen to like Backe and I think
his attitude is good for the team. He has a lot of spirit and
sometimes the Astros need a little spunk in the dug out.
> Lisa
>
> "Brier, Bennett" <bennett.brier@m...> wrote:
> What's anyone know about this rumor?
>
> Alfonso Soriano (2B) TEX - Dec. 13
>
> Rumors of a Soriano-for-Brandon Backe trade circulated on Sunday,
but the
> Astros
> aren't expected to make any trades until Roger Clemens' and Carlos
Beltran's
> situations
> are resolved, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reports.
>
> ROTOWIRE RECOMMENDS: Texas continues to listen to offers for
Soriano, but
> doesn't
> appear to be actively looking to trade him.
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>    To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/houstonsbrandofbaseball/
>
>    To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> houstonsbrandofbaseball-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
>  Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I for one hope this isn't true. I happen to like Backe and I think his attitude
is good for the team. He has a lot of spirit and sometimes the Astros need a
little spunk in the dug out.
Lisa

"Brier, Bennett" <bennett.brier@...> wrote:
What's anyone know about this rumor?

Alfonso Soriano (2B) TEX - Dec. 13

Rumors of a Soriano-for-Brandon Backe trade circulated on Sunday, but the
Astros
aren't expected to make any trades until Roger Clemens' and Carlos Beltran's
situations
are resolved, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reports.

ROTOWIRE RECOMMENDS: Texas continues to listen to offers for Soriano, but
doesn't
appear to be actively looking to trade him.

Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dec. 14, 2004, 12:58AM

Astros leave meetings forced to play waiting game
Not knowing if Beltran, Clemens will be on payroll, Purpura unable
to rush into deals
By JOSE DE JESUS ORTIZ
Copyright 2004 Houston Chronicle

ANAHEIM, CALIF. - For Astros general manager Tim Purpura, the winter
meetings quickly became more than a Catch-22. Before most of his
colleagues from around the majors headed home Monday afternoon, it
was clear Purpura was in a Catch-22 and a Catch-15.

Astros fans would realize No. 22 is the one future Hall of Famer
Roger Clemens wears in Houston. No. 15 belongs to All-Star center
fielder Carlos Beltran, the prize of this year's winter market.

For Purpura and team owner Drayton McLane, who wants the Astros'
budget to remain in the neighborhood of $80 million, the catch is to
play the free-agent and trade markets while making sure not to
commit the funds that would be needed if Beltran and Clemens return.

"I don't think we're at a standstill at all," Purpura said. "There
are some things that we could pounce on, and we still may. There's a
couple free-agent situations that we could jump into but that don't
particularly fit exactly the way we'd like. There's a couple of
trades.

"That's what you talk about. You may walk away and say, 'We're not
going to do that right now, but we're going to think about.' "

Purpura admitted some doors have closed on the Astros as they have
waited on Beltran. The club had talked to the Brewers about
acquiring speedy center fielder Scott Podsednik, a Texan who on
Monday was dealt along with reliever Luis Vizcaino to the White Sox.

"We had a conversation about (Podsednik)," Purpura said. "It just
wasn't a very good match for them and probably wasn't a very good
match for us. We didn't have what they were looking for."


Alou's agent contacted
Right now it isn't very easy for the Astros to know for sure what
they need. They have canvassed the market for outfielders, but they
aren't ready to commit to another center fielder because Beltran
might come back.

Purpura also has had talks with Moises Alou's agent, but he cannot
get too serious with Alou because his potential salary could reduce
the payroll flexibility that will be needed if Clemens and Beltran
come back.

The Astros also want to have Jason Lane in the lineup, considering
he'll be the only relatively inexpensive talent in the outfield if
Beltran re-signs.

"It's a fit issue," Purpura said. "If you go get Moises and then get
Beltran, you've got (Jason) Lane to play until (Lance) Berkman comes
back (from knee surgery). But when Berkman comes back, that's the
problem."

According to Purpura and Yankees general manager Brian Cashman,
Beltran's agent Scott Boras did not meet Monday with the Astros or
the Yankees, who are considered Houston's main competition for
Beltran.

Purpura and Boras met twice during the meetings, which ran from
Friday until Monday afternoon. Cashman met three times with Boras
and claimed not to have made an offer before leaving Monday
afternoon.

McLane is hopeful the Mets' imminent signing of ace righthander
Pedro Martinez means New York's payroll would no longer be able to
accommodate Cubs slugger Sammy Sosa or Beltran.

McLane said he has always thought the Yankees, Mets and Cubs were
his biggest competitors for Beltran. He has wondered if Boras is
waiting for the Cubs to trade Sosa so they could have the budget
flexibility for Beltran.

"Maybe that's why he's slow getting back to us," McLane said.

Purpura and McLane refuse to comment on whether they have made an
offer to Beltran, but Purpura is optimistic about the progress he
made in his dealings with Boras.

"Any time you can sit down face-to-face, I think it really helps,"
Purpura said. "It gets you past some things. On the phone, it's
really difficult. (Optimism in re-signing Beltran) certainly hasn't
gone down at all. I think it's at a pretty high level as it is.

"It's going to be how we fit with Carlos and the organization in
terms of the dollars and the terms. It's tough to figure out."

3 Rule V pitchers drafted
The Astros made minor moves Monday by taking three pitchers in the
Class AAA phase of the Rule V Draft. Acquired were lefthander Blake
Allen from the Cleveland Indians' organization, lefthander Nick
Bourgeois from Philadelphia, and righthanded pitcher Wes OBrien from
the Chicago Cubs.

The Astros did not make a selection in the major-league phase of the
Rule V Draft, but they lost righthanded pitcher D.J. Houlton to the
Dodgers.

Houlton, 25, was 12-5 with a 2.94 ERA in 28 starts at Class AA Round
Rock this year, throwing one shutout and two other complete games.
He struck out 159 in 159 innings.

jesus.ortiz@...

What's anyone know about this rumor?

Alfonso Soriano (2B) TEX - Dec. 13

Rumors of a Soriano-for-Brandon Backe trade circulated on Sunday, but the
Astros
aren't expected to make any trades until Roger Clemens' and Carlos Beltran's
situations
are resolved, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reports.

ROTOWIRE RECOMMENDS: Texas continues to listen to offers for Soriano, but
doesn't
appear to be actively looking to trade him.

Don't forget to tune in tonight, live online at
http://www.am1240wgbb.com/live.html.html and send us
an aim instant message at mlb1240am to participate in
the show.

Pedro to the Mets? Hudson to the Dodgers? Burnett on
the move? Sexson to the M's? Finley to the Angels?
Kolb to the Braves? Wells to the BoSox, Pavano, Wright
to the Yanks? Renteria? Cabrera? Beltran?

We'll get into it all tonight at 7 pm est



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