This may help some of you to better understand what transpired
during the actual game (between Texas and Texas A&M) causing this
unusual occurrence.

The second half started with Texas trailing A&M 13-6.  A&M received
the second half kick and went three and out, facing fourth and two
at their 28 yard line.

A&M attempted to punt on fourth down, but the kick was blocked and
returned for a TD.

Texas attempted a PAT following the TD.

The normal holder, a WR, was injured during the first half and did
not return to the game.  The backup holder was unable to setup the
ball correctly following the snap from center.  As a result the
Kicker muffed the kick, kicking it into the back of a Texas
lineman.

Most assumed the play was now dead.

An A&M lineman finally recovered the ball on the field of play and
attempted to return it to score two (2) points for A&M.  However,
the ball was knocked out of his hands and into the Texas End Zone.
An A&M player fell on the ball in the End Zone.

The ruling was that the PAT kick was muffed, but became a two-point
conversion attempt when the A&M player picked up the ball on the
field of play and attempted to return it.  By fumbling a live ball
and having an A&M player fall on it in the End Zone, it was ruled a
one point safety.  One point is all a safety is allowed on a PAT.

Adding to the confusion following the play, the scorekeeper gave the
point initially to A&M, reflecting a 14-12 A&M lead.  The one point
safety was later removed from A&M and given to Texas, making the
score 13-13.

Nothing aided our understanding at the game.  Watching a replay
later, Lynn Swan, the Sideline Reporter for ABC, explained it all to
the announcers in the booth… and the rest of America as well.

I do not expect to ever see this one again, live or on TV.

Hope this helps some sort out what lead up to this unusual play and
how it came to be called by the officiating crew.

Now about that darn BCS…

RE: IC !  So, what was the final score!
--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "cougisbcs" <cougisgood@h...>
wrote:
>
>
> cainbryan wrote:
> > RE: I didn't see the game. So, Texas fumbles into the A&M end-
zone
> > on a try for a 2pt conversion, A&M recovers, so A&M got 1 point?
>
> No, Texas was attepting the field goal for one point.  The holder
> never got the ball set, but the kicker took the kick anyway.  The
> ball hardly left the ground and appeared to have hit the Texas
long
> snapper in the foot before coming to rest at about the two-yard
> line.  An A&M player then picked up the ball, thus establishing
> possession for A&M.  He then tried to advance the ball, but wound
up
> getting tackled for no gain.  However, the officials ruled that
the
> A&M player fumbled the ball before he was down.  The ball rolled
> into the A&M endzone where another A&M player fell down on it,
thus
> giving Texas a one-point safety.  If a Texas player had picked up
> the ball and fumbled it into the endzone, an A&M recovery would
have
> simply killed the play, because Texas would have still had
> possession of the ball before it crossed the goal line.

No.  It was a safety.  Texas got the point.

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "cainbryan" <cainbryan@y...> wrote:
>
>
> RE: I didn't see the game. So, Texas fumbles into the A&M end-zone
> on a try for a 2pt conversion, A&M recovers, so A&M got 1 point?
>
> --- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Kislanko" <kislanko@a...>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > --- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "John Martin" <jmartin@f...>
> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > For example, if Texas had been trying for 2 and fumbled the ball
> > into the end zone where A&M recovers, the play is ruled dead (it
> would
> > be a touchback if it was not during the PAT).  In this example,
> Texas
> > initiated the momentum which carried the ball into the end zone.
> >
> > The refs ruled that an A&M player had possession of the ball on
the
> > field of play (I didn't see that, but wasn't looking for it). In
> that
> > case the try for point is over, and it no longer matters who
caused
> > the impetus into the end zone - it becomes an ordinary fumble in
> A&M's
> > "try for a 2-point conversion".
> >
> > Had Texas recovered in the end zone they'd have scored 2, since
A&M
> > did it was the 1-point safety.

cainbryan wrote:
> RE: I didn't see the game. So, Texas fumbles into the A&M end-zone
> on a try for a 2pt conversion, A&M recovers, so A&M got 1 point?

No, Texas was attepting the field goal for one point.  The holder
never got the ball set, but the kicker took the kick anyway.  The
ball hardly left the ground and appeared to have hit the Texas long
snapper in the foot before coming to rest at about the two-yard
line.  An A&M player then picked up the ball, thus establishing
possession for A&M.  He then tried to advance the ball, but wound up
getting tackled for no gain.  However, the officials ruled that the
A&M player fumbled the ball before he was down.  The ball rolled
into the A&M endzone where another A&M player fell down on it, thus
giving Texas a one-point safety.  If a Texas player had picked up
the ball and fumbled it into the endzone, an A&M recovery would have
simply killed the play, because Texas would have still had
possession of the ball before it crossed the goal line.

RE: Hey, I'm as shocked as you are! When I saw the big mudbath pep
rally at OSU the night before, I said " Yeah and now OSU goes out
tomorrow and gets stomped!"

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, Mark Stang <stangm@y...> wrote:
>
>
> --- Michael Stehlin <mjstehlin@m...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Congrats to OSU..they beat us...they deserve the credit for
that, no
> > excuses. But needless to say  the morning after the game they
wake up
> > and no matter who won,  they are still OSU and we are still
Michigan.
>
> Thank God.
>
>
> > And I would not trade that FOR ANYTHING. Class and dignity have
never
> > been part of the OSU experience.
>
> Yeah, Our lates Heisman Trophy winners are Archie Griffin, and
Eddie
> George.  Yours?  Charles Woodson and Desmond Howard.
>
>
> >Again congrats for the win on the
> > field but OSU represents all that is wrong in this world. Low
class
> > or no class at best. Then lie about it LOL
>
> Ed Martin.  Michigan is for sale to the highest bidder.  When OSU
has a
> scandal (like the Mo C. scandal)  they own up, invite the NCAA in,
and
> run a lengthy internal investigation.  Michigan stonewalls and
hides
> things.  When our basketball coach admits to helping a player, we
fire
> him.  Michigan keeps Fischer around until the press gets so bad
they
> have to fire them.
>
> But if there is one thing that Michigan does that exempts them from
> ever looking down on any other college, it is the creation of a
> separate area of collegiate studies for athletes, Kinesiology.  A
> department that is so crappy, that credits won't transfer if they
> change majors!  This is the only department singled out for this
> restriction:
>
> See for yourself:
>
http://www.bus.umich.edu/Admissions/Bba/Curriculum/TransferCredits.ht
m
>
> "The University of Michigan Business School will grant degree
credit
> for no more than two (2) courses from the Division of Kinesiology"
>
> Note that they will accept up to 75 credit hours from any other
> program.
>
> Also note this from an article from the Chicago Tribune, 1993:
>
> At Michigan, sports management is housed in the Division of
> Kinesiology. The division has two other
> majors: kinesiology (the study of physical movement) and physical
> education.
>
> The division houses only about 600 of Michigan's 22,000
undergraduate
> students, and sports management
> has an enrollment of 250 students.
>
> The department doesn't have exact numbers, but it estimates that 50
> percent of the incoming freshman are
> athletes.
>
> Many of them are football players. Of the 19 football recruits in
1990,
> 14 were enrolled in the Division of
> Kinesiology, 11 of 19 in 1991; information wasn't available for
1992.
> Only 1 of 5 players from Michigan's
> highly acclaimed "Fab Five" recruiting class of 1991 went into the
> program. But in that same year, 7 of 9
> baseball recruits were enrolled.
>
> Technically, students are enrolled in the Division of Kinesiology
until
> their junior year, when they have to
> declare a major. Some transfer out of the program, but many stay
in.
> Estimates have athletes making up
> between 30 to 40 percent of sports management's enrollment.
>
> Says one faculty member: "Our classes are overflowing (with
athletes)."
>
>
> <snip>
>
> However, sports management still lacks respect among Michigan's
> faculty. Said one former faculty
> member of Michigan's athletic board: "I think it's slosh. It's not
> academically demanding."
>
> Michigan's biggest school, Literature, Science and the Arts,
doesn't
> accept transfer credits from sports
> managment. Gene Nissen, a Dean in LSA, says past prejudices against
> sports management have helped
> shape the current policy.
> ---------------
>
> Say what you want about Ohio State, but at least we don't create
> special majors for jocks.  Michigan has a great academic
reputation,
> but it creates special ghettos for their athletes.  And their past
> transgressions gives them little right to act superior in any other
> facet.
>
>
> PS. Do you spell Carr's first name with three "L"s now?
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

RE: I didn't see the game. So, Texas fumbles into the A&M end-zone
on a try for a 2pt conversion, A&M recovers, so A&M got 1 point?

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Kislanko" <kislanko@a...>
wrote:
>
>
> --- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "John Martin" <jmartin@f...>
wrote:
>
> >
> > For example, if Texas had been trying for 2 and fumbled the ball
> into the end zone where A&M recovers, the play is ruled dead (it
would
> be a touchback if it was not during the PAT).  In this example,
Texas
> initiated the momentum which carried the ball into the end zone.
>
> The refs ruled that an A&M player had possession of the ball on the
> field of play (I didn't see that, but wasn't looking for it). In
that
> case the try for point is over, and it no longer matters who caused
> the impetus into the end zone - it becomes an ordinary fumble in
A&M's
> "try for a 2-point conversion".
>
> Had Texas recovered in the end zone they'd have scored 2, since A&M
> did it was the 1-point safety.

I'm not sure Texas wouldn't pass Cal.  It's entirely possible that Texas
moves pas OU and Auburn in the computers (Auburn for sure, OU less
definite), but that neither fall behind Cal.



   _____

From: P Andrew Cabiness [mailto:cabiness42@...]
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 5:40 PM
To: collegebcs@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [collegebcs] Re: What if the unthinkable happens?





I don't know for sure, but I would guess that if both Oklahoma and
Auburn lose (and USC doesn't), Cal would move up to #2 and then Cal
would play USC in the Orange Bowl.  Also, I would think that Utah
would stay in the Top 6 in the BCS which would guarantee tham a BCS
bowl, which would mean that Oklahoma and Auburn would not only be
out of the Orange Bowl but out of the BCS entirely.

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "David Hawkins" <daga78@y...>
wrote:
>
>
> What if both Oklahoma and Auburn lose in the champions games, this
> weekend.  I know it is a long shot but weird things have happened
> before.  Who then would play in the national chapionship game.
> Something else USC also plays this weekend again rival UCLA.  This
> will be the weekend of the year. With all BCS major teams playing
> this weekend.
> David
> Charlotte, NC











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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I don't know for sure, but I would guess that if both Oklahoma and
Auburn lose (and USC doesn't), Cal would move up to #2 and then Cal
would play USC in the Orange Bowl.  Also, I would think that Utah
would stay in the Top 6 in the BCS which would guarantee tham a BCS
bowl, which would mean that Oklahoma and Auburn would not only be
out of the Orange Bowl but out of the BCS entirely.

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "David Hawkins" <daga78@y...>
wrote:
>
>
> What if both Oklahoma and Auburn lose in the champions games, this
> weekend.  I know it is a long shot but weird things have happened
> before.  Who then would play in the national chapionship game.
> Something else USC also plays this weekend again rival UCLA.  This
> will be the weekend of the year. With all BCS major teams playing
> this weekend.
> David
> Charlotte, NC

I think the real interesting part of the equation is:  how far would
Oklahoma or Auburn fall if they lose.  If they are still ranked ahead
of Cal and Texas, they would get the automatic bid, since they would
not be conference champs, and both Cal and Texas would be left out.

If USC and another team loses, the question becomes whether Cal jumps
USC, even though they lost to USC, or USC still gets the Orange Bowl bid.

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "Hugh Wolfgang" <hughwolfgang@v...>
wrote:
>
>
> All of the teams play just about every weekend.  This weekend isn't
any different, except that some teams other than those three have
completed the regular season.
>
> If all of them lose, or two of the three lose, or none of them lose,
or one of them loses, the same thing will happen: the top two teams in
the final BCS rankings will play in the Orange Bowl.
>
> >What if both Oklahoma and Auburn lose in the champions games, this
>weekend.  I know it is a long shot but weird things have happened
> >before.  Who then would play in the national chapionship game.
> >Something else USC also plays this weekend again rival UCLA.  This
> >will be the weekend of the year. With all BCS major teams playing
> >this weekend.
>
>
> ---
> [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude/F-Prot Virus]

All of the teams play just about every weekend.  This weekend isn't any
different, except that some teams other than those three have completed the
regular season.

If all of them lose, or two of the three lose, or none of them lose, or one of
them loses, the same thing will happen: the top two teams in the final BCS
rankings will play in the Orange Bowl.

>What if both Oklahoma and Auburn lose in the champions games, this >weekend.  I
know it is a long shot but weird things have happened
>before.  Who then would play in the national chapionship game. 
>Something else USC also plays this weekend again rival UCLA.  This
>will be the weekend of the year. With all BCS major teams playing
>this weekend.


---
[This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude/F-Prot Virus]

What if both Oklahoma and Auburn lose in the champions games, this
weekend.  I know it is a long shot but weird things have happened
before.  Who then would play in the national chapionship game.
Something else USC also plays this weekend again rival UCLA.  This
will be the weekend of the year. With all BCS major teams playing
this weekend.
David
Charlotte, NC

--- Michael Stehlin <mjstehlin@...> wrote:

>
>
> Congrats to OSU..they beat us...they deserve the credit for that, no
> excuses. But needless to say  the morning after the game they wake up
> and no matter who won,  they are still OSU and we are still Michigan.

Thank God.


> And I would not trade that FOR ANYTHING. Class and dignity have never
> been part of the OSU experience.

Yeah, Our lates Heisman Trophy winners are Archie Griffin, and Eddie
George.  Yours?  Charles Woodson and Desmond Howard.


>Again congrats for the win on the
> field but OSU represents all that is wrong in this world. Low class
> or no class at best. Then lie about it LOL

Ed Martin.  Michigan is for sale to the highest bidder.  When OSU has a
scandal (like the Mo C. scandal)  they own up, invite the NCAA in, and
run a lengthy internal investigation.  Michigan stonewalls and hides
things.  When our basketball coach admits to helping a player, we fire
him.  Michigan keeps Fischer around until the press gets so bad they
have to fire them.

But if there is one thing that Michigan does that exempts them from
ever looking down on any other college, it is the creation of a
separate area of collegiate studies for athletes, Kinesiology.  A
department that is so crappy, that credits won't transfer if they
change majors!  This is the only department singled out for this
restriction:

See for yourself:
http://www.bus.umich.edu/Admissions/Bba/Curriculum/TransferCredits.htm

"The University of Michigan Business School will grant degree credit
for no more than two (2) courses from the Division of Kinesiology"

Note that they will accept up to 75 credit hours from any other
program.

Also note this from an article from the Chicago Tribune, 1993:

At Michigan, sports management is housed in the Division of
Kinesiology. The division has two other
majors: kinesiology (the study of physical movement) and physical
education.

The division houses only about 600 of Michigan's 22,000 undergraduate
students, and sports management
has an enrollment of 250 students.

The department doesn't have exact numbers, but it estimates that 50
percent of the incoming freshman are
athletes.

Many of them are football players. Of the 19 football recruits in 1990,
14 were enrolled in the Division of
Kinesiology, 11 of 19 in 1991; information wasn't available for 1992.
Only 1 of 5 players from Michigan's
highly acclaimed "Fab Five" recruiting class of 1991 went into the
program. But in that same year, 7 of 9
baseball recruits were enrolled.

Technically, students are enrolled in the Division of Kinesiology until
their junior year, when they have to
declare a major. Some transfer out of the program, but many stay in.
Estimates have athletes making up
between 30 to 40 percent of sports management's enrollment.

Says one faculty member: "Our classes are overflowing (with athletes)."


<snip>

However, sports management still lacks respect among Michigan's
faculty. Said one former faculty
member of Michigan's athletic board: "I think it's slosh. It's not
academically demanding."

Michigan's biggest school, Literature, Science and the Arts, doesn't
accept transfer credits from sports
managment. Gene Nissen, a Dean in LSA, says past prejudices against
sports management have helped
shape the current policy.
---------------

Say what you want about Ohio State, but at least we don't create
special majors for jocks.  Michigan has a great academic reputation,
but it creates special ghettos for their athletes.  And their past
transgressions gives them little right to act superior in any other
facet.


PS. Do you spell Carr's first name with three "L"s now?




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

--- cainbryan <cainbryan@...> wrote:

>
>
>
> RE: it's all true. I'm in Cleveland , and we have much more in
> common with the lower peninsula of MI

Yeah, Cleveland and Detroit do have a lot in common.





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Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "John Martin" <jmartin@f...> wrote:

>
> For example, if Texas had been trying for 2 and fumbled the ball
into the end zone where A&M recovers, the play is ruled dead (it would
be a touchback if it was not during the PAT).  In this example, Texas
initiated the momentum which carried the ball into the end zone.

The refs ruled that an A&M player had possession of the ball on the
field of play (I didn't see that, but wasn't looking for it). In that
case the try for point is over, and it no longer matters who caused
the impetus into the end zone - it becomes an ordinary fumble in A&M's
"try for a 2-point conversion".

Had Texas recovered in the end zone they'd have scored 2, since A&M
did it was the 1-point safety.

The big question is who initiated the momentum into the end zone.  In order for
the play to be ruled a one point safety, A&M would have had to have caused the
momentum which brought the ball into the end zone.  I never saw that in the
replays and as such I think the call was incorrect.

For example, if Texas had been trying for 2 and fumbled the ball into the end
zone where A&M recovers, the play is ruled dead (it would be a touchback if it
was not during the PAT).  In this example, Texas initiated the momentum which
carried the ball into the end zone.

John Martin
   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Paul Kislanko
   To: collegebcs@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:24 AM
   Subject: [collegebcs] Re: What is a one-point safety?




   --- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "cougisbcs" <cougisgood@h...> wrote:>
   >
   > A question to everyone: what does the rulebook have to say about the
   > kicker kicking the ball into his own teammates as opposed to the
   > ball actually being blocked by an opponent?  The announcers of the
   > UT/A&M game were saying that this should result in a dead ball.  I
   > think they may be wrong, but so far I have yet to find any sort of
   > explanation of this in the rulebook.

   I haven't found a rule that covers placement kicks, but I think the
   announcer was incorrect. As long as the ball has not crossed the line
   of scrimmage after the kick, the offense can recover and advance it
   (or even punt it through the uprights for the 1 point score).

   The announcer would've been right if the contact with the offensive
   player had been across the line of scrimmage, but the o-lineman was
   clearly backing up.







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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "Bert Sanders" <sand7117@b...> wrote:
>
>
> That is a common misperception.  Bama did not pull out of the game to
> avoid a tough game.  They wanted an extra home game this year.  Two
> year's without bowl revenue apparently hurt the athletic budget.

Correct. They had to pay for those trips to Hawaii somehow :)

That is a common misperception.  Bama did not pull out of the game to
avoid a tough game.  They wanted an extra home game this year.  Two
year's without bowl revenue apparently hurt the athletic budget.



--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, Trader Kevin <cbot_kevin@y...> wrote:
>
> Bert Sanders
>
> >> I heard that Alabama had the inside track at
> getting this bid if Nebraska falls short. <<
>
> Speaking of the Tide, how dumb is the Bama football
> braintrust that they postponed their home-and-home
> with Penn State this year and next? They would've had
> a great chance of beating PSU this year, then would've
> had them at home in 2005. Instead they ducked out and
> replaced Penn State with Utah State.
>
> Alabama and Penn State will instead play a
> home-and-home in 2013 and 2014. Perhaps this
> postponment had nothing to do with Alabama avoiding a
> game while they were weak from probation scholarship
> sanctions. Maybe they just wanted to be part of
> JoePa's farewell tour.  :)
>
> Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "cougisbcs" <cougisgood@h...> wrote:>
>
> A question to everyone: what does the rulebook have to say about the
> kicker kicking the ball into his own teammates as opposed to the
> ball actually being blocked by an opponent?  The announcers of the
> UT/A&M game were saying that this should result in a dead ball.  I
> think they may be wrong, but so far I have yet to find any sort of
> explanation of this in the rulebook.

I haven't found a rule that covers placement kicks, but I think the
announcer was incorrect. As long as the ball has not crossed the line
of scrimmage after the kick, the offense can recover and advance it
(or even punt it through the uprights for the 1 point score).

The announcer would've been right if the contact with the offensive
player had been across the line of scrimmage, but the o-lineman was
clearly backing up.

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "cougisbcs" <cougisgood@h...>
wrote:
> RE: Sounds like kicking the ball into the back of the offense's
front line would seem a fairly reasonable scenario. I have seen 2-
point conversions run back the distance, but usually in high school
and college play, the  intercepting defender falls down or takes a
knee intentionally, ending the play.
>
> cainbryan wrote:
> > RE: So you're saying, if the offense fumbles the ball backwards
98
> > yards , but falls on it in the end zone, it's a one-point
safety.
> > But if the extra point is blocked ,intercepted, recovered, etc.
> > and
> > run back the distance by defense is it one point, or does it
> > depend
> > on the type of conversion attempted?
>
> There are three ways to score points in football.  Touchdowns,
field
> goals and safeties.  In the normal field of play, these are worth
> six points, three points, and two points respectively.  Once a
> touchdown is scored, the team that scored it(we'll call them team
A)
> has the option of kicking a field goal for one point, or running a
> play for a touchdown worth two points.  This is commonly known as
> the PAT, or play after touchdown.  If on this play team B can
> somehow create a turnover, or recover a blocked field goal, and
> return the ball for a touchdown, team B will recieve two points.
> Also, on this play, if team A, as you described, manages to fumble
> the ball backwards the entire length of the field, and were to


> finally fall on it in their own endzone, team B is awarded a one-
> point safety.  Team A can also score a one-point safety much like
> Texas did against A&M.  Another good example would be this: after
> team A losses possession of the ball to team B, if the player on
> team B who has the ball runs back into his own endzone and gets
> tackled, one point to team A.  In summary, touchdowns during the
PAT
> are worth two points, field goals during the PAT are worth one,
and
> safeties during the PAT are worth one.
>
>
> A question to everyone: what does the rulebook have to say about
the
> kicker kicking the ball into his own teammates as opposed to the
> ball actually being blocked by an opponent?  The announcers of the
> UT/A&M game were saying that this should result in a dead ball.  I
> think they may be wrong, but so far I have yet to find any sort of
> explanation of this in the rulebook.

>>So you're saying, if the offense fumbles the ball
backwards 98 yards , but falls on it in the end zone,
it's a one-point safety. But if the extra point is
blocked ,intercepted, recovered, etc. and run back the
distance by defense is it one point, or does it depend
on the type of conversion attempted? <<

A safety on an extra point, by either team, is worth
one point. A kicked extra point is worth one point. A
"touchdown" on the conversion, by either team, is
worth two points.

Hope this helps.

Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin





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cainbryan wrote:
> RE: So you're saying, if the offense fumbles the ball backwards 98
> yards , but falls on it in the end zone, it's a one-point safety.
> But if the extra point is blocked ,intercepted, recovered, etc.
> and
> run back the distance by defense is it one point, or does it
> depend
> on the type of conversion attempted?

There are three ways to score points in football.  Touchdowns, field
goals and safeties.  In the normal field of play, these are worth
six points, three points, and two points respectively.  Once a
touchdown is scored, the team that scored it(we'll call them team A)
has the option of kicking a field goal for one point, or running a
play for a touchdown worth two points.  This is commonly known as
the PAT, or play after touchdown.  If on this play team B can
somehow create a turnover, or recover a blocked field goal, and
return the ball for a touchdown, team B will recieve two points.
Also, on this play, if team A, as you described, manages to fumble
the ball backwards the entire length of the field, and were to
finally fall on it in their own endzone, team B is awarded a one-
point safety.  Team A can also score a one-point safety much like
Texas did against A&M.  Another good example would be this: after
team A losses possession of the ball to team B, if the player on
team B who has the ball runs back into his own endzone and gets
tackled, one point to team A.  In summary, touchdowns during the PAT
are worth two points, field goals during the PAT are worth one, and
safeties during the PAT are worth one.


A question to everyone: what does the rulebook have to say about the
kicker kicking the ball into his own teammates as opposed to the
ball actually being blocked by an opponent?  The announcers of the
UT/A&M game were saying that this should result in a dead ball.  I
think they may be wrong, but so far I have yet to find any sort of
explanation of this in the rulebook.

RE: So you're saying, if the offense fumbles the ball backwards 98
yards , but falls on it in the end zone, it's a one-point safety.
But if the extra point is blocked ,intercepted, recovered, etc. and
run back the distance by defense is it one point, or does it depend
on the type of conversion attempted?
--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Preda
<swimmingstar_1991@y...> wrote:
>
> It was a safety during an extra point. So they can be
> given only 1 point.
> --- Trader Kevin <cbot_kevin@y...> wrote:
>
> >
> > omn:
> >
> > >> A newbie question: I know of two-point safety.
> > What
> > is one-point safety? <<
> >
> > It's the rarest of all scoring plays, a safety on an
> > extra point. It's so rare most of us (including
> > Texas
> > coach Mack Brown) didn't know it existed.
> >
> > NCAA Football Rulebook: http://tinyurl.com/6gwhl
> >
> > Hope this helps.
> >
> > Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile
> > phone.
> > http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
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> All your favorites on one personal page – Try My Yahoo!
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The play isn't dead until it's dead, so the guy running it out of the
endzone was taking a foolish risk.  If the interception alone would end the
game, the ref would blow the whistle.



   _____

From: cainbryan [mailto:cainbryan@...]
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 11:10 AM
To: collegebcs@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [collegebcs] ISU - Mizzou game





When the game ended in OT With Mizzou's end zone interception, the
announcer said it was meaningless that the defender ran it out
because the game ended with the interception, but is that really
true? What if the defender fumbled it as he ran out of the end-zone,
with ISU scooping it back up and running it in? Is the ball dead the
moment the defender intercepted? I am NOT a fan of overtime, except
for playoff games.











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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

When the game ended in OT With Mizzou's end zone interception, the
announcer said it was meaningless that the defender ran it out
because the game ended with the interception, but is that really
true? What if the defender fumbled it as he ran out of the end-zone,
with ISU scooping it back up and running it in? Is the ball dead the
moment the defender intercepted? I am NOT a fan of overtime, except
for playoff games.

It was a safety during an extra point. So they can be
given only 1 point.
--- Trader Kevin <cbot_kevin@...> wrote:

>
> omn:
>
> >> A newbie question: I know of two-point safety.
> What
> is one-point safety? <<
>
> It's the rarest of all scoring plays, a safety on an
> extra point. It's so rare most of us (including
> Texas
> coach Mack Brown) didn't know it existed.
>
> NCAA Football Rulebook: http://tinyurl.com/6gwhl
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile
> phone.
> http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo
>
>
>
>




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omn:

>> A newbie question: I know of two-point safety. What
is one-point safety? <<

It's the rarest of all scoring plays, a safety on an
extra point. It's so rare most of us (including Texas
coach Mack Brown) didn't know it existed.

NCAA Football Rulebook: http://tinyurl.com/6gwhl

Hope this helps.

Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin





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Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
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Hi collegebcs,

   A newbie question: I know of two-point safety. What is one-point
   safety?


--
Best regards,
  omn                          mailto:mnman@...
  Kajang, Malaysia

RE; None of that, really.just in favor of the Bucks!
--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, Trader Kevin <cbot_kevin@y...>
wrote:
>
> cainbryan:
>
> >> RE: I figure they can use bomb-sniffing dogs
> whenever or not they want to. After all, if they do
> that EVERY game(even every MICHIGAN game) at one of
> ONLY two locations , it puts security at security risk
> as well! <<
>
> Please explain this sentence: "...it puts security at
> security risk as well!" I have no idea what you're
> trying to say.
>
> >> Also, it clears the Wolverine coach and players of
> any wrongdoing/terrorism that may occur AFTER they've
> been checked in , even if it seems offensive at the
> moment of scrutiny.. <<
>
> Of the 100,000+ folks at the game, who are among the
> LEAST likely to be terrorists? The players and
> coaches.
>
> Don't tell me, let me guess--you're also in favor of
> random searches at the airport (like little old ladies
> in wheelchairs) instead of profiling likely
> terrorists.
>
> The noses on bomb-sniffing dogs are ridiculously
> sensitive. They stand in the middle of our train
> platform as folks walk past. You can avoid them by ten
> feet if you want.
>
> They don't need to stick their nose in your crotch to
> know whether or not you have a bomb. If that is indeed
> what UM was subjected to, then it was little more than
> a low-class attempt to disrupt a tightly scripted
> pre-game routine. I have no love for Michigan, but
> this isn't right.
>
> Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> All your favorites on one personal page – Try My Yahoo!
> http://my.yahoo.com

--- In collegebcs@yahoogroups.com, "huskysd" <huskysd@y...> wrote:
> Cal vs Utah in the Fiesta with BC vs ACC champ in the Sugar?

BC won't be there :-)

Alan

cainbryan:

>> RE: I figure they can use bomb-sniffing dogs
whenever or not they want to. After all, if they do
that EVERY game(even every MICHIGAN game) at one of
ONLY two locations , it puts security at security risk
as well! <<

Please explain this sentence: "...it puts security at
security risk as well!" I have no idea what you're
trying to say.

>> Also, it clears the Wolverine coach and players of
any wrongdoing/terrorism that may occur AFTER they've
been checked in , even if it seems offensive at the
moment of scrutiny.. <<

Of the 100,000+ folks at the game, who are among the
LEAST likely to be terrorists? The players and
coaches.

Don't tell me, let me guess--you're also in favor of
random searches at the airport (like little old ladies
in wheelchairs) instead of profiling likely
terrorists.

The noses on bomb-sniffing dogs are ridiculously
sensitive. They stand in the middle of our train
platform as folks walk past. You can avoid them by ten
feet if you want.

They don't need to stick their nose in your crotch to
know whether or not you have a bomb. If that is indeed
what UM was subjected to, then it was little more than
a low-class attempt to disrupt a tightly scripted
pre-game routine. I have no love for Michigan, but
this isn't right.

Penn State Proud, Trader Kevin





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