Forgive me, Dennis, if i correct you on a points:

{see    http://www.straightblastgym.com/why.htm   which explains in
great detail what good mma gyms are about}

1.MMA does not focus on being good at everything. (MMA i repeat is NOT
A SINGLE ART!}

Generally speaking, mosts MMA hobbyist- if i may call em that, focus
on 1 art. I focus on Brazilian Jiu-jitsu. And because all arts that
comprise MMA are focused on Randori, improvement is made quickly far
quicker than by doing Katas- although i do appreciate their the
occasional use of Katas as an aid to concentration.

With one art as your foundation, you learn enough of other arts to
defend yourself against them.

Personally, during the standing phase of the fight-boxing, my aim to
keep a tight defense, close the distance & then take my sparring
partner to the ground.

If you had trained in at an MMA gym, you 'd realise few are ever "full
time gladiators" as you said.

In fact watch Mirko "Cro-Cop"'s fights in Pride. He is a world kick
boxing champion with a largely Muay thai background.

He is considered amongst the elite of MMA fighters yet as you can see
in his fights on google video, he almost completely avoids grappling.

He defends himself against grappling submissions well, but does not
execute them himself.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=cro+cop


2. Character Building is big part of MMA as well.

Dennis, you quoted the following about traditional martial arts.

"personal character buildng as  well as loyalty to the group or clan
(Budo) and respect for teachers,using martial art as a tool"

"philosophy in daily living"

You seem to suggest MMA gyms lack these aspects. But you forget that
MMA gyms are under influence of Jiu-Jitus & Judo, esp Jiu-Jitsu.

Loyalty:

You would be surprised how much emphasis some Jiu-jitus cum MMA
schools place on loyalty. Having said that, the majority of
instructors also realise that Martial Arts is a business and it is a
free market. If you choose to switch to another school, they will
respect it.

Mutual respect:

Mutual respect is a cornerstone of Gracie philosophy  and as such good
MMA gyms place great focus on mutual respect, and on creating a
friendly environment for pple of both sexes and all ages to train.

Humility:

Becaue all arts taught at MMA gyms are performance based, with 100%
resistance (in drills or when up against white belts, of course one
uses varying resistance, say 30% or 50%), humility is often enforced.
Be arrogant and someone is always ready to beat you down. And even if
you are high level black belt in Jiu jitsu, make one slip & a purple
belt (if not a white belt) could tap you out. You will not win
everyday every round and this teaches humility.






The instructors at MMA gyms always spar with their students!




Week in week out. They learn through and together with their students.
And the more they learn the more the can teach their students.
This makes the instructors closer to their students and also the
students readily respect them because of this. Bare in mind that their
best students would beat them. But mutual respect is maintained.

How many traditionalist dare to risk a loss against their students?
How many "Masters" continue training as hard as they did when they
were white belts?

Further more, we call our instructors by name. They know the respect
we have for them is there, without having to give themselves titles.

http://www.renzogracie.com/

Walk into Renzo's gym and shout "Hey Renzo!"

He 'll walk up to you and say " Hi, how are you, my brother?"

And he doens't know you at all! He's not offended. He doesn't care for
titles.


3. "Not so deep rooted?"

I'll need you to explain that further. Is that a statement of fact or
opinion?


4. The future of MMA

Your concern for the future of MMA and its various Arts is unfounded.

Bare in mind that Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and Judo as well as Sambo ve
lasted about a 100 years already.

Judo under Dr Kano had long been well organised popular. With numerous
Jiu-Jitsu schools and MMA gyms offering Judo, certainly Judo as its
sole anchor, MMA would surive.

But Judo is not the "sole anchor". Western Boxing has lasted hundreds
of years and wrestling has survived since Greco-Roman times -
thousands of years!

Muay thai has lasted generations in Thailand and is popular through
out the world.

A good place to train in MMA is the Bankok fight club.

http://www.bangkokfightclub.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=12&Ite\
mid=26&lang=en



As long as these arts survive so will MMA.


5. I repeat: MMA is NOT  an art on its own.

"It's good to train MMA as an adjunct to your core art. But you need
to faithfully stick to your core art to give you direction in your life."

Within MMA you choose your core art (for me it is bjj), and then a
little bit of other things and then you r considered an MMA fighter.

Again our friend Cro-Cop: He focuses almost entirely on Muay thai
skills in the MMA arena.

see his fight vs Brazilian Jiu-jitsu wizard Nogueira. Cro-cop was very
unfortunate to lose.

Even a professinal like him has Muay Thai as his core.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=cro+cop

Once again go back to google video.

"What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his
own soul"-a Bible quote."

IF HE LOSES HIS SOUL. As i've demonstrated, you dun lose your soul in
MMA.


Your entire argument against Mixed Martial arts is based on your
assertions that MMA gyms have

1.No philosophy

2.;that MMA is designed to be an ultimate art form. Which is it not.

3.Teach and train in too many techniques.

Judokas know lots of throws; how many do they regularly execute in
tournament? 2 or 3. Thats it. Many judo schools award black belts
based solely on touney performance these days.

Wrestling - there are really only 2 takedowns: the Double leg takedown
& the single leg takedown.

BJJ has 100s of techniques but u choose the few that work for you.

Indeed from white ble level to Black, the Armbar, Triangle Choke &
back choke continue to be the main submissions executed in tourneys.

The difference between white & black is more a matter of skill &
timing rather than knowledge of techniques.

Because grading in MMA arts is performance based, you r not tested on
the number of techniques you know but what you can execute.

This is in contrast to Traditionalist schools which require a certain
number techniques for each belt level.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

A final note to all readers : Don't take my word for it. Go out there
& search for library books on Jiu-jitsu, wrestling, boxing and MMA.

Read online articles(including the links i posted!)

Its your soul, and it's your decision.

----------------------------------------------------------------------












--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua" <hbchua@...>
wrote:
>
> Here's an intersting article from an MMA pratitioner  in reply to
the article Hal submitted.(below)
> Any feedback for discussion.?
>
> here's one -a personal opinion on looking from a different perspective.
>
> I think the reason why there are so many disagreements between
traditional and MMA is the different emphasis that MMA and traditional
places.
> Traditional martial arts  focus a specific skill eg. mainly kicking
and punching with a few take down and few grappling techs  or
grappling ,throwing  with a few kicks and strikes.Their focus if base
on traditional Asian martial art background  is personal character
buildng as  well as loyalty to the group or clan (Budo) and respect
for teachers,using martial art as a tool.Their emphasis is martial art
philosophy in daily living ,not so much as winning matches. They have
a proven system in sense of good organization and easy to transmit
this "package' for repeated generations.
> Since every body can only commit a certain amount of time  for
training, it is quite a challenge to learn and be good at everything.
MMA tries to be good at everything, but even then ,certain players
will place empasis on techniques they like.The core is grappling.
> MMA interest startted from BJJ.If you look up BJJ history, it arise
because of questioning the rationale of certain traditional pratice
and techs for practicality.Hence emphasis is to win to prove this
point.Of course they have philosophies attached to it, but it is not
so deep rooted as compared to asian traditional martal art philosophy
with its long history on living in a society. Traditional asian
martial art arise from political situation of their time. ( This is my
personal opinion.I believe MMA practitioners will argue on this).
>
> The challenge for MMA's future is this.Can they transmit to later
generations successfully? Traditional martial arts with a good deep
rooted philosophy and organisational skills have proven to transmit to
several generations down.And majority of people prefer philosophy in
living ,and martial art as an added insurance if need arises, rather
than being in the ring. Majority just need certain skill to defend
fast and get out fast in a situation.
> They cannot afford to be full time gladiators. They have to work.
>
>  A good example is Taekwondo.MMA practitioners can argue it has many
weaknesses, but why is it the world's most popular martial art today?
Why is the world's army still use TKD as the core martial art?
> Another is Aikido. It is still using traditional fighting techs,that
one can argue in today's context is not so practical.But why is it so
popular among the elite in society?
> Taichi is known as "utimate boxing" . "Ultimate" not to win matches
.but to win the match of life.-longevity. Martial art grandmasters of
hard styles still end up learning some form of taichi later in their life.
> The challenge for MMA to be able to pass down to many generation is
this.Does it have a deep sense of philosophy to attract the masses?
Does it have a uniformity to easily transmit to the masses.It is
difficult,because it is "mixed".Different instructors emphasise
differently, and are trained differently.
>
> So the question is akin to what you want in life.Do you want to
train an art for a certain period of your life or thoughout your life
.- eg  a fast sports car , a family saloon car or an all terrain SUV
(Sports utility Vehicle).  It's good to train MMA as an adjunct to
your core art .But you need to faithfully stick to your core art to
give you direction in your life. If  not,after learning "all the
secrets of the world" you become empty and frustrated.
> As for me,the ultimate martial art is  the one that lets me win the
  "Match of life".
> "What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his
own soul"-a Bible quote.
>
>  Dennis
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Kaiyi
> To: hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 10:49 PM
> Subject: [Hapkido Flying Eagle] Re: Ultimate Martial Art? The true
nature of mixed martial arts
>
>
>
> SELF DEFENSE AND MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>
> http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=mma
>
> the criticism of Mixed Martial Arts in the article is way off the mark.
>
> If you truly want to learn self-defense, learn from police officers &
> soldiers. Learn the psychology of criminals. Because a skilled
> criminal will NOT give you the chance to defend yourself. He 'll walk
> up to you in the dark and stab in the back. Self defense is about
> knowing how to identify bad situations (drunk gang members, dark
> alleys) and avoid them or worse come to worse you talk your way out.
>
> No mixed martial artist would ever claim to be able to fight 10 men,
> nor does any sensei who claims to be able to demonstrate so. If
> someone has a knife, most genuine self defense experts will recommend
> you run or pick up a chair to batter your opponent.
>
> The argument for learning Mixed Martials Arts as an aid to
> self-defense is this: If you are confronted and assualted by a clumsy
> thug or drunk who is unarmed, then what you learn on the mat & in the
> ring is highly applicable because you fight against a parter who is
> 100% uncooperative and that creates an experience as close as possible
> to a real fight in which your assailant will also be 100%
> uncooperative. In many streets fights 1 or more parties often fall to
> the ground. Much of mixed martial arts involves escaping pins by
> opponents WHO CAN STRIKE YOU FROM THE TOP WITH ELBOWS, KNEES AND FISTS!
>
> This is in contrast to many traditional arts where u learn patterns
> which have no resemblance to most human reactions in a fight.
>
> Randori is what gives you some real fighting ability. It gives you the
> timing you will need in a real fight. Will you ever use it? Prob
> never. Will it work? maybe not. which brings us a point of agreement.
>
> ~Select a martial art that brings you joy. Mixed martial arts should
> not be pursued simply because you view it as the means to being a
> great fighter. For many mixed martial artistes, mixed martial arts is
> a healthy pursuit for training the mind and body, a challenge. The
> same way one challenges oneself by playing chess. I love playing
> chess. And who knows one day i may give up mma to play chess? Unlikely
> but possible!
>
> Having said that, proof that mixed martial arts is generally healthy
> can be found in Pride & UFC. Although there are a few bad apples like
> Ricardo Arona and Ken Shamrock and Royce Gracie who are rude towards
> opponents, many opponents actually train together at one pt or another
> - helping each other improve! And look what happens at the end of many
> fights: the fighters embrace without malice and chi chat. And they say
> " lets train together sometime"
>
> Can you imagine Rudd Van Nisterooy telling that to Patrick Viera?
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> THE TRUE NATURE OF MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>
> Donny who? For me the author of this article should make up his mind;
> 1st he attempts to discredit wrestling (which is a large part of mixed
> martial arts) and then proceeds to say the Traditionalists can't
> defeat Sakuraba & Ken Shamrock which is true; traditionalists were
> annhilated in Mixed martial arts tourneys and indeed have been
> consistently defeated by Muay Thai exponents in boxing matches.
>
> A further clarification on the Nature of MMA; an mma fighter is NOT
> AIMING TO CREATE & DEVELOPE AN ULTIMATE ART. Rather an mma fighter
> simply aims to cross - train and become as good a fighter as he can.
> Many of them emphasize their original art; a Muay thai fighter in an
> mma tourney is one with superb boxing skills & with only decent
> grappling skills (search "cro cop" on google video).
>
> Mixed martial arts is NOT style in any sense of the word. All mixed
> martial artiste will normally know some Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
> and one or 2 wrestling moves.
>
> Nxt they 'd be equipped with a type of boxing: Take your pick from
> Savate/Western boxing/Muay Thai/Full contact Karate with boxing base.
> Many of them have NO KICKING SKILLS.
>
> And then may equipped in Sambo(Russian Judo) to yet more Wrestling or
> Judo. Indeed some Brazilian jiu-jitsu exponents are very poor with
> Judo throws and wrestling takedowns[i'm a prime example :( ].
>
> What all these arts have in common is that they all base training
> against a resisting opponent - in other words Randori.
>
> So as you can see MMA is not an art, merely a term for a sport(which
> aids self defemse) in which pple from all arts join and fight.
>
> A FINAL NOTE: Don't think MMA vs Traditional martial arts
>
> Traditional arts & mixed martial are not opposed. At Kreation Jiu
> Jitsu (at he budo academy) where i train, many of my fellow students
> have extensive tradtional backgrounds. They enjoyed traditional
> martial arts. I myself tried "Praying Mantis Kung Fu" whilst training
> at Kreation.
>
> I repeat, have fun and also be humble. Don't say my art will beat
> yours-my father will beat your father kind of nonsense. You won't be
> happy saying these things.
>
> Happy training whatever your art is!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua" <hbchua@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Interesting article
> > DrChua
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: halcopeland@
> > To: HanMuDo@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 2:14 AM
> > Subject: [HanMuDo] Ultimate Martial Art?
> >
> >
> > I ran upon this article and thought I would share it with the list.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thoughts?
> >
> >
> >
> > -Hal
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.aikidojournal.com/?author=9
> >
> > Assumptions by Toby Threadgill Recently I was introduced to a
> gentleman interested in martial artstraining. He was not really aware
> of what I teach or of what constitutesNihon Koryu Jujutsu. He just
> assumed that because I taught it, that I mustbelieve it to be "the
> best". When I told him I did not believe the art Itaught to be "the
> best", an uncomfortable silence ensued. I finally brokethis taciturn
> moment by explaining that there is actually no such thing as a"best"
> martial art. Despite a noble effort to grasp what I was talkingabout,
> the gentleman in question eventually regressed, unable to shake
> theimpression that if I was not convinced that what I taught was
> superior toall other forms of martial arts, that I was somehow
> unworthy of teachinghim. I politely encouraged him to look around,
> consider what I had said and contact me again if he had any further
> questions. A few days later Ireceived an e-mail from this gentleman in
> which he explained that he had indeed found someone convinced that
> they taught the ultimate style ofmartial arts. It was called "mixed
> martial arts" because it embodied only the best of all the styles. I
> just smiled to myself as I politely responded, congratulating him on
> his fortuitous discovery. An ultimate martial art, huh? Now there's an
> oxymoron for you. Every Martial art is ultimately based on
> assumptions. In fact any training programformulated to address
> conflict is based on assumptions. It's kinda like the old joke about
> bringing a knife to a gun fight. No matter how good you are, your
> assumptions define your training paradigm. Narrow your assumptions and
> you specialize, gaining the opportunity to excel at one task. Broaden
> your assumptions and you might be able address many different
> situations but at what level of expertise? It's an intriguing dilemma
> isn't it? Specialize, and be defeated by someone outside your
> strengths. Be a generalist and Some specialist will hand you your head
> on a platter. What's a martial artist to do? Years ago my teacher
> Yukio Takamura taught a seminar which touched upon This topic. The
> seminar subject was a comparison between sport budo and Classical
> budo. During the lunch break a young karateka & wrestler, I'll call
> Donny, loudly dismissed Takamura Sensei's teachings as antiquated
> nonsense. Inresponse to this pronouncement Takamura shook his head and
> chuckled while fiddling with his shoes. Donny, rather brash and full
> of bravado turned to Takamura Sensei and said, "Now don't get me wrong
> old man, your stuff is fun to watch and all but your jujutsu is no
> match for my karate and wrestling.Takamura flashed a devilish smile at
> Donny and said, "Okay, show me". Donny backed off a bit at this
> unexpected challenge and said "Well, I'm not Going to fight you,
> you're too old. How about him" pointing at Dave Maynard.Takamura
> responded "No, you were talking about my jujutsu, not his. I Want you
> to show me." Rather pensively Donny strolled out onto the dojo mat
> with Takamura Sensei as a hushed silence overtook the room. At first
> Donnyappeared reluctant to do anything but when he noticed that all
> eyes were on him he revved up his courage and proceeded to execute a
> very nice double leg takedown, climbing up on what at first appeared
> to be a rather startledTakamura Sensei. As Donny attempted to continue
> his seemingly Successful offense we noticed something flick around
> Donny's neck. Suddenly, Donnytried to pull away, his head turning as
> red as a ripe tomato. In a fewseconds he fell over wheezing. At that
> point we realized that a shoelace was resting tightly around Donny's
> neck. Where had it come from? Takamura had secreted the shoelace in
> his sleeve and then executed a simple choke with it. As he revived
> Donny from his impromptu slumber he explained to thestunned witnesses
> that Donny had missed the point of the seminar altogether and made a
> dangerous assumption. He assumed that this was a contest with rules
> and that Takamura sensei was unarmed. The most interesting thing to me
> about this whole incident was that Takamura had deliberately pulled
> theshoelace from his shoe, placed it in his sleeve in plain sight and
> not one of us noticed. What a lesson rich incident this was..... Now
> I'm sure that some MMA proponents will roll their eyes at this
> Interlude and remark that it proves nothing. They will say venues like
> Pride and UFC prove you must do everything in budo well and that
> Takamura Sensei with a shoelace couldn't defeat the likes of Matt
> Hughes or Sakuraba. That'sprobably true and sounds convincing enough
> but such a dismissal misses the point. The truth is that to be
> successful in a venue like the UFC your time is best spent training to
> confront the challenges you ASSUME you will meet in the ring. Training
> outside such an assumption is a waste of time.However, drop a
> Portuguese knife fighter into the UFC ring and the Mixed martial arts
> guy will realize he's really not a mixed martial artist After all, but
> instead a specialist in unarmed sport conflict who hasn't "mixed"
> expertise in knife fighting into his supposedly mixed martial art...
> Those nasty old assumptions .... Now don't get me wrong, I greatly
> admire the technical efficacy and Extreme level of physical training
> the serious MMA practitioners like those in Pride or UFC display but
> outside the paradigm they train for they can be just As vulnerable as
> anyone else. It's not the individual version of MMA Itself that made
> guys like Rickson Gracie, Ken Shamrock, Sakuraba or Matt Hughes
> champions. It's really their creativity within each venues rules and
> The extreme level of training they have devoted to obtaining their
> skills. Each of these guys within the paradigm of what they do has
> trained himself to an extreme level. That's the real secret to the
> best style of budo.....Training intensity! So don't get hung up in
> training in the ultimate martial art. You will Be chasing assumptions
> forever. Instead pick an art that makes assumptions In line with what
> you value or desire and then train with a level of Dedication equal to
> what you expect to get from your martial art. If you're a Police
> officer this will probably be a very different from a college
> professor. In the case of the gentleman who contacted me in search of
> the ultimatemartial art, I guess it is human nature to seek out
> someone else's version of what's best when one has scant experience to
> base an opinion on, but it is amusing to note how many people studying
> martial arts beyond a beginners level fail to progress beyond the
> myopic view that there could be any such thing as an ultimate martial
> art. Remember, the only accurate assumption in budo is that your
> assumptions Are never 100% correct. Toby ThreadgillTakamura-ha Shindo
> Yoshin-ryu
> >
> >
> >
> > To have a friend subscribe, send them the link:
> http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/HanMuDo
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Health fitness franchise  Fitness health  Health
> fitness product
> >       Fitness nutrition  Health nutrition  Womens health fitness
> magazine
> >
> >
> >
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>

I used to train under Master Lim is HKD until i switched to MMA.
Which is why i've joined this group.







--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Kaiyi" <ech0222@...> wrote:
>
> I'm kaiyi from Kreation jiu-jitsu. We are presently training at the
> Budo academy.
>
> We emphasize grappling: wrestling, judo & jiu jitsu, gi & no-gi.
>
> We also do some boxing on Mondays.
>
> If you wish to find out more, call my head instructor
>
> Kon at 96771737.
>
> http://www.straightblastgym.com/international.htm#Singapore
>

A clarfication on boxers having no kicking skills: Many boxers in the
MMA arena are Western boxers who as we all know do not kick, hence
their kicking skills are poor. Some simple do not bother to learn how
to kick, rather preferring to focus on boxing & grappling.









--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Kaiyi" <ech0222@...> wrote:
>
>
> SELF DEFENSE AND MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>
> http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=mma
>
> the criticism of Mixed Martial Arts in the article is way off the mark.
>
> If you truly want to learn self-defense, learn from police officers &
> soldiers. Learn the psychology of criminals. Because a skilled
> criminal will NOT give you the chance to defend yourself. He 'll walk
> up to you in the dark and stab in the back. Self defense is about
> knowing how to identify bad situations (drunk gang members, dark
> alleys) and avoid them or worse come to worse you talk your way out.
>
> No mixed martial artist would ever claim to be able to fight 10 men,
> nor does any sensei who claims to be able to demonstrate so. If
> someone has a knife, most genuine self defense experts will recommend
> you run or pick up a chair to batter your opponent.
>
> The argument for learning Mixed Martials Arts as an aid to
> self-defense is this: If you are confronted and assualted by a clumsy
> thug or drunk who is unarmed, then what you learn on the mat & in the
> ring is highly applicable because you fight against a parter who is
> 100% uncooperative and that creates an experience as close as possible
> to a real fight in which your assailant will also be 100%
> uncooperative. In many streets fights 1 or more parties often fall to
> the ground. Much of mixed martial arts involves escaping pins by
> opponents WHO CAN STRIKE YOU FROM THE TOP WITH ELBOWS, KNEES AND FISTS!
>
> This is in contrast to many traditional arts where u learn patterns
> which have no resemblance to most human reactions in a fight.
>
> Randori is what gives you some real fighting ability. It gives you the
> timing you will need in a real fight. Will you ever use it? Prob
> never. Will it work? maybe not. which brings us a point of agreement.
>
> ~Select a martial art that brings you joy. Mixed martial arts should
> not be pursued simply because you view it as the means to being a
> great fighter. For many mixed martial artistes, mixed martial arts is
> a healthy pursuit for training the mind and body, a challenge. The
> same way one challenges oneself by playing chess. I love playing
> chess. And who knows one day i may give up mma to play chess? Unlikely
> but possible!
>
> Having said that, proof that mixed martial arts is generally healthy
> can be found in Pride & UFC. Although there are a few bad apples like
> Ricardo Arona and Ken Shamrock and Royce Gracie who are rude towards
> opponents, many opponents actually train together at one pt or another
> - helping each other improve! And look what happens at the end of many
> fights: the fighters embrace without malice and chi chat. And they say
> " lets train together sometime"
>
> Can you imagine Rudd Van Nisterooy telling that to Patrick Viera?
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> THE TRUE NATURE OF MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>
> Donny who? For me the author of this article should make up his mind;
> 1st he attempts to discredit wrestling (which is a large part of mixed
> martial arts) and then proceeds to say the Traditionalists can't
> defeat Sakuraba & Ken Shamrock which is true; traditionalists were
> annhilated in Mixed martial arts tourneys and indeed have been
> consistently defeated by Muay Thai exponents in boxing matches.
>
> A further clarification on the Nature of MMA; an mma fighter is NOT
> AIMING TO CREATE & DEVELOPE AN ULTIMATE ART. Rather an mma fighter
> simply aims to cross - train and become as good a fighter as he can.
> Many of them emphasize their original art; a Muay thai fighter in an
> mma tourney is one with superb boxing skills & with only decent
> grappling skills (search "cro cop" on google video).
>
> Mixed martial arts is NOT style in any sense of the word. All mixed
> martial artiste will normally know some Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
> and one or 2 wrestling moves.
>
> Nxt they 'd be equipped with a type of boxing: Take your pick from
> Savate/Western boxing/Muay Thai/Full contact Karate with boxing base.
> Many of them have NO KICKING SKILLS.
>
> And then may equipped in Sambo(Russian Judo) to yet more Wrestling or
> Judo. Indeed some Brazilian jiu-jitsu exponents are very poor with
> Judo throws and wrestling takedowns[i'm a prime example :( ].
>
> What all these arts have in common is that they all base training
> against a resisting opponent - in other words Randori.
>
> So as you can see MMA is not an art, merely a term for a sport(which
> aids self defemse) in which pple from all arts join and fight.
>
> A FINAL NOTE: Don't think MMA vs Traditional martial arts
>
> Traditional arts & mixed martial are not opposed. At Kreation Jiu
> Jitsu (at he budo academy) where i train, many of my fellow students
> have extensive tradtional backgrounds. They enjoyed traditional
> martial arts. I myself tried "Praying Mantis Kung Fu" whilst training
> at Kreation.
>
> I repeat, have fun and also be humble. Don't say my art will beat
> yours-my father will beat your father kind of nonsense. You won't be
> happy saying these things.
>
> Happy training whatever your art is!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua" <hbchua@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Interesting article
> > DrChua
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: halcopeland@
> > To: HanMuDo@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 2:14 AM
> > Subject: [HanMuDo] Ultimate Martial Art?
> >
> >
> > I ran upon this article and thought I would share it with the list.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thoughts?
> >
> >
> >
> > -Hal
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.aikidojournal.com/?author=9
> >
> > Assumptions by Toby Threadgill Recently I was introduced to a
> gentleman interested in martial artstraining. He was not really aware
> of what I teach or of what constitutesNihon Koryu Jujutsu. He just
> assumed that because I taught it, that I mustbelieve it to be "the
> best". When I told him I did not believe the art Itaught to be "the
> best", an uncomfortable silence ensued. I finally brokethis taciturn
> moment by explaining that there is actually no such thing as a"best"
> martial art. Despite a noble effort to grasp what I was talkingabout,
> the gentleman in question eventually regressed, unable to shake
> theimpression that if I was not convinced that what I taught was
> superior toall other forms of martial arts, that I was somehow
> unworthy of teachinghim. I politely encouraged him to look around,
> consider what I had said and contact me again if he had any further
> questions. A few days later Ireceived an e-mail from this gentleman in
> which he explained that he had indeed found someone convinced that
> they taught the ultimate style ofmartial arts. It was called "mixed
> martial arts" because it embodied only the best of all the styles. I
> just smiled to myself as I politely responded, congratulating him on
> his fortuitous discovery. An ultimate martial art, huh? Now there's an
> oxymoron for you. Every Martial art is ultimately based on
> assumptions. In fact any training programformulated to address
> conflict is based on assumptions. It's kinda like the old joke about
> bringing a knife to a gun fight. No matter how good you are, your
> assumptions define your training paradigm. Narrow your assumptions and
> you specialize, gaining the opportunity to excel at one task. Broaden
> your assumptions and you might be able address many different
> situations but at what level of expertise? It's an intriguing dilemma
> isn't it? Specialize, and be defeated by someone outside your
> strengths. Be a generalist and Some specialist will hand you your head
> on a platter. What's a martial artist to do? Years ago my teacher
> Yukio Takamura taught a seminar which touched upon This topic. The
> seminar subject was a comparison between sport budo and Classical
> budo. During the lunch break a young karateka & wrestler, I'll call
> Donny, loudly dismissed Takamura Sensei's teachings as antiquated
> nonsense. Inresponse to this pronouncement Takamura shook his head and
> chuckled while fiddling with his shoes. Donny, rather brash and full
> of bravado turned to Takamura Sensei and said, "Now don't get me wrong
> old man, your stuff is fun to watch and all but your jujutsu is no
> match for my karate and wrestling.Takamura flashed a devilish smile at
> Donny and said, "Okay, show me". Donny backed off a bit at this
> unexpected challenge and said "Well, I'm not Going to fight you,
> you're too old. How about him" pointing at Dave Maynard.Takamura
> responded "No, you were talking about my jujutsu, not his. I Want you
> to show me." Rather pensively Donny strolled out onto the dojo mat
> with Takamura Sensei as a hushed silence overtook the room. At first
> Donnyappeared reluctant to do anything but when he noticed that all
> eyes were on him he revved up his courage and proceeded to execute a
> very nice double leg takedown, climbing up on what at first appeared
> to be a rather startledTakamura Sensei. As Donny attempted to continue
> his seemingly Successful offense we noticed something flick around
> Donny's neck. Suddenly, Donnytried to pull away, his head turning as
> red as a ripe tomato. In a fewseconds he fell over wheezing. At that
> point we realized that a shoelace was resting tightly around Donny's
> neck. Where had it come from? Takamura had secreted the shoelace in
> his sleeve and then executed a simple choke with it. As he revived
> Donny from his impromptu slumber he explained to thestunned witnesses
> that Donny had missed the point of the seminar altogether and made a
> dangerous assumption. He assumed that this was a contest with rules
> and that Takamura sensei was unarmed. The most interesting thing to me
> about this whole incident was that Takamura had deliberately pulled
> theshoelace from his shoe, placed it in his sleeve in plain sight and
> not one of us noticed. What a lesson rich incident this was..... Now
> I'm sure that some MMA proponents will roll their eyes at this
> Interlude and remark that it proves nothing. They will say venues like
> Pride and UFC prove you must do everything in budo well and that
> Takamura Sensei with a shoelace couldn't defeat the likes of Matt
> Hughes or Sakuraba. That'sprobably true and sounds convincing enough
> but such a dismissal misses the point. The truth is that to be
> successful in a venue like the UFC your time is best spent training to
> confront the challenges you ASSUME you will meet in the ring. Training
> outside such an assumption is a waste of time.However, drop a
> Portuguese knife fighter into the UFC ring and the Mixed martial arts
> guy will realize he's really not a mixed martial artist After all, but
> instead a specialist in unarmed sport conflict who hasn't "mixed"
> expertise in knife fighting into his supposedly mixed martial art...
> Those nasty old assumptions .... Now don't get me wrong, I greatly
> admire the technical efficacy and Extreme level of physical training
> the serious MMA practitioners like those in Pride or UFC display but
> outside the paradigm they train for they can be just As vulnerable as
> anyone else. It's not the individual version of MMA Itself that made
> guys like Rickson Gracie, Ken Shamrock, Sakuraba or Matt Hughes
> champions. It's really their creativity within each venues rules and
> The extreme level of training they have devoted to obtaining their
> skills. Each of these guys within the paradigm of what they do has
> trained himself to an extreme level. That's the real secret to the
> best style of budo.....Training intensity! So don't get hung up in
> training in the ultimate martial art. You will Be chasing assumptions
> forever. Instead pick an art that makes assumptions In line with what
> you value or desire and then train with a level of Dedication equal to
> what you expect to get from your martial art. If you're a Police
> officer this will probably be a very different from a college
> professor. In the case of the gentleman who contacted me in search of
> the ultimatemartial art, I guess it is human nature to seek out
> someone else's version of what's best when one has scant experience to
> base an opinion on, but it is amusing to note how many people studying
> martial arts beyond a beginners level fail to progress beyond the
> myopic view that there could be any such thing as an ultimate martial
> art. Remember, the only accurate assumption in budo is that your
> assumptions Are never 100% correct. Toby ThreadgillTakamura-ha Shindo
> Yoshin-ryu
> >
> >
> >
> > To have a friend subscribe, send them the link:
> http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/HanMuDo
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Health fitness franchise  Fitness health  Health
> fitness product
> >       Fitness nutrition  Health nutrition  Womens health fitness
> magazine
> >
> >
> >
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> >
> >   a..  Visit your group "HanMuDo" on the web.
> >
> >   b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >    HanMuDo-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >   c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
>

I'm kaiyi from Kreation jiu-jitsu. We are presently training at the
Budo academy.

We emphasize grappling: wrestling, judo & jiu jitsu, gi & no-gi.

We also do some boxing on Mondays.

If you wish to find out more, call my head instructor

Kon at 96771737.

http://www.straightblastgym.com/international.htm#Singapore

SELF DEFENSE AND MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=mma

the criticism of Mixed Martial Arts in the article is way off the mark.

If you truly want to learn self-defense, learn from police officers &
soldiers. Learn the psychology of criminals. Because a skilled
criminal will NOT give you the chance to defend yourself. He 'll walk
up to you in the dark and stab in the back. Self defense is about
knowing how to identify bad situations (drunk gang members, dark
alleys) and avoid them or worse come to worse you talk your way out.

No mixed martial artist would ever claim to be able to fight 10 men,
nor does any sensei who claims to be able to demonstrate so. If
someone has a knife, most genuine self defense experts will recommend
you run or pick up a chair to batter your opponent.

The argument for learning Mixed Martials Arts as an aid to
self-defense is this: If you are confronted and assualted by a clumsy
thug or drunk who is unarmed, then what you learn on the mat & in the
ring is highly applicable because you fight against a parter who is
100% uncooperative and that creates an experience as close as possible
to a real fight in which your assailant will also be 100%
uncooperative. In many streets fights 1 or more parties often fall to
the ground. Much of mixed martial arts involves escaping pins by
opponents WHO CAN STRIKE YOU FROM THE TOP WITH ELBOWS, KNEES AND FISTS!

This is in contrast to many traditional arts where u learn patterns
which have no resemblance to most human reactions in a fight.

Randori is what gives you some real fighting ability. It gives you the
timing you will need in a real fight. Will you ever use it? Prob
never. Will it work? maybe not. which brings us a point of agreement.

~Select a martial art that brings you joy. Mixed martial arts should
not be pursued simply because you view it as the means to being a
great fighter. For many mixed martial artistes, mixed martial arts is
a healthy pursuit for training the mind and body, a challenge. The
same way one challenges oneself by playing chess. I love playing
chess. And who knows one day i may give up mma to play chess? Unlikely
but possible!

Having said that, proof that mixed martial arts is generally healthy
can be found in Pride & UFC. Although there are a few bad apples like
Ricardo Arona and Ken Shamrock and Royce Gracie who are rude towards
opponents, many opponents actually train together at one pt or another
- helping each other improve! And look what happens at the end of many
fights: the fighters embrace without malice and chi chat. And they say
" lets train together sometime"

Can you imagine Rudd Van Nisterooy telling that to Patrick Viera?

--------------------------------------------------------------------

THE TRUE NATURE OF MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:

Donny who? For me the author of this article should make up his mind;
1st he attempts to discredit wrestling (which is a large part of mixed
martial arts) and then proceeds to say the Traditionalists can't
defeat Sakuraba & Ken Shamrock which is true; traditionalists were
annhilated in Mixed martial arts tourneys and indeed have been
consistently defeated by Muay Thai exponents in boxing matches.

A further clarification on the Nature of MMA; an mma fighter is NOT
AIMING TO CREATE & DEVELOPE AN ULTIMATE ART. Rather an mma fighter
simply aims to cross - train and become as good a fighter as he can.
Many of them emphasize their original art; a Muay thai fighter in an
mma tourney is one with superb boxing skills & with only decent
grappling skills (search "cro cop" on google video).

Mixed martial arts is NOT style in any sense of the word. All mixed
martial artiste will normally know some Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
and one or 2 wrestling moves.

Nxt they 'd be equipped with a type of boxing: Take your pick from
Savate/Western boxing/Muay Thai/Full contact Karate with boxing base.
Many of them have NO KICKING SKILLS.

And then may equipped in Sambo(Russian Judo) to yet more Wrestling or
Judo. Indeed some Brazilian jiu-jitsu exponents are very poor with
Judo throws and wrestling takedowns[i'm a prime example :( ].

What all these arts have in common is that they all base training
against a resisting opponent - in other words Randori.

So as you can see MMA is not an art, merely a term for a sport(which
aids self defemse) in which pple from all arts join and fight.

A FINAL NOTE: Don't think MMA vs Traditional martial arts

Traditional arts & mixed martial are not opposed. At Kreation Jiu
Jitsu (at he budo academy) where i train, many of my fellow students
have extensive tradtional backgrounds. They enjoyed traditional
martial arts. I myself tried "Praying Mantis Kung Fu" whilst training
at Kreation.

I repeat, have fun and also be humble. Don't say my art will beat
yours-my father will beat your father kind of nonsense. You won't be
happy saying these things.

Happy training whatever your art is!










--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua" <hbchua@...>
wrote:
>
> Interesting article
> DrChua
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: halcopeland@...
> To: HanMuDo@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 2:14 AM
> Subject: [HanMuDo] Ultimate Martial Art?
>
>
> I ran upon this article and thought I would share it with the list.
>
>
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
>
> -Hal
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.aikidojournal.com/?author=9
>
> Assumptions by Toby Threadgill Recently I was introduced to a
gentleman interested in martial artstraining. He was not really aware
of what I teach or of what constitutesNihon Koryu Jujutsu. He just
assumed that because I taught it, that I mustbelieve it to be "the
best". When I told him I did not believe the art Itaught to be "the
best", an uncomfortable silence ensued. I finally brokethis taciturn
moment by explaining that there is actually no such thing as a"best"
martial art. Despite a noble effort to grasp what I was talkingabout,
the gentleman in question eventually regressed, unable to shake
theimpression that if I was not convinced that what I taught was
superior toall other forms of martial arts, that I was somehow
unworthy of teachinghim. I politely encouraged him to look around,
consider what I had said and contact me again if he had any further
questions. A few days later Ireceived an e-mail from this gentleman in
which he explained that he had indeed found someone convinced that
they taught the ultimate style ofmartial arts. It was called "mixed
martial arts" because it embodied only the best of all the styles. I
just smiled to myself as I politely responded, congratulating him on
his fortuitous discovery. An ultimate martial art, huh? Now there's an
oxymoron for you. Every Martial art is ultimately based on
assumptions. In fact any training programformulated to address
conflict is based on assumptions. It's kinda like the old joke about
bringing a knife to a gun fight. No matter how good you are, your
assumptions define your training paradigm. Narrow your assumptions and
you specialize, gaining the opportunity to excel at one task. Broaden
your assumptions and you might be able address many different
situations but at what level of expertise? It's an intriguing dilemma
isn't it? Specialize, and be defeated by someone outside your
strengths. Be a generalist and Some specialist will hand you your head
on a platter. What's a martial artist to do? Years ago my teacher
Yukio Takamura taught a seminar which touched upon This topic. The
seminar subject was a comparison between sport budo and Classical
budo. During the lunch break a young karateka & wrestler, I'll call
Donny, loudly dismissed Takamura Sensei's teachings as antiquated
nonsense. Inresponse to this pronouncement Takamura shook his head and
chuckled while fiddling with his shoes. Donny, rather brash and full
of bravado turned to Takamura Sensei and said, "Now don't get me wrong
old man, your stuff is fun to watch and all but your jujutsu is no
match for my karate and wrestling.Takamura flashed a devilish smile at
Donny and said, "Okay, show me". Donny backed off a bit at this
unexpected challenge and said "Well, I'm not Going to fight you,
you're too old. How about him" pointing at Dave Maynard.Takamura
responded "No, you were talking about my jujutsu, not his. I Want you
to show me." Rather pensively Donny strolled out onto the dojo mat
with Takamura Sensei as a hushed silence overtook the room. At first
Donnyappeared reluctant to do anything but when he noticed that all
eyes were on him he revved up his courage and proceeded to execute a
very nice double leg takedown, climbing up on what at first appeared
to be a rather startledTakamura Sensei. As Donny attempted to continue
his seemingly Successful offense we noticed something flick around
Donny's neck. Suddenly, Donnytried to pull away, his head turning as
red as a ripe tomato. In a fewseconds he fell over wheezing. At that
point we realized that a shoelace was resting tightly around Donny's
neck. Where had it come from? Takamura had secreted the shoelace in
his sleeve and then executed a simple choke with it. As he revived
Donny from his impromptu slumber he explained to thestunned witnesses
that Donny had missed the point of the seminar altogether and made a
dangerous assumption. He assumed that this was a contest with rules
and that Takamura sensei was unarmed. The most interesting thing to me
about this whole incident was that Takamura had deliberately pulled
theshoelace from his shoe, placed it in his sleeve in plain sight and
not one of us noticed. What a lesson rich incident this was..... Now
I'm sure that some MMA proponents will roll their eyes at this
Interlude and remark that it proves nothing. They will say venues like
Pride and UFC prove you must do everything in budo well and that
Takamura Sensei with a shoelace couldn't defeat the likes of Matt
Hughes or Sakuraba. That'sprobably true and sounds convincing enough
but such a dismissal misses the point. The truth is that to be
successful in a venue like the UFC your time is best spent training to
confront the challenges you ASSUME you will meet in the ring. Training
outside such an assumption is a waste of time.However, drop a
Portuguese knife fighter into the UFC ring and the Mixed martial arts
guy will realize he's really not a mixed martial artist After all, but
instead a specialist in unarmed sport conflict who hasn't "mixed"
expertise in knife fighting into his supposedly mixed martial art...
Those nasty old assumptions .... Now don't get me wrong, I greatly
admire the technical efficacy and Extreme level of physical training
the serious MMA practitioners like those in Pride or UFC display but
outside the paradigm they train for they can be just As vulnerable as
anyone else. It's not the individual version of MMA Itself that made
guys like Rickson Gracie, Ken Shamrock, Sakuraba or Matt Hughes
champions. It's really their creativity within each venues rules and
The extreme level of training they have devoted to obtaining their
skills. Each of these guys within the paradigm of what they do has
trained himself to an extreme level. That's the real secret to the
best style of budo.....Training intensity! So don't get hung up in
training in the ultimate martial art. You will Be chasing assumptions
forever. Instead pick an art that makes assumptions In line with what
you value or desire and then train with a level of Dedication equal to
what you expect to get from your martial art. If you're a Police
officer this will probably be a very different from a college
professor. In the case of the gentleman who contacted me in search of
the ultimatemartial art, I guess it is human nature to seek out
someone else's version of what's best when one has scant experience to
base an opinion on, but it is amusing to note how many people studying
martial arts beyond a beginners level fail to progress beyond the
myopic view that there could be any such thing as an ultimate martial
art. Remember, the only accurate assumption in budo is that your
assumptions Are never 100% correct. Toby ThreadgillTakamura-ha Shindo
Yoshin-ryu
>
>
>
> To have a friend subscribe, send them the link:
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/HanMuDo
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS Health fitness franchise  Fitness health  Health
fitness product
>       Fitness nutrition  Health nutrition  Womens health fitness
magazine
>
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>   a..  Visit your group "HanMuDo" on the web.
>
>   b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>    HanMuDo-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>   c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

Hello Everybody!

Good Greetings to everyone here!

My team and I had created a Hapkido Community Website to provide
Information about Hapkido like lineage, articles etc. and also a forum.
We feel that Hapkido needs a website and forum for itself!

This website is dedicated for Hapkido related only but the forum will
cater to a wider area but Hapkido will have a thread itself!

This website will be handle by all Hapkido Volunteers so be nice okay
people! We hope to bring in good hapkido articles, goodies and more
things we can think of, exclusively only for our forum members! So to
be a member of us, just need to sign up at our forum!
We are also recruiting Volunteers to help us, anybody, anyone as long
as you are a Hapkido fan!
We also welcome comments and suggestions!

Website Address: http://www.hkd.in

If you have any questions related to this, just post here or in the
forum! Thanks!

Feel free to drop by or contribute! Pass the word!

Cheers,
Daniel

Hello,



I'd like to invite you to join our new martial arts forum.  It was
started exactly one week ago and already has 55 users and 750
messages.  There areas for all types of martial arts and special
interests areas for instructors and school owners.



Please consider joining and sharing your knowledge and ideas.  The
address is http://forums.natkd.com.



Respectfully



--

Jason E. Thomas

5th Dan

Chief Instructor

North Austin Tae Kwon Do

www.natkd.com

Natkd.com has started a martial arts forum.

The address is:  http://forums.natkd.com

Thanks..

Hi Master Dennis,

Congrats on your appointment!

Best Regards,
Daniel

--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua"
<hbchua@p...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Dr.Dennis Chua ,president of Hanmudo Association Singapore and
Chief Instructor and founder of  Hapkido Shim Do Kwan ,
> is appointed by GHF to be Singapore representative for Global
Hapkido Federation.
> He is also appointed as International Committee member as
Chairperson for Education and Training
>
> http://www.globalhapkido.org/modules.php?
name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=7
>
> Global Hapkido Federation
> http://www.globalhapkido.org/index.php
>

Hey Master Ramon,

Nice to hear from you! Its been sometime!

Happy New Year to You!

Yes, Ki is definitely very important, Tan Jon Breathing Exercises are
therefore very important to do it everyday.

There will be a high risk if you do your Tan Jon Breathing wrongly so
everyone has to be careful.

I believe not only in Breathing but also shouting out loud(Let out
your Breathing) which GM Tan Sar Bee Teaches.

Best Regards,
Daniel

--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, ramonnavarro123
<no_reply@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi all and be blessed.
>
> I believe that you all know that Ki's development can be so in many
> different ways but all of them are sure Developer only if done
> diligently in the type of exercises that is being trained.
>
> Does any one comment on this and give any of your exercises,
explaining
> what you know about how to do it correctly to control our Ki and if
> there are any risks and what advices do you give to avoid this
problem?
>
> Muchas gracias por compartir.
>
> HAP
>
> Ramon Navarro
> SabomNim de HapKiDo
> Song Moo Kwan HapKiDo
> Panama Ciudad de Panama
>

 Hi Everyone

Wishing all a very Happy New Year. May the year of the Dog brings Health, Happiness, Prosperity & Wealth $$$ to all.

ˇöˇöˇö¨Žˇˇ¨Ťˇöˇö¨Žˇˇ¨Ťˇöˇö¨Žˇˇ¨Ťˇöˇö¨Ž
ˇˇˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇö
¨Ťˇöˇö¨Źˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇöˇö¨Ž
ˇöˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇöˇˇˇöˇˇˇˇˇö
¨�ˇöˇöˇöˇˇ¨�ˇöˇö¨Źˇˇ¨�ˇöˇö¨Źˇˇ¨�ˇöˇö¨Ź

ף´óĽŇ... ĐÂÄężě�· ÍňĘÂČçŇâ
˛˝˛˝¸ßÉý ˛ĆÔ´ąă˝ř
ÁúÂíľ«Éń ЦżÚłŁżŞ
´şŔ´ÔËת »¨żŞ¸»ąó
ËłĐÄČçŇâ ĐÄĎëĘÂłÉ
°Ůłß¸ÍÍ· ¸ü˝řŇ»˛˝

Wish everybody a Happy Lunar New Year

Peaceful and smooth sailing in all your plans

Progressing to a higher level 

More Prosperity

High spirit like that of dragon and horse

Always smiling,always joyful

Spring heralds good fortune

Flowers bloom with prosperity

Everything goes according to your wishes

Step by step closer to your dreams

Dr.Dennis Chua

President

Hanmudo Association Singapore

Hi all and be blessed.

I believe that you all know that Ki's development can be so in many
different ways but all of them are sure Developer only if done
diligently in the type of exercises that is being trained.

Does any one comment on this and give any of your exercises, explaining
what you know about how to do it correctly to control our Ki and if
there are any risks and what advices do you give to avoid this problem?

Muchas gracias por compartir.

HAP

Ramon Navarro
SabomNim de HapKiDo
Song Moo Kwan HapKiDo
Panama Ciudad de Panama

Dear Members,

Happy New Year to you!

Wish you Happiness, Good Health and Great Wealth!

God Bless!

Cheers,
Daniel

Hi Everyone!

Cheers to Hapkido!

The following websites have been updated, Do check it out!

1) www.hapkidojeetkunedo.com
Lost of things updated, check the News page too! Also the pictures and
videos!

2) www.hapkidokr.org
Layout/Design of website, Gallery Updated.

Cheers,
Daniel

Hi Dorren,

Check out the following websites:

1) www.hapkidokr.org
2) www.hapkidojeetkunedo.com

Both are Hapkido Schools in Singapore.

Where do you learn judo from?

Cheers,
Daniel

--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, Doreen Yeo
<lifesux_1987@y...> wrote:
>
> hi, i'm learning judo now but i'm also interested in
> other martial arts, i want to learn another new
> martial art but this year is my a levels. so i was
> thinking maybe i'll learn one after my a levels. can
> you tell where are the courses held?
>
> __________________________________________________
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>

Ba Fang Wushu Training Centre will be organising a 2 days seminar on
BaGua Zhang - Combat Applications. ʵս°ËŘÔŐĆ - ɢĘֺͶÔÁ·

The seminar will be conducted by famous Cheng Style Bagua Zhang
grandmaster: Sun Zhijun who at 72 years old, is one of the oldest
living BaGua grandmaster from the fourth generation lineage. GM Sun
is widely regarded in China as the authoritative figure in Cheng
Style Ba Gua Zhang and he hold a Wushu 8th dan (Chinese Wushu
Association). GM Sun is also the advisor to the Beijing BaGua Zhang
Research Association.

GM Sun will be assisted by his 2 senior disciples: Master Ge ChunYan
and Master Wang DeMin. Both are former China National Bagua Zhang
Champion. Master Wang is also a former China National Hsing Yi Quan
champion.

Date:
17 Dec (Sat) and 18 Dec (Sun)
2pm to 6pm

Venue:
HomeTeanNS JOM Club House
(Formerly known as SPANS-JOM club house)
31 Ah Hood Road
17 Dec (Level 2 Multipurpose Hall)
18 Dec (Level 3 Learning Centre)

Topics Covered:
- BaGua Zhang - Combat Application (also known as BaGua Sanshou)
- Traditions, Philosophy and Techniqes
- Demonstration of various BaGua zhang routines
80% of the seminar time will be on BaGua combat drills and
application

Fee:
S$ 180 per person
Certificate of participation signed by the 3 masters will be issued
to all participants

Those who wish to register for the seminar can call Mdm Ge at HP:
90253887 or register at:

Dong Lian Shu Dian Supplies (Bras Basah Complex, #02-03)
Tel: 6 3371760

More information available at www.mamaster.com

Hi,

Just to let everyone know, Korea Hapkido Federation has changed its
website address from www.hapkidokorea.org to www.daehanhapkido.org.

Do check out Master Low's Website too, www.hapkidojeetkunedo.com, lots
of information has been published with some videos updated too.

You guys can also check out www.jinpalhapkido.com, nice
history,pictures and videos. This is Grandmaster Jin Pal,9th dan
Hapkido, he is a pioneer in Hapkido who has lots of experience and
solid skills.

Cheers!

Daniel

Hi Dr. Chua,

Maybe You like to change the font colour from yellow to something
darker? Can't see very clear.

Thanks!
Daniel

--- In hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com, "Dennis Chua"
<hbchua@p...> wrote:
>
> Marine Corps GazetteHere's a good article on  why Koreans are good
in martial arts.It's more than technique.It is martial spirit.
> The writer of this article also took some information from
Grandmaster He-Young Kimm's research on Taekwondo to place into his
article below.
> Notes no.3. He Young Kimm, "General Choi Hong Hi: A Tae Kwon Do
History Lesson," Tae Kwon Do Times, January 2000,
>
> In Hanmudo Founder Dr.He-Young Kimm's research, early Korean
ancestors migrated from the cold Central Asia,crossed the Altai
mountain in northern asia down into the Korean peninsula,where the
climate was warmer.They had to fight their way thru.Even when they
settled in the Korean peniinsula,they had to ward off both Chinese
and Japanese invasion.Today, South Korea technically is in a state
of war with the North.That's why they still have a martial spirit
for survival.
> Here's an interesting account of the modern Korean warrior in
Vietnam.See below.
> Grandmaster Dr. Kimm  ,himself a lieutenant in the Korean
Marines ,taught the 8th US Army in Korea in the 1950's.He told me
warfare martial art is different.Taking a brick to crack an enemies
skull is good Hapkido in the army!
>
> Before we get too carried away with the sporting aspects of
martial arts, we should not forget that martial art training is to
develop a good martial spirit to see us through life's challenges.
>
> Here's a  snippet from the article
> "The role of martial arts training in the battle has been a topic
of discussion for nearly four decades. At the press conference
following the battle, Capt Jung was adamant in his opinion that tae
kwon do contributed greatly to the combat abilities and fighting
spirit of the Korean Marines, both enlisted and officers.24 In a
graphic description, Time noted that martial arts training was
critical to the victory:
>
>
>   It was knife to knife and hand-to-hand-and in that sort of
fighting the Koreans, with their deadly tae kwon do (a form of
karate), are unbeatable. When the action stopped shortly after dawn,
104 enemy bodies lay within the wire, many of them eviscerated or
brained.25"
>
>   Asked to provide their opinions for this article, both Taeguk
Medal recipients stated that martial arts training significantly
contributed to the Marines' victory. LtCol Jung, now retired and
living in Seoul, emphasized two areas in which tae kwon do
influenced his Marines:
>
>
>     First, the enemy suddenly overwhelmed our trenches and
continuously piled up to the degree that we were unable to use
rifles and bayonets as weapons. There were many instances in which
we were pushing and pulling each other inside the trenches. At that
time, Tae Kwon Do became the Korean Marines' weapon and by hitting
the enemy in his vital parts, we brought him under our control.
>
>
>     Second, it can be seen that the courage to be unafraid when
facing your enemy was trained through Tae Kwon Do. Although we
didn't have a path of retreat and had to stay in our position, the
fortitude to fight bravely while exposed to the enemy led to victory
at the Battle of Tra Binh Dong.26
>
>
>   Retired MajGen Shin Won Bae, who later commanded the Blue Dragon
unit (now the 2d ROK Marine Division) provided similar insights,
noting:
>
>
>     Even though tactics call for fixing bayonets to rifles during
close quarters to neutralize the enemy, our weapon at the time, the
M-1 rifle, was not a weapon that could be wielded quickly. In urgent
situations, the Marine in the front would fiercely strike the
enemy's face and vital parts using Tae Kwon Do, causing him to
momentarily lose his will to fight. Then a second Marine would
finish off the enemy with the rifle. Additionally, striking the
enemy with an entrenching tool was highly effective in destroying
the will to fight among the enemy's lead elements. While Tae Kwon Do
demonstrated its practical effectiveness on the battlefield, more
importantly, martial arts training instilled the confidence to
defeat the enemy in each Marine. I think this is the greater
significance of Tae Kwon Do training.27
>
>
>
>    Regards
>   DrChua
>   Hanmudo Assn Singapore
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>       The Battle of Tra Binh Dong and the Korean Origins of the
U.S. Marine Corps Martial Arts Program
>
>       by LtCol James F. Durand
>
>         Lasting impressions of Korean Marines' martial arts skills
led to the establishment of the MCMAP.
>
>
>       In establishing the Marine Corps Martial Arts Program
(MCMAP), Gen James L. Jones frequently recounted his observations of
Korean Marines during the Vietnam War. The fact that Republic of
Korea (ROK) servicemen were skilled in the Korean martial art tae
kwon do was widely known, evoking respect among allies and
instilling fear in the enemy. The former Commandant recalled that
his own Marines envied this skill, believing the Korean Marines were
the most feared adversary on the battlefield and that North
Vietnamese soldiers and Viet Cong irregulars would bypass Korean
units whenever possible.
>
>
>       Despite a long and rich martial arts history, the Korean
martial arts program was in its relative infancy at the time of the
Vietnam War; tae kwon do had yet to achieve its current status as a
national pastime or an international sport. Nonetheless, tae kwon do
was a martial art in the truest sense of the word, developed by a
soldier to enhance the fighting abilities of his soldiers. By the
time the first servicemen deployed to Vietnam, all branches of the
Korean military had implemented martial arts training programs.
Moreover, it was in Vietnam that the value of martial arts training
in combat operations was conclusively demonstrated. Accordingly, the
history of tae kwon do in the Korean Armed Forces provides valuable
insight to American Marines as the MCMAP enters its fifth year.
>
>
>
>             Overhead view of Tra Binh Dong.
>             Photo courtesy of the ROKMC Headquarters.
>       MG Choi Hong Hi-The Father of Tae Kwon Do
>       Although Koreans had practiced martial arts for centuries,
using both indigenous arts and styles borrowed from Japan and China,
Korea's martial artists faced serious challenges during the Japanese
occupation. Fearing the consequences of a populace skilled in
martial arts, the Japanese Colonial Government banned the teaching
and practice of martial arts in Korea in 1909.1 Despite the ban,
Koreans continued to learn tae kyon, karate, or kenjo through secret
instruction or service in the Japanese military. Army GEN Choi Hong
Hi followed both paths and, in the process, developed a new art that
would forever change military training and international sport.2
>
>
>       As a boy, Choi's father sent him to study calligraphy and
Chinese classics in hopes that his son might earn a living carving
tombstones. From his calligraphy teacher, he secretly learned tae
kyun, Korea's indigenous martial art that emphasizes fighting with
one's feet. At age 21, Choi moved to Japan to further his education
and studied karate, earning a second- degree black belt. Conscripted
into the Japanese Army, he was sent to Korea for duty, where he and
other Korean soldiers planned to desert the Imperial Army and join
the Korean Restoration Army in order to fight the Japanese. When
Choi's plans were discovered, he was sent to prison and was within
days of being executed when the Japanese surrendered and Korea was
liberated.
>
>
>       Following his release from prison, Choi journeyed to Seoul
and was among the first group of officers to join the newly
established ROK Army. He rose through the ranks quickly and was
given several commands. At each level of command, Choi instructed
his soldiers in the techniques of unarmed combat, proving that
martial arts could be taught on a large scale. By the end of the
Korean War, Choi had become a general officer and was tasked with
forming the final division that would be created during the
conflict. The 29th Division, also known as the "Fist Division," was
unique in that all soldiers had been trained in martial arts and
were "ready to fight with or without weapons."3
>
>
>       While commanding the Fist Division, Choi advocated martial
arts training for all servicemen. GEN Choi arranged for a
demonstration for Korean President Syngman Rhee in order to secure
backing for his initiative. The President was impressed-particularly
after witnessing a master break 13 roofing tiles with a single
strike-and directed that all soldiers receive martial arts training.4
>
>
>       Despite President Rhee's endorsement, MG Choi faced many
obstacles in implementing his plans. The new program had to compete
with traditional combat skills training-marksmanship and physical
fitness training-as well as established fighting programs. The
Service academies, modeled on their American counterparts, were
teaching boxing.5 Because the 29th Division was stationed on Cheju
Island, far from the frontlines, MG Choi was never able to show the
benefits of martial arts training in combat. Consequently, many
general officers were skeptical of the alleged benefits and critical
of his activities.6
>
>
>       Even among advocates of martial arts training, there was no
consensus that the style advocated by GEN Choi was the best.
Following liberation from Japan, there had been a resurgence in the
teaching and practice of martial arts, and no less than 17 forms
existed at the time of the Korean War.7 The issue of standardizing
the forms was resolved at a meeting in April 1955 between now-MG
Choi and the leaders of each of the major styles of martial arts.
During this meeting MG Choi persuaded the other masters to adopt his
style and the Korean Tae Kwon Do Association was formed.
>
>
>       MG Choi continued to advocate martial arts training for all
servicemen. Assigned to the Army Staff in 1959, he created the
Division of Martial Arts Training and was appointed its first
director.8 In this capacity, MG Choi led demonstration teams on
visits to Taiwan and the Republic of Vietnam in 1959. South
Vietnamese military officials were so impressed with the
demonstration that they requested the Korean Government send tae
kwon do instructors to Vietnam to institute a similar program there.
Four Korean instructors taught 50 Vietnamese servicemen during 1962-
63.9
>
>
>       Political and personal rivalries threatened MG Choi's
initiatives when Army MG Park Chung Hee seized power in a coup on 16
May 1961. Park ordered the popular general into retirement and sent
him abroad as the Korean Ambassador to Malaysia in 1962. MG Choi
remained a tireless advocate of tae kwon do, sponsoring and leading
exhibitions in Malaysia and other Southeast Asian countries. He
revised the forms for tae kwon do and began writing an English
language textbook. While serving in Malaysia, Choi traveled to
Vietnam and, on the roof of his hotel, met with the Korean
instructors and taught them the new forms. He directed that his
changes be taught to soldiers in both Korea and Vietnam.
>
>
>
>             LtGen Louis W. Walt, Commanding General (CG), III MAF,
speaks with Capt Jung, Commanding Officer, 11th Company, the morning
following the battle, surrounded by BGen Kim Young Sang, CG, 2d ROK
Marine Brigade, and other senior Marines.
>             Photo courtesy of the Vietnam Veterans of Korea.
>       Tae Kwon Do in the Vietnam War
>       In response to appeals for international support, the Korean
Government dispatched 10 tae kwon do instructors and a mobile Army
surgical hospital to South Vietnam on 13 September 1964, the first
increments of Seoul's lengthy and significant commitment to the
Republic of Vietnam.10 The instructors taught South Vietnamese
servicemen from all military Services. The tae kwon do detachment
would be the longest serving unit in Vietnam-by 1973, 647 tae kwon
do instructors had served in Vietnam.11 The arrival of combat forces
in 1965 would further demonstrate the value of martial arts training
by friend and foe alike.
>
>
>       The first commander of ROK Forces Vietnam, Army LTG Jae
Myung Shin, was an early pupil of MG Choi, earning a fifth-degree
black belt.12 A devoted practitioner of tae kwon do, he practiced 30
minutes daily, and visitors were apt to find the general leading his
entire staff in martial arts training in front of his
headquarters.13 Similar activities occurred at the headquarters of
the Capital and White Horse Divisions and the Blue Dragon Brigade.
>
>
>       The knowledge of the Korean's martial arts prowess, fueled
by frequent unit-wide demonstrations, quickly spread to allies and
adversaries. Allied servicemen envied this skill, believing that the
Koreans were the most feared opponent on the battlefield. Captured
enemy documents confirmed this suspicion. Viet Cong commanders
ordered their troops to avoid contact with the Koreans "at all
costs, unless a Viet Cong victory is 100% certain."14 Should they
come into contact, the Viet Cong were advised to retreat rather than
fight.15
>
>
>       Because the Viet Cong were hesitant to engage them, the
Korean units were able to restore stability within their assigned
areas of responsibility. By 1966, 8 months after the Capital
Division arrived, the Tigers had secured the port of Qui Nhon and
Highways 1 and 19 in Binh Dinh Province, a feat that neither the
South Vietnamese nor the French had been able to accomplish in over
20 years.16 And the actions of a single company of Marines from the
Blue Dragon Brigade would make a small hamlet at Tra Binh Dong a
place that would become synonymous with Korean military and martial
arts prowess.
>
>
>       The Battle of Tra Binh Dong17
>       In early February 1967, North Vietnamese Army (NVA)
commanders took advantage of the truce following the Tet holiday to
begin preparations for a major attack. The 2d NVA Division
infiltrated into the coastal lowlands of the Quang Ngai Province.
Using elephants to transport 120mm mortars, the division assembled a
regimental-sized force composed of two battalions from the 1st and
21st Regiments and a battalion of Viet Cong guerrillas in order to
attack the city of Quang Ngai and the U.S. Marine base at Chu Lai.
Built at the direction of LtGen Victor H. Krulak, Commanding
General, Fleet Marine Forces Pacific, the base was a critical
aviation and logistics center that supported operations across the I
Corps tactical zone.18 The airbase was home to nine fixed-wing
squadrons assigned to Marine Aviation Group 12 (MAG-12) and MAG-13,
the 1st Service and 9th Engineer Support Battalions, and the 1st
Hospital Company.19
>
>
>       The 2d ROK Marine Brigade had been assigned a tactical area
of operations within the Chu Lai region since August 1966. Although
the Blue Dragons were not under the command of III Marine Amphibious
Force (III MAF), Korean and American Marines coordinated their
actions in defense of the base. The Blue Dragon Brigade was
organized around three infantry battalions supported by a composite
(105mm and 155mm) artillery battalion, heavy mortar company, an
aviation detachment, and headquarters, service, medical, and
security companies.
>
>
>       The 3d Battalion's 11th Company was assigned near the
village of Tra Binh Dong. Capt Jung Kyung Jin, a graduate of the
Korean Naval Academy's 15th Class (1961), commanded 294 Marines
positioned in a clearing atop a small hill on the outskirts of the
village. Within the 300- by 200-meter heart-shaped perimeter, the
Marines built trenches connecting their fighting positions, mortar
pits, and command posts. Barbed wire and claymore mines surrounded
the trenches, and heavy and light machineguns were interspersed
throughout the perimeter. Capt Jung's company was reinforced with a
section of 4.2-inch mortars, a communications detachment, and
supported by the brigade's 105mm and 155mm artillery batteries.
>
>
>       On 14 February 1967, at approximately 2320, an enemy force
approached the company's perimeter from the west. A Marine in the
observation post detected the movement and reported back to the 3d
Platoon. Capt Jung quickly placed the company on alert. He waited
until the platoon-sized unit closed to within 5 meters of the
company's perimeter before ordering his Marines to fire. Flares lit
up the sky, revealing one corpse tangled in the wire and the
remaining Vietnamese withdrawing to the tree line. Believing that
the objective of this attack was to test the Marines' defense, Capt
Jung immediately prepared his company for the larger attack that
would surely follow, assigning additional Marines to the listening
posts, reapportioning ammunition, checking crew-served weapons, and
reviewing fire support plans. Using the call sign "Seoul," Capt Jung
ordered his platoon commanders to remain vigilant throughout the
night.
>
>
>       At 0410, approximately 2,400 North Vietnamese soldiers began
their attack on the 11th Company with an intense barrage of mortar
and recoilless rifle fire. One battalion advanced from the
southeast, blowing whistles, beating drums, and screaming "Tai Han
ra di, ra di" (come out Koreans) as they advanced on the 1st
Platoon's position. Two minutes later, two more battalions attacked
from the north to the 3d Platoon's sector. The Marines immediately
responded with rifle and machinegun fire. Under attack from two
directions, Capt Jung ordered the weapons platoon commander to
direct fires from the company's mortars and provide a situation
report to the battalion commander, while telling the forward
observer to begin coordinating artillery support from the brigade's
105mm and 155mm batteries. Clad in a running shirt under his flak
jacket, Capt Jung moved about the company's perimeter, assessing the
situation and encouraging his Marines. Despite the intensity of
direct and indirect fire weapons and claymore mines, the North
Vietnamese continued to advance upon the company's position,
attacking in human waves.
>
>
>
>             Newspaper headlines about the battle. All major Korean
and English language papers, including the Chosun Ilbo, Dong-A Ilbo,
Seoul Shinmun, Korea Herald, and Pacific Stars and Stripes, gave
front page cover to accounts of the battle.
>             Photo courtesy of ROKMC Headquarters.
>       Rearmed and reequipped, the third wave of the assault
attacked the 3d Platoon's position and destroyed the protective wire
with Bangalore torpedoes. Led by soldiers armed with rocket
propelled grenades and flamethrowers, the North Vietnamese attempted
to infiltrate a platoon into the breach at approximately 0422. SSgt
Bae Jang Choon's 1st Squad bore the brunt of the assault. Despite a
serious wound to his right shoulder, SSgt Bae refused to abandon his
position, ordering his Marines to stand their ground and prepare for
hand-to-hand combat. The fighting shifted from rifles to grenades as
North Vietnamese commanders continued to push soldiers into the
breach. Entrenching tools, pix axes, and fists became the Marines'
weapons when the North Vietnamese entered the trenches.
>
>
>       In the face of an overwhelming and relentless enemy, the
actions of the squad were characterized by tenacity and
selflessness. PFC Kim Myoug Deok killed 10 enemy soldiers with his
automatic rifle as they crawled toward his position. Despite serious
injuries received from hand-to-hand combat, Sgt Lee Hak Won took
handgrenades in both hands, waited for the enemy to draw near, and
detonated the grenades in a suicide attack that killed himself and
four Vietnamese soldiers. PFC Lee Young Bok, who was the only member
of the squad not to have been killed or injured at this point, lured
the enemy toward his position, disappeared into a spider hole, then
released several grenades as the soldiers entered the trench,
temporarily obstructing the attack.
>
>
>       In the 1st Platoon sector, the North Vietnamese set up a
mortar firing point that was now firing upon the company command
post. 2dLt Shin Won Bae, 1st Platoon commander, immediately
assembled an assault force to destroy the mortar position, located
behind a group of rocks approximately 100 meters in front of his
platoon's position. Ordering his squad leaders to provide covering
fire, 2dLt Shin and his platoon sergeant, GySgt Kim Yong Kil, led a
fire team toward the rocks amidst constant enemy fire. When they
closed to within 20 meters of the objective, GySgt Kim threw two
handgrenades toward the hidden enemy. At the instant the grenades
exploded, the Marines moved forward, repeating this tactic until
they reached the rocks. Twenty dead soldiers surrounded the three
menacing tubes, which the Marines quickly seized and withdrew to the
platoon's position.
>
>
>       On the other side of the perimeter, the entire 3d Platoon
was engaged in hand-to-hand combat as they fought to hold their
position against the Vietnamese attack. Discovering two soldiers
attempting to take the Marines' 60mm mortars from the mortar pit,
PFC Lee Ki On struck both in the face with the butt of his pistol,
recovered the mortars, then killed the pair with a handgrenade. As
two Marines fought enemy soldiers within the confines of the 4.2-
inch mortar pit, a North Vietnamese armed with a flamethrower
advanced on the pit, spewing flames. PFCs Kim Bo Hyun and Yung Sang
Yul dashed toward the enemy under cover of friendly fire, attacked
the flamethrower with grenades in a spectacular explosion, and
seized one light machinegun.
>
>
>       The North Vietnamese attempted the same tactic against the
1st Platoon, sending soldiers armed with two flamethrowers into the
breach in the platoon's lines. 2dLt Shin and SSgt Oh Sung Hwan
dashed toward the flames. Firing machineguns and throwing
handgrenades, the two Marines killed the soldiers, seized the Soviet-
made flamethrowers, and rallied the platoon to restore the
perimeter.
>
>
>       Two hours into the attack, the Marines faced a grave
situation. The North Vietnamese continued to attack from two
directions, had breached the perimeter at both points of attack, and
now held approximately one-third of the company's position.
Believing that his position might be overrun, Capt Jung considered
calling for a napalm strike on his own position from U.S. Marine
Corps aircraft on station.20 However, the thick fog and rain made
visibility so poor that even this desperate measure was not an
option. More significantly, the ferocity of the enemy attack began
to falter in the face of the desperate resistance by the 3d Platoon
Marines. Capt Jung ordered the 2d Platoon commander to provide one
squad to 3d Platoon to assist them in their fight.
>
>
>       At 0630 1stLt Kim Se Chang, the forward observer attached to
the company, determined the likely location of the regimental
command post and began directing fires from the brigade's 105mm
howitzers against it. The Blue Dragon artillerymen responded with
devastating fires that soon crippled the enemy's ability to direct
the attack. His assistant, SSgt Kim Hyun Chul, refused to take the
binoculars from his eyes despite intense small arms fire as he
scanned the trees in search of the enemy's mortars. Locating the
enemy 61mm, 81mm, and 120mm mortars, he reported their locations to
his lieutenant who quickly passed them along to the fire direction
center. The Marine artillery quickly overwhelmed the enemy mortars.
>
>
>       Isolated from their commander and lacking fire support, the
North Vietnamese attack began to falter as casualties rapidly
mounted. Capt Jung then made what would be the critical decision of
the battle-assembling a squad-sized counterattack force from the 1st
and 2d Platoons and ordering it into the breach to isolate the North
Vietnamese soldiers within the perimeter. 1stLt Kim Ki Hong, the
weapons platoon commander, volunteered to lead the Marines in a
daring and courageous counterattack. As the 3d Platoon Marines and
North Vietnamese soldiers engaged in hand-to-hand combat in the
trenches immediately below the company's observation post, 1stLt Kim
led his squad in a double envelopment of the North Vietnamese within
the perimeter beginning at 0652. The lieutenant quickly killed five
enemy soldiers with his pistol and began pushing the enemy back into
the breach. Encouraged and emboldened by the attack, SSgt Kim Son
Kwan, the 3d Platoon platoon sergeant, led his Marines in joining
the assault, shouting and using whatever weapon was available to
strike the enemy. With the North Vietnamese surrounded by the
assault force, it was the Koreans turn to shout "ra di, ra di." The
North Vietnamese refused calls to surrender and continued a
desperate resistance, only to be shot to death by the Marines.
>
>
>       The soldiers who managed to escape the Marines linked up
with North Vietnamese support units. In order to lure the company-
sized force toward the Marine position, at 0724 Capt Jung ordered
the 3d Platoon to destroy its bunkers and withdraw to the company
observation post. 1st and 2d Platoons were directed to envelop the
attackers on order. Sensing victory, the North Vietnamese again
began to beat gongs as they advanced upon the company for a final
time. When they closed to within 80 meters, Capt Jung ordered his
Marines to fire and began coordinating fires from the brigade's
heavy mortar company. Shortly thereafter, the skies cleared and four
U.S. Marine Corps A-4 Skyhawks repeatedly attacked the remaining
Vietnamese force. Helicopters followed the attack aircraft and cut
their path of retreat.
>
>
>       At 0800, 16 helicopters carrying the 6th Company, 2d
Battalion arrived from the Blue Dragon Brigade headquarters.
Advancing outward from the protective wire, the Marine
reinforcements began clearing operations. The fleeing North
Vietnamese left the bodies of 243 soldiers behind. An additional 60
soldiers were presumed to have been killed. As a testament to the
ferocity of the battle, over 100 North Vietnamese corpses lay within
the company's perimeter, and 140 bodies lay next to the protective
wire. One of the two prisoners captured during the fighting was a
North Vietnamese battalion commander. The company also captured 3
flamethrowers, 5 antitank rocket launchers, 2 machineguns, 28
rifles, 100 pieces of dynamite, and over 6,000 rounds of ammunition.
The 11th Company lost 15 Marines during the fighting, and 33 were
injured. Following the defeat, the North Vietnamese abandoned plans
for subsequent attacks against the Chu Lai airbase and the city of
Quang Ngai.
>
>
>       News of the battle traveled throughout the country and
world. The commanding generals of III MAF and 2d ROK Marine Brigade
went to Tra Binh Dong and met with the 11th Company Marines the
morning of the battle. They were quickly followed by the commanders
of I Corps, ROK Forces Vietnam, and the U.S. Military Assistance
Command Vietnam. After being briefed on the battle, President Park
Chung Hee directed that all enlisted Marines in the 11th Company be
promoted one rank, the first unit-wide promotion since the Korean
War. He also dispatched the Prime Minister, Defense Minister, and
Marine Commandant to Vietnam. Defense Minister Kim Sung Eun-the most
storied Marine commander of the Korean War, commander of the only
other unit to be promoted en masse, and former Commandant-promoted
the Marines on behalf of the President.
>
>
>       The Korean Government awarded more decorations for the
battle of Tra Binh Dong than any other action of the Vietnam War.
Capt Jung and 2dLt Shin received the Taeguk Medal, Korea's
equivalent of the Medal of Honor; the Korean Government awarded the
medal only 11 times during the war, and Tra Binh Dong was the only
battle for which the medal was awarded to two individuals. GySgt Kim
and SSgt Bae received the Ulchi Medal, Korea's second highest award
for valor; the Chung Mu Medal, the third highest military
decoration, was awarded to 11 Marines. The 11th Company received the
U.S. and ROK Presidential Unit Citations in recognition of
their "effective teamwork, aggressive fighting spirit and many
individual acts of heroism."21
>
>
>       Accounts of the battle were carried in media throughout the
world. The New York Times reported the battle as the "South Korean's
greatest victory in their 15 months in South Vietnam."22 Following a
briefing to foreign journalists, the phrase "Myth-Making Marines"
began to appear in the press, continuing the legacy of the "Ghost-
Catching Marines" and "Invincible Marines" of the Korean War.
>
>
>
>             Surveying the aftermath of the battle. LtGen Walt and
Capt Jung view the bodies of Viet Cong and NVA soldiers killed
during the Battle of Tra Binh Dong.
>             Photo courtesy of ROKMC Headquarters.
>       Lessons Learned and Epilogue
>       The battle of Tra Binh Dong is studied by military
professionals throughout Korea, and its lessons are taught to all
Marines. The ROK Marine Corps (ROKMC) cites four factors as critical
to the 11th Company's victory: the distinguished combat leadership
of the company and platoon commanders, the hard fighting by all
Marines in the unit, the effective use of fire support, and the
boldness of the counterattack.23
>
>
>       The role of martial arts training in the battle has been a
topic of discussion for nearly four decades. At the press conference
following the battle, Capt Jung was adamant in his opinion that tae
kwon do contributed greatly to the combat abilities and fighting
spirit of the Korean Marines, both enlisted and officers.24 In a
graphic description, Time noted that martial arts training was
critical to the victory:
>
>
>         It was knife to knife and hand-to-hand-and in that sort of
fighting the Koreans, with their deadly tae kwon do (a form of
karate), are unbeatable. When the action stopped shortly after dawn,
104 enemy bodies lay within the wire, many of them eviscerated or
brained.25
>
>
>       Asked to provide their opinions for this article, both
Taeguk Medal recipients stated that martial arts training
significantly contributed to the Marines' victory. LtCol Jung, now
retired and living in Seoul, emphasized two areas in which tae kwon
do influenced his Marines:
>
>
>         First, the enemy suddenly overwhelmed our trenches and
continuously piled up to the degree that we were unable to use
rifles and bayonets as weapons. There were many instances in which
we were pushing and pulling each other inside the trenches. At that
time, Tae Kwon Do became the Korean Marines' weapon and by hitting
the enemy in his vital parts, we brought him under our control.
>
>
>         Second, it can be seen that the courage to be unafraid
when facing your enemy was trained through Tae Kwon Do. Although we
didn't have a path of retreat and had to stay in our position, the
fortitude to fight bravely while exposed to the enemy led to victory
at the Battle of Tra Binh Dong.26
>
>
>       Retired MajGen Shin Won Bae, who later commanded the Blue
Dragon unit (now the 2d ROK Marine Division) provided similar
insights, noting:
>
>
>         Even though tactics call for fixing bayonets to rifles
during close quarters to neutralize the enemy, our weapon at the
time, the M-1 rifle, was not a weapon that could be wielded quickly.
In urgent situations, the Marine in the front would fiercely strike
the enemy's face and vital parts using Tae Kwon Do, causing him to
momentarily lose his will to fight. Then a second Marine would
finish off the enemy with the rifle. Additionally, striking the
enemy with an entrenching tool was highly effective in destroying
the will to fight among the enemy's lead elements. While Tae Kwon Do
demonstrated its practical effectiveness on the battlefield, more
importantly, martial arts training instilled the confidence to
defeat the enemy in each Marine. I think this is the greater
significance of Tae Kwon Do training.27
>
>
>       Yet LtCol Jung is careful to emphasize the importance of
fire support in the battle, noting that the artillery and mortar
fires prevented the North Vietnamese from sending reinforcements to
the troops engaged with the Korean Marines.28
>
>
>       As if to underscore the strength of the ROKMC Martial Arts
Program, the Korean Marine team won the National Tae Kwon Do
Championship in November 1967, the same year as the battle of Tra
Binh Dong.29 The following year ROKMC headquarters began to include
tae kwon do with marksmanship qualification and physical fitness
testing as measures of combat readiness. (Tae kwon do is now part of
the ROKMC physical fitness test.)30 Despite the demonstrated success
of the martial arts program, both the Marine Corps and Army
continued to experiment with new styles and techniques. The Marines
developed mu chuk do, a more lethal form of tae kwon do. However,
after teaching this form throughout the Corps for several years, the
Marines reverted to tae kwon do as the standard, reserving mu chuk
do for Marines assigned to reconnaissance units.31 Similarly,
Special forces units practice tu kong moo sul, while tae kwon do
remains the standard for the ROK Army.32
>
>
>       For American Marines, the early history of the Korean
martial arts program and the battle of Tra Binh Dong provide four
important lessons. First, developing and instituting the program
took time and required the dedicated efforts of senior leaders and
commanders. It took over a decade from the first demonstrations to
the adoption of training objectives and standards. Second, because
many of the program's initial benefits were psychological, they were
difficult to measure. Indeed, it is impossible to quantify how the
confidence and fighting ability of soldiers and Marines were
improved through tae kwon do or the number of times North Vietnamese
or Viet Cong units bypassed Korean units. Third, martial arts
training proved critical in close combat. The ability of the Korean
Marines to prevail against overwhelming odds in hand-to-hand
fighting in the battle of Tra Binh Dong is a testament to the
benefits of tae kwon do training. Lastly, martial arts training is
one of many necessary combat skills. Timely and accurate fire
support, exceptional combat leadership, and countless individual
acts of courage all contributed to the 11th Company's victory.
>
>
>       Fifty years after MG Choi began to advocate martial arts
training for Korean soldiers, tae kwon do has grown far beyond its
military roots. It is the national martial art of Korea, practiced
by millions throughout the world, and has been an Olympic medal
sport since 2000. In turn, the growth of tae kwon do as a sport has
further strengthened the Korean military's martial arts program.
Most men entering the military have already received significant
training in some form of martial arts. Because of its focus on
developing the physical skills, combative fitness, and mental
discipline for combat, it is unlikely that the MCMAP will spur a
similar revolution in sport. However, the MCMAP has been an
unqualified success in improving the fighting abilities and warrior
ethos of all Marines. Commenting on its applicability to today's
conflicts, GEN Shin notes, "For the U.S. Marine Corps, which will
encounter battlefields in various countries in the war against
terrorism, Tae Kwon Do training on a regular basis is advisable."33
Whether at bases in their home countries or deployed overseas,
American and Korean Marines continue to train in martial arts,
working to uphold the ideal that Marines are the most respected and
feared adversary on the battlefield.
>
>
>       Notes
>
>
>       1. In order to meet military training requirements, the
Japanese Government lifted the ban on martial arts training,
teaching Koreans judo and juken-jutsu (bayonet art) in 1941 and
karate and kung fu in 1943. Dakin Burdick, "People and Events of
T'aekwondo's Formative Years," Journal of Asian Martial Arts, Volume
6, Issue 1, 1997, pp. 30-49, updated and available online in two
parts at http://www.indiana.edu/~iutkd/history/tkdhist.html and "A
History of Taekwondo," copyright 1990, available online at
http://www.indiana.edu/~iutkd/history/dbhistor.html.
>
>
>       2. All names follow the convention of listing the surname
first with the exception of President Syngman Rhee, whose popular
usage dictates otherwise.
>
>
>       3. He Young Kimm, "General Choi Hong Hi: A Tae Kwon Do
History Lesson," Tae Kwon Do Times, January 2000,
>       p. 48.
>
>
>       4. Burdick, "People and Events of T'aekwondo's Formative
Years," Part 1, p. 7.
>
>
>       5. Hae Gun Sa Gwan Hak Kyo (Republic of Korea Naval
Academy), Dae Han Min Gook Hae Gun Sa Gwan Hak Kyo 50 Nyun Sa (1946-
1996) (The Fifty Year History of the Republic of Korea Naval Academy
(1946-1996)). Chinhae: ROK Naval Academy, 1996, p. 21. Translations
of this and subsequent Korean sources are by the author.
>
>
>       6. Kimm, p. 49.
>
>
>       7. Dohrenwend, R.E., "Informal History of Chung Do Kwan Tae
Kwon Do," available online at
https://www.sos.mtu.edu/husky/tkdhist.htm.
>
>
>       8. Burdick, "A History of Taekwondo," p. 2.
>
>
>       9. Kimm, p. 53.
>
>
>       10. LTG Larsen, Stanley R. and BG James. L Collins, Jr.,
USA, Allied Participation in Vietnam, U.S. Government Printing
Office, 1975, pp. 121-2.
>
>
>       11. Kimm, p. 53.
>
>
>       12. Kimm, p. 51.
>
>
>       13. "South Viet Nam: Other Guns," Time, 22 July 1966, p. 26.
>
>
>       14. Ibid.
>
>
>       15. Kimm, p. 53.
>
>
>       16. Time, July 22, 1966, p. 26.
>
>
>       17. Unless otherwise noted, accounts of the battle are taken
from Tra Binh Dong Chon Tu (ROKMC Won (sic) Great Triumph at Tra
Binh Dong), http://www.vietvet.co.kr. This is the most readable
account of the battle and accurately reflects the events of the
battle contained in the official ROKMC historical accounts.
>
>
>       18. Summers, Jr., COL Harry G., Vietnam War Almanac, Facts
on File Publications, New York, 1985, p. 119.
>
>
>       19. Tefler, Maj Gary L., LtCol Lane Rogers, and V. Keith
Fleming, Jr., U.S. Marines in Vietnam: Fighting the North
Vietnamese, 1967, History and Museums Division, Headquarters, U.S.
Marine Corps, Washington, DC, 1984, p. 6.
>
>
>       20. Personal letter from LtCol Jung Kyung Jin, ROKMC(Ret) to
the author, dated 29 April 2004.
>
>
>       21. United States Presidential Unit Citation presented to
the 11th Company (Reinforced), 3d Battalion, 2d Republic of Korea
Marine Brigade, 28 May 1968.
>
>
>       22. "Koreans Kill 242 in Vietnam Clash," The New York Times,
16 February 1967, p. 3.
>
>
>       23. Hae Byung Dae Sa Ryoung Bu (ROKMC Headquarters). Hae
Byung Dae Won Haeng Dong Chi Chim Seo (Guidebook for Marines), ROKMC
Headquarters, Seoul, Korea, 1996, p. 29.
>
>
>       24. LtCol Jung letter.
>
>
>       25. "A Savage Week," Time, 24 February 1967, p. 25.
>
>
>       26. LtCol Jung letter.
>
>
>       27. Undated personal letter from MajGen Shin Won Bae, ROKMC
(Ret), received May 2004.
>
>
>       28. LtCol Jung letter.
>
>
>       29. Don Su Choi, Hae Byung Sa (Marine Corps History), Do Seo
Publishing, Seoul, Korea, 1994, p. 64.
>
>
>       30. The Marine Education Base, which oversaw initial
training for officers, staff noncommissioned officers, and enlisted
Marines, initially established an objective of 85 percent of Marines
earning the highest tae kwon do certification. Hae Byung Dae Sa
Ryoung Bu (ROKMC Headquarters), Hae Byung Sa Jae 6 Jip (Marine Corps
History, Volume 6. 1 January 1968 to 31 December 1969), ROKMC
Headquarters, Seoul, Korea, 1971, p. 461.
>
>
>       31. Mu chuk do, the invincible way, takes its name from the
phrase mu chuk hae byung, given to the Marines by President Syngman
Rhee in recognition of their actions at the battle of Mount Do Sol
during the Korean War.
>
>
>       32. Johty, Ben, "The Best of the Best: Korean MacGyvers,"
The Korea Herald, 7 July 2001, pp. 6-7.
>
>
>       33. MG Shin letter.
>
>
>       >LtCol Durand is an intelligence officer and East Asia
foreign area officer. He served 5 years in Korea, including
assignments with the Special U.S. Liaison Advisor, Korea; Commander,
U.S. Marine Corps Forces Korea; and the ROK Naval War College. He is
currently a student at Japan's National Institute for Defense
Studies.
>
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For those of you in the West Texas-Southern New Mexico area, check out
Yoon's Martial Arts Academy. This is the only certified Korean Royal
Court Hapkido Academy in the U.S. They also offer classes in Kick
Boxing, Tai Chi Chuan, Northern Kung Fu, Northern Kick Boxing, Shaolin
Long Fist, Shaolin Chin Na, Tibetian White Crane Kung Fu, Tang Soo Do,
Soo Bahk Do, Moo Duk Kwan (original Karate, Tae Kwon Do), Yu Sul
(Judo), Kum Sool Do (Sword), Bong Sool Do (Weapon), Tai Chi Ch'uan
(Classical), and Pa Qua Ch'ang.

----- Original Message -----

From: bull_156

To: hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 11:10 AM

Subject: [Hapkido Flying Eagle] Re: Tournaments?

I wonder if there are any tournaments for Hapkido?

I wonder if there are any tournaments for Hapkido?