> Kenneth O'Brien responded to the ollowing question: "So, as a
> bicyclist I can't advocate for an added standard lane?"
>
> Ken's reply: "As part of a bicyclist advocacy organization I would
> support - no."
>
> That's fine, Ken, go your own way with your own organization.
Here's what I plan to do instead:
As bicyclist advocacy groups form and think about forming,
I will continue to explain the importance of focusing
bicycling advocacy efforts and why I believe that is the
best path forward. Hopefully that will help direct and focus the
efforts, and get bicyclist advocates to drop making
alienating, extraneous efforts part of bicyclist advocacy
efforts.
> You
> demands are more than we care to obey.
There are myriad places people who believe as you do about
the larger transportation issues can take and advocate your
beliefs.
There are myriad places people who want to see this or that
specific roadway widened can take their advocacy for that.
If it is the mainstream view, you have no problem. Your efforts
in those myriad other places and organizations will carry
the day.
These efforts do not have to be part of bicyclist advocacy. There will
be a number of benefits - both practical and philosophical - that will
fall from not making them part of bicyclist advocacy.
Perhaps you can't handle not making your extraneous beliefs
about macro-transportation policy issues part of every single
effort you are involved in, but I hope to find more and more people
open to the practicality - and even benefit - of focusing
bicyclist advocacy, and avoiding extraneous issues that alienate
potential allies and broad support for the important
targeted issues of "act and treat" type advocacy.
Kenneth O'Brien responded to the ollowing question: "So, as a bicyclist I can't advocate for an added standard lane?" Ken's reply: "As part of a bicyclist...
... Here's what I plan to do instead: As bicyclist advocacy groups form and think about forming, I will continue to explain the importance of focusing ...
... Since you say you will "continue," perhaps you could show us what you have done. I would love to see literature you have published, people who have joined...
... I don't have a website for advocacy issues. Because the 'mainstream' is as it is there is no advocacy organization at this time in which I can be an active...
... Perhaps you should start one. ... Perhaps you should start one. I am striking out on my own locally, but I have found several organizations to which I...
... Attended . ... I don't know. ... You can study the Portland Press Herald archives. I've had something on order of 10 published on bicycling issues over the...
KOB repeats his insistence that vehicular-cycling advocacy must contain nothing beyond the traffic movements of vehicular cycling upon all public roads. In his...
... That does not describe the part of your beliefs, or anybody else's, associated with vehicle bicycling on roadways. I was making the comment about the wide...
Don't be coy, KOB. I didn't consider that you wanted me out of the group, only that I send elsewhere considerations other than traffic movements on roadways in...
... You should check Ken's postings on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bicyclingadvocacy/ That is a list with a very anti-motoring slant and Ken goes after them...
bob.bayn@...
Nov 1, 2007 10:22 pm
Because Bob Bayn suggested that I do so, I have read the relevant parts of the bicyclingadvocacy yahoo group for the last year. Yes, Ken writes to that list....
... I am willing to not make this discussion any part of my official efforts within a targeted bicyclist advocacy group. ... That is one of my reasons for...
At 08:10 PM 11/1/2007, Kenneth O'Brien offered his concessions: "I am willing to not make this discussion any part of my official efforts within a targeted...
... I didn't see an answer to my question in the above. The question was whether _you_ would be willing to drop, as part of official efforts within a bicyclist...
At 09:28 AM 11/2/2007, Kenneth O'Brien wrote: "I didn't see an answer to my question in the above. "The question was whether _you_ would be willing to drop, as...
John Forester wrote: <Cut for brevity> ... I find this conclusion worrying. I am a transportation and recreational road cyclist who rides in a vehicular style...
I think that discussion along the lines suggested by Andy Morris's letter is necessary and useful for vehicular cyclists. Andy admits that he is of two minds...
... You follow this with a long involved detailed discussion that is (1) not useful or necessary for vehicular cyclist advocacy. (2) objectionable to a very...
The only reason that Ken provides for deliberately ignoring the urban environment in which we live and cycle, and which we should be hoping to shape to our...
... No. I don't know how you can even begin to claim that. I could introduce you to a long list of people who would be amazed anybody would consider me...
... I'll take that as a compliment, thanks ... I don't know if you would count where I live as a suburb, its a village in post industrial West Yorkshire, UK...
... (1) Because organizations are built one person at a time. (2) Because you are John Forester and your knowledge and reputation would be a great thing to...
... I will give you a few names of people who have macro transportation views far from yours (and you label "anti-motoring"), and you can check if they think I...
The posting that I have just made demonstrates the falsity of KOB's claims for his avoidance of "extraneous views on macro-transportation issues." He...
... Note my point has been: what people are and are not willing to drop while working in official capacity for a bicyclist advocacy organization... I have not...
... I'm sure KOB will disagree with this characterization - not because it is wrong, but because that's what he does. ... I agree, although I would add that...
... I recognize and accept the rule that when I am appreciably preventing the flow of traffic I pull over - when safe - to let it through. For the tens of...
I'm getting a little tired of this line of argument. I am somewhat in Kenneth O'Brien's camp - I, too, primarily advocate locally by attending meetings and...
Good to hear from you Peter, partly because the work you describe is important, but mostly because you don't pontificate ad nauseum. I certainly don't expect...
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