----- Original Message -----
From: "Guillaume Williams" <revhardheaded@...>
To: <HanMuDo@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 7:47 PM
Subject: Re: [HanMuDo] ] Re: Ultimate Martial Art? The true nature of mixed
martial arts


>I would not think of HMD as a MMA although it is a sum
> of what Dr. Kimm knows and transmits to us. It
> certainly is not just sport, not just kicking and
> punching with grappling added in. There does need to
> be some freestyle sparring so people can learning
> timing and what might not work for them when an
> opponent resist but this is up to the teacher how and
> when this occurs in class and certainly it does happen
> in all schools I would hope.
>
> If anyone ever watched Erle Montaigue, one would never
> think that TaiChi is just for retiring masters trying
> to keep healthy.
>
> While some Traditional MA schools may seem packaged to
> pass from one generation to the next if they are truly
> traditional I cannot see how good fighters would not
> be produced there. There are some or rather plenty of
> McDonald style schools out there which simply pass on
> knowledge without true skill, mass marketing
> blackbelts, but I think even a good ma could still be
> produced there if the individual applie themselves.
>
> At the end of the day though the saying is still true,
> there are no superior ma just superior martial artist.
>
> Guillaume
>
> --- Dennis Chua <hbchua@...> wrote:
>
>> Here's an intersting article from an MMA pratitioner
>> in reply to the article Hal submitted.(below)
>> Any feedback for discussion.?
>>
>> here's one -a personal opinion on looking from a
>> different perspective.
>>
>> I think the reason why there are so many
>> disagreements between traditional and MMA is the
>> different emphasis that MMA and traditional places.
>> Traditional martial arts focus a specific skill eg.
>> mainly kicking and punching with a few take down and
>> few grappling techs or grappling ,throwing with a
>> few kicks and strikes.Their focus if base on
>> traditional Asian martial art background is
>> personal character buildng as well as loyalty to
>> the group or clan (Budo) and respect for
>> teachers,using martial art as a tool.Their emphasis
>> is martial art philosophy in daily living ,not so
>> much as winning matches. They have a proven system
>> in sense of good organization and easy to transmit
>> this "package' for repeated generations.
>> Since every body can only commit a certain amount of
>> time for training, it is quite a challenge to learn
>> and be good at everything. MMA tries to be good at
>> everything, but even then ,certain players will
>> place empasis on techniques they like.The core is
>> grappling.
>> MMA interest startted from BJJ.If you look up BJJ
>> history, it arise because of questioning the
>> rationale of certain traditional pratice and techs
>> for practicality.Hence emphasis is to win to prove
>> this point.Of course they have philosophies attached
>> to it, but it is not so deep rooted as compared to
>> asian traditional martal art philosophy with its
>> long history on living in a society. Traditional
>> asian martial art arise from political situation of
>> their time. ( This is my personal opinion.I believe
>> MMA practitioners will argue on this).
>>
>> The challenge for MMA's future is this.Can they
>> transmit to later generations successfully?
>> Traditional martial arts with a good deep rooted
>> philosophy and organisational skills have proven to
>> transmit to several generations down.And majority of
>> people prefer philosophy in living ,and martial art
>> as an added insurance if need arises, rather than
>> being in the ring. Majority just need certain skill
>> to defend fast and get out fast in a situation.
>> They cannot afford to be full time gladiators. They
>> have to work.
>>
>> A good example is Taekwondo.MMA practitioners can
>> argue it has many weaknesses, but why is it the
>> world's most popular martial art today? Why is the
>> world's army still use TKD as the core martial art?
>> Another is Aikido. It is still using traditional
>> fighting techs,that one can argue in today's context
>> is not so practical.But why is it so popular among
>> the elite in society?
>> Taichi is known as "utimate boxing" . "Ultimate" not
>> to win matches .but to win the match of
>> life.-longevity. Martial art grandmasters of hard
>> styles still end up learning some form of taichi
>> later in their life.
>> The challenge for MMA to be able to pass down to
>> many generation is this.Does it have a deep sense of
>> philosophy to attract the masses? Does it have a
>> uniformity to easily transmit to the masses.It is
>> difficult,because it is "mixed".Different
>> instructors emphasise differently, and are trained
>> differently.
>>
>> So the question is akin to what you want in life.Do
>> you want to train an art for a certain period of
>> your life or thoughout your life .- eg a fast
>> sports car , a family saloon car or an all terrain
>> SUV (Sports utility Vehicle). It's good to train
>> MMA as an adjunct to your core art .But you need to
>> faithfully stick to your core art to give you
>> direction in your life. If not,after learning "all
>> the secrets of the world" you become empty and
>> frustrated.
>> As for me,the ultimate martial art is the one that
>> lets me win the "Match of life".
>> "What does it profit a man if he gains the whole
>> world but loses his own soul"-a Bible quote.
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Kaiyi
>> To: hapkidoflyingeagle@yahoogroups.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 10:49 PM
>> Subject: [Hapkido Flying Eagle] Re: Ultimate Martial
>> Art? The true nature of mixed martial arts
>>
>>
>>
>> SELF DEFENSE AND MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>>
>> http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=mma
>>
>> the criticism of Mixed Martial Arts in the article
>> is way off the mark.
>>
>> If you truly want to learn self-defense, learn from
>> police officers &
>> soldiers. Learn the psychology of criminals. Because
>> a skilled
>> criminal will NOT give you the chance to defend
>> yourself. He 'll walk
>> up to you in the dark and stab in the back. Self
>> defense is about
>> knowing how to identify bad situations (drunk gang
>> members, dark
>> alleys) and avoid them or worse come to worse you
>> talk your way out.
>>
>> No mixed martial artist would ever claim to be able
>> to fight 10 men,
>> nor does any sensei who claims to be able to
>> demonstrate so. If
>> someone has a knife, most genuine self defense
>> experts will recommend
>> you run or pick up a chair to batter your opponent.
>>
>> The argument for learning Mixed Martials Arts as an
>> aid to
>> self-defense is this: If you are confronted and
>> assualted by a clumsy
>> thug or drunk who is unarmed, then what you learn on
>> the mat & in the
>> ring is highly applicable because you fight against
>> a parter who is
>> 100% uncooperative and that creates an experience as
>> close as possible
>> to a real fight in which your assailant will also be
>> 100%
>> uncooperative. In many streets fights 1 or more
>> parties often fall to
>> the ground. Much of mixed martial arts involves
>> escaping pins by
>> opponents WHO CAN STRIKE YOU FROM THE TOP WITH
>> ELBOWS, KNEES AND FISTS!
>>
>> This is in contrast to many traditional arts where u
>> learn patterns
>> which have no resemblance to most human reactions in
>> a fight.
>>
>> Randori is what gives you some real fighting
>> ability. It gives you the
>> timing you will need in a real fight. Will you ever
>> use it? Prob
>> never. Will it work? maybe not. which brings us a
>> point of agreement.
>>
>> ~Select a martial art that brings you joy. Mixed
>> martial arts should
>> not be pursued simply because you view it as the
>> means to being a
>> great fighter. For many mixed martial artistes,
>> mixed martial arts is
>> a healthy pursuit for training the mind and body, a
>> challenge. The
>> same way one challenges oneself by playing chess. I
>> love playing
>> chess. And who knows one day i may give up mma to
>> play chess? Unlikely
>> but possible!
>>
>> Having said that, proof that mixed martial arts is
>> generally healthy
>> can be found in Pride & UFC. Although there are a
>> few bad apples like
>> Ricardo Arona and Ken Shamrock and Royce Gracie who
>> are rude towards
>> opponents, many opponents actually train together at
>> one pt or another
>> - helping each other improve! And look what happens
>> at the end of many
>> fights: the fighters embrace without malice and chi
>> chat. And they say
>> " lets train together sometime"
>>
>> Can you imagine Rudd Van Nisterooy telling that to
>> Patrick Viera?
>>
>>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> THE TRUE NATURE OF MIXED MARTIAL ARTS:
>>
>> Donny who? For me the author of this article should
>> make up his mind;
>> 1st he attempts to discredit wrestling (which is a
>> large part of mixed
>> martial arts) and then proceeds to say the
>> Traditionalists can't
>>
> === message truncated ===
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
> To have a friend subscribe, have then send an
> email to HanMuDo-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>