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Bad ideas running rampant   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #7010 of 7486 |
Re: [bigtenvb] Bad ideas running rampant

So if you honestly want to add "an intensity level and excitement that has been missing from our games", I'd suggest going back to the old scoring method.  Reall, from my perspective, it lost a lot of that when it went to rally scoring.
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Matt Leach
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 12:13 PM
Subject: [bigtenvb] Bad ideas running rampant

Just goes to show you what a committee can do if they really put
their heart into it. Who was asking for these changes and why? Can't
they just leave the game alone for a while?

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/ncaa?ContentID=162613

The NCAA Women's Volleyball Rules Committee proposed a scoring format
that will change the winning score for games one through four from 30
points to 25 points, which will be more consistent with national and
international match formats.

All rules change proposals must be approved by the NCAA Playing Rules
Oversight Panel (PROP), which will review all recommendations at its
next meeting February 27. The 25-point format is used in all rule
codes, including the National Federation of State High Schools. The
fifth set, if necessary, will still be to 15 points.

"The 25-point sets will add an intensity and excitement level to our
matches that has been missing," said Marcia Alterman, the committee's
secretary-rules editor. "I believe that players, coaches and fans
will agree that the critical nature of every point will emphasize the
need for focus and consistency to every play."

In addition, the committee recommended changing the term game to set
and reducing substitutions from 15 to 12, primarily because of the
change to 25-point sets. The format for media timeouts will remain
the same.

Additionally, a new ball handling directive, which guides officials
to be less severe when judging second team contacts, was proposed.
The committee envisions that this directive will not only increase
consistency in officiating calls, but also assist the growth of the
game by no longer punishing extraordinary and highly athletic plays.

"There has been a demand for more consistency regarding the referees'
ball handling decisions for several years across all divisions as
well as regions of the country," said Kerry Carr, chair of the
committee and head women's volleyball coach at the University of
Pennsylvania. "I think the game will benefit from a decrease in the
whistles that stop a rally due to a marginal infraction on ball
handling, especially when there's been a great athletic attempt to
keep the ball alive."

The committee, comprised of Divisions I, II and III coaches and
administrators, gave the topic of event management and facility
expectations serious consideration. After much discussion, the group
recommended adding preferred facility specifications to the NCAA
WOMEN'S VOLLEYBALL RULES AND INTERPRETATIONS. In addition, Rule 1.1
was changed to state that all playable areas must be visible to team
members and officials.

The committee also reviewed various types of net systems available,
which are becoming more diverse, as manufacturers seek alternatives
for facilities that cannot accommodate the traditional sleeve system.
The committee will continue to research minimal net and pole
requirements that maintain the integrity of the game while providing
choices for various facilities.

As technology continues to impact volleyball, the committee is
monitoring methods used to gather data during a match and broadcast
matches to the public. The committee began discussions on the use of
instant replay and its impact on volleyball.

A recommendation from the NCAA Division I Women's Volleyball
Committee was reviewed to amend Rule 18 to include an option for
relocating the first referee to the bench side of the net for the
NCAA championships. ESPN has made this request to enhance the
television production of the championship. No action was taken on the
request at this time, but continued research and consideration are
planned in the near future.

The volleyball rules book was slated to move to a two-year cycle
starting with the 2009 publication. The committee is forwarding a
request to PROP to start its two-year cycle with the 2010 book. This
will provide a better cycle to consider those rule changes made by
Federation of International Volleyball (FIVB) after the 2008 Beijing
Olympics.






Thu Feb 7, 2008 7:20 pm

kwelle602
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Message #7010 of 7486 |
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Just goes to show you what a committee can do if they really put their heart into it. Who was asking for these changes and why? Can't they just leave the game...
Matt Leach
mfleach55108
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Feb 7, 2008
7:13 pm

So if you honestly want to add "an intensity level and excitement that has been missing from our games", I'd suggest going back to the old scoring method....
Ken Welle
kwelle602
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Feb 7, 2008
7:21 pm

These propositions come from the NCAA coaches. My guess is that they want to see the rules become closer to each other. No, they can't leave the rules alone....
Roger Ozima
roger_o1
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Feb 7, 2008
8:17 pm

Hey, Kate Price managed to not worry about the "rule" and dove into the crowd for a save as did the setter for one of the other visiting teams the night...
Daryl Hoffman
shuttlecmd
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Feb 7, 2008
8:45 pm

Just like LPs and phones tied to the wall by a cord, side-out scoring dates you. We were playing pickup the other night and my crowd of 20 somethings to 50...
Chris Palma
cpalma@...
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Feb 7, 2008
9:58 pm

... This is a silly statement, because they said exactly the same thing when rally to 30 was instituted. I don't have a problem with this change (as they note,...
Bruce Kvam
brucekvam
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Feb 7, 2008
10:13 pm

... What it will do is make matches 15-30 minutes shorter, and ... One could argue - but it won't be me - that it will make _game_ upsets more prevalent, which...
Matt Leach
mfleach55108
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Feb 7, 2008
10:38 pm

Reducing the victory total to 25 (instead of 30) will indeed have a small but measureable effect - it's been studied via VBSIM - on upsets both at the set and...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Feb 7, 2008
11:13 pm

I don't think the scoring system should or shouldn't be counted on to make the game exciting or not. It is the teams that make the games exciting. PSU /...
Chris Palma
cpalma@...
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Feb 7, 2008
10:38 pm

Do you see baseball deciding to make their games more exciting Yes, we have seen baseball deciding to make their games more 'exciting' - they arbitrarily put...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Feb 7, 2008
11:25 pm

Subs are handled when R1 is on the bench side via a 'bench' referee, i.e. a third referee whose only duty is to control the benches, much as the R2 would...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Feb 7, 2008
11:19 pm

... The NCAA wants to set up the officials as they do for the Men's Final Four matches with a third referee sitting down by the first referee to take care of...
Roger Ozima
roger_o1
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Feb 7, 2008
11:41 pm

... There is a certain degree of truth to this, but volleyball doesn't have the same kind of pop culture status that basketball has. I would guess a much...
Bruce Kvam
brucekvam
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Feb 8, 2008
4:45 pm

Apparently, these rule changes are now official. Once again, the fans of the game are shown just how unimportant we are. I'm really tired of this. Time to find...
Matt Leach
mfleach55108
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Feb 29, 2008
2:42 am

Maybe it's time to do something about it -- I'm sure it will be ultimately futile, but I'd sign a petition or write a letter to the governing bodies to say...
Chris Palma
cpalma@...
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Feb 29, 2008
3:31 am

There are no doubt many different viewpoints, but I don't think anyone would vote for less volleyball. Except, that is, the people who get to make the...
Peter Morris
moxbib
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Feb 29, 2008
2:28 pm

One important thing that has been mentioned is that exciting volleyball matches come from good teams playing another. Penn St vs Albany is not going to be...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
2:41 pm

If the format is RPS-30, and there is a 'mercy rule' that says 25-15 (or worse) is considered victory, VBSIM shows it prevents 1 comeback to victory every 843...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
2:53 pm

... (or ... Did you also include 26 - 16, 27 - 17, 28 - 18, and 29 - 19? These would all qualify, as well. However, they are less likely comebacks than 25 -...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
3:16 pm

Pablo, I did not include 10-point deltas beyond 25, no. When I do, it takes the number down to 702. This was between two evenly matched teams; I simulated...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
4:03 pm

... it ... matches, ... matches, ... match has ... While ... How do you get 4 comebacks? The Big Ten season is 110 matches, and at 4.25 games, that would be...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
4:13 pm

Sorry Pablo, thinking faster than typing, meant to say NCAA season, not Big Ten season. Changing to 51-49 sends the number way up - 1 in roughly 3,000. ...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
4:17 pm

... not ... Ok, so tell me 50.5 I can assess the functional form. I see this as affecting maybe 3 - 4 sets per year in all of college volleyball....
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
4:30 pm

50.5-49.5 is 1 in 1,275 From: bigtenvb@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bigtenvb@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pablo Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 10:30 AM To:...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
4:31 pm

... So that's < 3.5/year on average in D1, and < 3.8 on average in D3. Now here's the question we haven't asked: how much will it shorten the sets? How often...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
4:37 pm

1/700 in which a team has the 10-point lead From: bigtenvb@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bigtenvb@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pablo Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
4:40 pm

... So how often does that happen (the team gets a 10 point lead) between teams of equal strength? If it occurs in 1/4 sets, then we are down to 1 set comeback...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
5:04 pm

Between teams at equal strength in women's D-I, the 10-point lead with 5 or less to victory, i.e. 25-15 or beyond, not before (e.g. a 10-0 or 15-5 lead) occurs...
Peglar, Robert
peglarr56a
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Mar 3, 2008
5:17 pm

... with 5 ... ratio ... 71 ... That's a function of side out percentage, I guess, right? If such a lead only happens in 1/32 sets, and the comeback only ...
Pablo
pgwenthold
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Mar 3, 2008
7:55 pm

If the game is called because of point separation who loses? Fans? Subs?? Is it really that boring to sit through another 5 or 10 points? Weren't we just...
rosejelly@...
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Mar 3, 2008
3:21 pm
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