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Guys,
I'm somewhat loathe to get into this discussion but I believe you're
both right to a degree. Darrell, I think you may be confusing
"power" with "strength", as power is defined as a combination of speed
and strength. Jan Zvara was the ultimate in terms of a "strength"
jumper. Very methodical run-up speed and gigantic thighs so he
could use his take-off leg as a huge spring. Ultimately these
athletes have short careers because of knee/achilles injuries.
Tim Forsyth, to my best recollection, was a potential "power" jumper
who hadn't matured enough during his teenage years to the point where
he could use much strength. Certainly that would have come with
age and consistency of training. His layout was not great but
Sjoberg is an unfair comparison as he had the best layout in
history.
Mogenberg didn't have such a great layout as he had incredible
kinesthetic awareness of where he was in-flight and timed his
arch/unarch perfectly to the point of passing his COG under the bar on
a number of occasions that I witnessed. He was 6' 7 1/2" (2.02m)
tall and often took off more than 4 1/2 feet (1.35m) from the bar and
had a pretty flat parabolic flight curve on heights below 2.30m (7' 6
1/2").
As a coach I like to work with young jumpers who have a deliberate/methodical approach velocity because it's easier to teach them to speed up (when they're ready to) then to slow down.
As a coach I like to work with young jumpers who have a deliberate/methodical approach velocity because it's easier to teach them to speed up (when they're ready to) then to slow down.
I think Forsyth could have been a dominant jumper but he would have
had his best years during the time that Sotomayor (the cheater) was
dominating and he might have seen that as a mountain too tall to
climb. Also, the athletic fishbowl that is sport-mad Australia
might have been too much for a teenager and when you add chronic
injuries to the mix it becomes even more difficult to reach the
public's expectations.
Coach Stones
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [HJ] Re: Tim Forsyth
From: "Darrell Jones" <stlouisterp@...>
Date: Tue, October 25, 2005 10:58 am
To: highjump@yahoogroups.com
Dennis,
I'm sorry you disagree, but I have the tapes from Barcelona to prove it. If
he had anywhere near the arch of Sjoberg, for example, he would have been in
the 2.40+ club. If you watch the tapes, he's practically looking at the bar
as he goes over. As far as speed goes, he lacked quality run-up speed. He
was very controlled, I'll give you that. Power floppers (i.e. Jan Zvara)
run slowly and then tend to accelerate the last three steps which ultimately
helps them convert well to the vertical. Tim's last steps looked very
similar to his entire run-up. He ran very methodically and didn't really hit
the plant with much power. Even with the bar going up, his speed didn't
improve noticeably. If you're going to jump 2.40 or higher you need to have
a bit of speed going into the 'J' to take advantage of centrifugal force.
I'm not saying that he had awful technique, I'm just saying that he could
have done a lot better.
>From: "denis doyle" <denis@...>
>Reply-To: highjump@yahoogroups.com
>To: <highjump@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [HJ] Re: Tim Forsyth
>Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2005 16:13:54 +0100
>
>Darrell
>
>I have to disagree with you on those comments. As an example to illustrate
>good technique performed with consumate control you would be hard pressed
>to
>find better.
>
>I am curious as to why do you say he wasn't a 'power' flopper.
>
>Denis Doyle
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Darrell Jones" <stlouisterp@...>
>To: <highjump@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:23 PM
>Subject: Re: [HJ] Re: Tim Forsyth
>
>
> > Tim could have been another Dietmar Mogenburg type athlete. He is very
>tall
> > and slender like the german Olympic champ from 84'. However, his
>technique
> > left a lot to be desired. His runup was very slow, which works well if
>you
> > are a power flopper and speed up as you approach the penultimate step.
>He
> > wasn't a power flopper though. In addition, his layout over the bar did
>not
> > contain an arch whatsover. He practically sat over the bar on most of
>his
> > attempts and yet despite these imperfections, he still cleared 2.34 in
> > Barcelona.
> >
> > Dwight, I wish you could have been Tim's coach. It obviously helped
>your
> > cousin (Nordquist).
> >
> > Darrell Jones
> >
> > >From: "Lindsay Harrison" <wilbur_46@...>
> > >Reply-To: highjump@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: <highjump@yahoogroups.com>
> > >Subject: Re: [HJ] Re: Tim Forsyth
> > >Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2005 08:25:12 +1000
> > >
> > >DAN,
> > >Tim is 32 now !
> > >Here the link to his athlete profile - although I don't think it's been
> > >update for a few years !
> > >
> >
> >http://www.athletics.org.au/athletes/profiles/profile.cfm?ObjectID=269&Sear
>chQueryString=AthleteInitial%3DF
> > >
> > >I think in the press release, he was aiming for the qualifying height
>of
> > >2.21 or 2.25 roughly !
> > >I think his best is behind him, but still at those heights would be
> > >competitive in the Commonwealth Games !
> > >Good on him, for having "another crack at it"
> > >Lindsay
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "DAN" <danthegod@...>
> > >To: <highjump@yahoogroups.com>
> > >Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2005 2:00 PM
> > >Subject: [HJ] Re: Tim Forsyth
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Whoa. How old is he now? I still have his 7'8 jump on my computer
> > > > from Barcelona in 1992! Even if he was 20 then he'd be at least 34
> > > > by now...
> > > >
> > > > --- In highjump@yahoogroups.com, "Lindsay Harrison" <wilbur_46@c...>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> Just thought I'd mention this announcement that came out the other
> > > > day!
> > > >>
> > > >> Tim Forsyth (Australia) has indicated that he will be trying for a
> > > > birth in
> > > >> the Australian Commonwealth Games team for March 2006. Tim hasn't
> > > > jumped
> > > >> since Sydney 2000 - where he had an ankle injury. He has had 3
> > > > operations
> > > >> on it, but it obviously isn't 100%, as he has swapped to jumping
> > > > from the
> > > >> other foot. Will be interesting to see how he goes :-)
> > > >>
> > > >> Lindsay
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
> > > > Bar height matters.
> > > > wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
> > Bar height matters.
> > wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
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