I gotta start this by saying in all honesty. As beautiful as the day turned
out, I sure would rather it had been 40 degrees and pouring down rain. That
would mean poor Jim Forman and the mobile King 5 crew would be standing in a
blizzard on Snoqualmie Pass commenting about the soccer mom in her Excursion
thinking it would be safe to take the kids to play in the snow as the tow
trauck hauls it out of the snowbank in the backround.
Yeah, hard to get excited about biking when it should be snow season...

But, excited I am! Excited, tired, and beat to a pulp too. What a way to end
my daylight riding season.

Jeff and Armando met at the house and we carpooled out of the fog and to the
roadside pull out before Black Diamond to an awaiting Lisa, Kelly, Mark,
Mike, and Jason.
It has been brought to my attention that this may not be the best place to
park to ride. It offers very limited parking and is right on a very busy Hwy
169. However, it does offer immediate access to the newer "Blainz World"
trail network. I believe, although it takes a bit longer, it's probably a
better idea to park at the Lake Sawyer Elementary school on the other(West)
side of the network and ride in from there. There were 14 cars packed into
this very small site on this sunny fall day. Only 2 at Tiger summit when we
drove by both ways. Hmmmmmm.

Lisa and Mark took the reins and led us through an amazing southend system.
It is evident that the builders put lots of long term care into designing and
  building this network. Often compared to Tolt-MacDonald park. The trail
system here would definately be compared as all Tolt could be. Low spots and
soft areas are cobbled and offer drainage. Smooth, fast, tight and twisty,
with loads of angled trees and headhunters to offer added technical
challenge. Fast, but technical and solid. this section shows why it's
increasing in popularity.
  Off the ridge line into the the older, second growth area and  towards the
lake itself. We swung around the west side in a clockwise manner. taking a
side trip so Kelly could show is the new sport of "Freecross" despite the
disadvantages of wheelie dropping in a cross bike. Hmmm, wonder if you could
put a Marzocchi Monster T on that RM Rail?

Across the clearcut and into "Ed's Woods" the grandaddy of tree farm trails.
Smooth and dry for this time of year. Around to the RR grade and heading back
towards the car on well maintained trail. One last climb up to the cars and a
huge apology to a now bonking Jason for the Bob version of "Social" pace.

We were out 4 hours at a good pace and there was more to be had. This is
truly a Southend gem and would be frequented more often by yours truly had it
not been an hour drive away. Both Jeff and Armando, first timers here,
commented that this place would be hammered from use if it was closer to
Seattle. It's that good. The builders and maintainers should be commended.

As we bid trailend adieu, Armando pops up with, "Let's Ride the Ridge on the
way home! It's on the way and we have some daylight!"
Oh well, let's do it!
So, we drag Mike Utterback along with us and add another 2 hours plus of
riding(and, falling, in my case) to an already long day.
Climbing out of the car at "Snowbalmy Ridge" to a 55 degrees in the shade
temp. We rode until too tired to stand.
Nothing a hot shower, a couple Aleves washed down with Rolling Rock won't
cure. But,  I can forget about the sympathy neck massage.

Thanks all to capping an amazing season. Mine's over. Time to go outside to
hang the Christmas lights...

Bob


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Did you get pictures from Franklin of the Fort Eby ride?  If not, let me know
and
I will forward them.  Dave

Green River Ride report

Well 11 hardy souls showed up for the Green River Epic.  It was another
beautiful
sunny, cold day.  We headed down a logging road through the forest.  When we
turned off to start riding on trail.  Randy exclaimed "Is that a trail?"  We
started off the ride with some great single track shrouded in maple leaves to a
view of the Green River Gorge bridge.  Then its was more riding down narrow
steep
sections of trail and more rugged "Cambodia" style trail.  What is Cambodia
style
trail?  Peter Partel coined that phrase to describe the barely discernible trail
peaking through the salal and tree branches on a Green River ride the year
before.  At a logging road a few of the hardy riders bombed down a steep gravel
road to the fish hatchery, the Green River, and waterfalls cascading off of
sandstone cliffs.  After the short but steep lung busting climb back out we
headed for another great Gorge view.  Another short steep descent on trail to a
rocky beach.  Across the river was a towering white sandstone cliff above a deep
green pool in the river.  Mist swirled around the waters edge.

We headed back up and followed an old logging road to views of the Enumclaw
foothills and Mt. Ranier in the distance. We temporarily lost Robert Miller and
Dan until Randy went back and retrieved them from a missed turn.  More trails
that finally led us to our lunch spot at a Deep Lake.  We refueled and then
headed off to ride the last sections of trail.  I think the last tangle of
slippery roots, logs, and tight jungle style riding did everyone in.  15+ miles
and 4.5 hours later we were back at our cars.  Not quite epic but pretty close.

As you guessed, the conditions are less than perfect. Everywhere you
turned on Blackcomb it looked like a Bev Doolittle painting sans
hidden animals. Whistler had what runs were opened funneled down to
little gaper bottlenecks with patrol nazis telling you to slow when
you are already at half speed.

Do I regret going? No.

Did I ski all four days I was there? Hell no.

Here are the details.

I did Whistler on the 28th. The only skiable chairs open were the
Emerald and Franzes. Franzes was only open so you could ski from the
north side of the Roundhouse lodge down to Chic Pee (or is that Pea,
I always get confused on that one) and then down to Franzes and back
up. You had three or four run choices to orbit the Emerald. That's
about all the excitement there folks.

I skied Blackcomb on the 29th. The glacier T-bars were reporting 10-
15 minute waits for your 60 seconds of fame and the surface was
boilerplate. There were even areas of the blue ice of the glacier
showing through in some areas. After that, you could not ski back to
the Glacier chair, the only way down was the green line on the 7th
heaven side and you dare not cut any corners if you valued your
bases at all. You could also loop the Jersey Cream chair with
Wishbone being just about your only option. Oh yeah, you could also
ski the terrain park and ride Catskinner.

By the end of the day there were many more rocks showing due to
traffic and melt off (40+ temps in the alpine).

Saturday and Sunday were spent finding other ways to amuse myself.

Will I go back next week if Crystal is not open? No.

Anyone interested in discussing other options to sliding down a
mountain somewhere?

Tim

Well, I filled up on my (more than) fair share of the turkey and after spending
the day after recuperating, the sunshine got the better of me and I headed up
into the Tillamook State Forest outside of Tillmook, OR for a little SS riding
in the spendid sunshine.  We may pay for this later but for right now ... lets
ride!

I'd stopped in town at the combination bike/video rental/motorcycle/television
store (Trask Mountain Cycles) for some information and also a map of the
Tillamook.  I knew there were some trails up around Brown's Camp but wanted a
bit better directions.  It turns out that the Tillamook is divided at Hwy 6
between motorized and non-motorized trails.  Most of the trails north of the
hghway are non-motorized while those south of the highway are for the motorized
crowd.  I talked a bit with the young man in the shop who was the only one in
there who knew anything about the trails and hed directed me to the West Wilson
River Trail.

I farted around a bit at my in-laws on Saturday and then hit the road.  I got
up to the trailhead around 10:45am.  The sun was shining and while I had been a
bit worried about not bringing enough clothes with me, it turned out to be a
very nice and warm day for riding.  Weird to be in my shirt sleeves and shorts
this late into the year.

The trail winds along the Wilson River ... never very far from civilization but
completely removed from it.  There were 4 other mountain bikers at the
trailhead and some hikers but I saddled up before them and pretty much had the
trail completely to myself.  Everybody that I ran into was friendly and I had a
really good ride.

It wasn't very long ... only about 7 miles on an out-and-back but totally worth
it.  The trail reminds me a lot of the White River Trail near Enumclaw.  The
river is always within sight and the trail while not being technical was
completely fun.  It winds back and forth on itself and has some nice little
switchback climbs and descents thrown in to humble this little SS rider.  The
switchback takes you up past the Wilson Falls and then takes you back down to
the river edge.  The trail was covered in old fallen leaves and there were a
couple downed 12" logs to ride over.  It was on the downhill switchback that I
planted my front wheel on an angled log that I knew I shouldn't be putting my
wheel on.  The front immediately slid out and I did the splits.  *Now* we're
mountain biking!  At the west end of the trail, there is a footbridge across
the Wilson that will take you to the highway.  It was gated off so I was
"forced" to ride back the way I came.

There were some footbridges that were kinda tricky to walk over.  A nice big
2ft wide planed surface was easy enough to walk on but the handrail on the one
side made sure that you paid attention to what you were doing.  One of the
creeks I crossed had a nice big pool and I saw about 15-20 salmon holding up
there for some rain to come down before they could go further up the creek.

All toll ... an excellent way to spend some good trail time.  If you're down in
the Tillamook area, I fully recommend bringing your bike and doing some more
exploring.  There's lots more trails on the map to choose from.  I'm itchin' to
be back there right now.

Kevin Axt

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Well, we got about 10 responses so far, not too bad for just being 2 days on
the web.  Thanks all for participating.  And for those of you still to vote,
let me remind you of the 'Write-In' categories.  This is you chance to get
creative, to get funny.  Here's a couple of ideas to get the wheels turning.

Best Climber
Best Climber even if he is an old geezer.
Best Freerider
Best Crash
Worst Crash
Most Insane Solo Rider
Most fearless
Most creative user of the Radio
Best dressed
Worst dressed
Best racer.
Best boot camp instructor
Best listserv article writer
Best leader for newbie rides
Best leader for 'All Women' rides
Best overall female
Best technical junkie
Best stunt junkie
Rider who got the most lost.
Best Special Events organizer.
Best 'keep the toilet seat down' reminder person.
Most enthusiastic despite horrid conditions
Best rider of a jalopy bike
Most in need of a new bike
Best dog to have on a ride
Most talkative
Most silent
Most flats in a single ride
Biggest liar about how 'easy' the climbs were going to be.
Most drunkenest around the campfire
Best marshmallow roaster
Least inhibited when it comes to taking sun showers.
Best camp chef
Best photographer
Best leader who picks out rides that involve more hiking than biking
Best rider who continued to ride after a broken seat post.
Most wonderfullest rider from outside the USA

I could go on all night.  So, let your mind go, and come up with some
Write-In Awards for us all to enjoy at the party.

gGonzz


----- Original Message -----
From: "gonzo" <mtb_gonzo@...>
To: <bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "Len Francies" <len.francies@...>; "fscurd"
<fcurd@...>; "jpjohnjr" <jptenn@...>; "Kelley,
Katie" <katiek@...>; "Francine Lauth" <francine@...>; "Pat
McNerthney" <pat@...>; <paul@...>; "Francis
Schuurman" <fhmschuurman@...>; "Jack Tomkinson" <jackt@...>;
"John Zilly" <jzilly@...>; "Scott Marlow (1)" <swmarlow@...>;
"Beth Reyburn" <breyburn@...>
Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2002 9:26 AM
Subject: Holiday Party Survey


Grrls and Boyees, Ladies and Germs, Disciples of Dirt:

The long awaited, greatly anticipated, highly praised, 2002 BBTC Holiday
Party Survey is up and running at your local BBTC website.

Visit the form, and cast you vote for anyone you wish to honor in terms of
'Best Trail Advocate', 'Best Trail Worker', 'Best Ride Leader', and more.
There's even a Write-In award: you name the category, you name your winner.
Ballots will be tallied, and awards given out at the Saturday Dec 14th
Party.

The prizes this year will be really cool, useful bike-related items.   The
industrious, fireball juggernaut Bournique as been quite successful in
rounding up a nice cache of schwagg.

Go to the Survey via the home page http://www.bbtc.org and then click on
"xmas survey".  Or go there directly via the page
http://www.bbtc.org/recreation/xmas_survey.html

Details about party logistics can be found at
http://www.bbtc.org/recreation/event_detail.php?event_id=1126


gGonzz

Gitchi gitchi ya ya da da , Mocca chocolata ya ya

Thought this sounded like a fun volunteer opportunity.



  The Forgotten Children's Fund: ( http://www.forgottenchildrensfund.org/ ) was
founded in the late 70 s, the impetus being a misdelivered letter from a kid who
says to Santa Mom says you got lost last year & please  come this year .

One of their activities is a huge gift-giving drive, where over 2500 kids in
over 500 families get gifts at Christmas. FCF gets a number of applications for
Santa visits from families, and these applications are screened by volunteers.
People donate money and toys etc to FCF. FCF has a huge (donated for this
purpose) space roughly where 148th Ave meets interstate  90, where gifts are set
out on tables, segmented by age. Volunteers who get there, to Santa s Workshop ,
get info about a family (like: there s 3 kids in the family, a girl named & aged
8, a boy aged 6 and a girl aged 3, say). Using the info given to them,
volunteers select 3 gifts for each kid, from the toys there, and select a jacket
for each kid, stocking stuffers for each kid, a blanket for the family, and a
gift for each adult; they wrap it all up using gift wrapping and ribbons
provided, and pack it all up per detailed instructions available there. On
Christmas Eve, Santa goes out and delivers these gifts to the families.

In summary, if you land up there, you get to choose gifts and wrap them up for
distribution. You have all the joy of giving and none of the problems of
shopping! Gift wrapping is open most days till Dec  19 th. In addition, FCF
tries to give bikes to families that request them, from donated used/new bikes.
FCF also is interested in people/bike clubs who can spend a little time and help
them spiffy up the bikes they have, get them ready for donation.  The atmosphere
at this place is fun, people have a good time, especially children  who come to
help,  who seem to be the most generous of all !   Please consider spending time
at this place, if you can.  And please pass the word on to others who may be
interested.

The Wrap center and the Bike Center are at
FORGOTTEN CHILDREN'S FUND - NORTH POLE
Former Hewlett Packard Building
15815 SE 37th Street, Bellevue, WA  98002
425-401-0915
425-401-1317 fax

Please check their web pages and their schedule
(http://www.forgottenchildrensfund.org/C%20Schedule%20Of%20Events.htm ) for
further details.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well, still beats riding the couch... I think...

Anyone been up to Paradise (Mt Rainier) lately???  How bad is it???

<G>



>From: "Loopie" <timh@...>
>To: bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Off topic - Whistler Snow Report
>Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 01:40:10 -0000
>
>As you guessed, the conditions are less than perfect. Everywhere you
>turned on Blackcomb it looked like a Bev Doolittle painting sans
>hidden animals. Whistler had what runs were opened funneled down to
>little gaper bottlenecks with patrol nazis telling you to slow when
>you are already at half speed.
>
>Do I regret going? No.
>
>Did I ski all four days I was there? Hell no.
>
>Here are the details.
>
>I did Whistler on the 28th. The only skiable chairs open were the
>Emerald and Franzes. Franzes was only open so you could ski from the
>north side of the Roundhouse lodge down to Chic Pee (or is that Pea,
>I always get confused on that one) and then down to Franzes and back
>up. You had three or four run choices to orbit the Emerald. That's
>about all the excitement there folks.
>
>I skied Blackcomb on the 29th. The glacier T-bars were reporting 10-
>15 minute waits for your 60 seconds of fame and the surface was
>boilerplate. There were even areas of the blue ice of the glacier
>showing through in some areas. After that, you could not ski back to
>the Glacier chair, the only way down was the green line on the 7th
>heaven side and you dare not cut any corners if you valued your
>bases at all. You could also loop the Jersey Cream chair with
>Wishbone being just about your only option. Oh yeah, you could also
>ski the terrain park and ride Catskinner.
>
>By the end of the day there were many more rocks showing due to
>traffic and melt off (40+ temps in the alpine).
>
>Saturday and Sunday were spent finding other ways to amuse myself.
>
>Will I go back next week if Crystal is not open? No.
>
>Anyone interested in discussing other options to sliding down a
>mountain somewhere?
>
>Tim
>


_________________________________________________________________
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I went up to Big White in BC for skiing. There was so little snow the lifts were
not even operating. The locals were saying it gets best over there in February.



Ken O. Bonn
http://www.CascadeSwim.com



---------------------------------
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Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I was up last weekend, very little snow, and probably even less as the
freezing level has been around 10k feet for the past week over there.

-Nic

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg D" <scratchy17@...>
To: <timh@...>; <bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: Off topic - Whistler Snow Report


> Well, still beats riding the couch... I think...
>
> Anyone been up to Paradise (Mt Rainier) lately???  How bad is it???
>
> <G>
>
>
>
> >From: "Loopie" <timh@...>
> >To: bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: Off topic - Whistler Snow Report
> >Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 01:40:10 -0000
> >
> >As you guessed, the conditions are less than perfect. Everywhere you
> >turned on Blackcomb it looked like a Bev Doolittle painting sans
> >hidden animals. Whistler had what runs were opened funneled down to
> >little gaper bottlenecks with patrol nazis telling you to slow when
> >you are already at half speed.
> >
> >Do I regret going? No.
> >
> >Did I ski all four days I was there? Hell no.
> >
> >Here are the details.
> >
> >I did Whistler on the 28th. The only skiable chairs open were the
> >Emerald and Franzes. Franzes was only open so you could ski from the
> >north side of the Roundhouse lodge down to Chic Pee (or is that Pea,
> >I always get confused on that one) and then down to Franzes and back
> >up. You had three or four run choices to orbit the Emerald. That's
> >about all the excitement there folks.
> >
> >I skied Blackcomb on the 29th. The glacier T-bars were reporting 10-
> >15 minute waits for your 60 seconds of fame and the surface was
> >boilerplate. There were even areas of the blue ice of the glacier
> >showing through in some areas. After that, you could not ski back to
> >the Glacier chair, the only way down was the green line on the 7th
> >heaven side and you dare not cut any corners if you valued your
> >bases at all. You could also loop the Jersey Cream chair with
> >Wishbone being just about your only option. Oh yeah, you could also
> >ski the terrain park and ride Catskinner.
> >
> >By the end of the day there were many more rocks showing due to
> >traffic and melt off (40+ temps in the alpine).
> >
> >Saturday and Sunday were spent finding other ways to amuse myself.
> >
> >Will I go back next week if Crystal is not open? No.
> >
> >Anyone interested in discussing other options to sliding down a
> >mountain somewhere?
> >
> >Tim
> >
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> bbtcmembers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>

--- Greg D <scratchy17@...> wrote:
> Well, still beats riding the couch... I think...
>
> Anyone been up to Paradise (Mt Rainier) lately???
> How bad is it???
>
I went to Camp Muir yesterday. It is pretty bad. I was
at Paradise a few weeks ago and there was a few feet
of snow. It is mostly gone now. The snow below pebble
creek is very spotty. The Muir snow field is covered
but the rocks are just below the surface. The paved
trails at paradise are exposed almost to panarama
point.
      I took my snowshoes and didn't need/use them all
the way to Muir. It was a spectacular day for a hike.
Thomas J.


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Has anyone used the Specialized "Enduro"?

I'm looking into buying a relatively high-end bike and the 2002 or newer
Enduro seems like a good one for the $$ based on the components.

I'm relatively new to mountain biking in the northwest but like
technically-oriented sports.

Thanks for any advice,

John

Though it seems like a pretty lame study:

  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/12/02/health/main531381.shtml

Whew!

That was close! Good thing I kept it under 3000 miles this year!


-----Original Message-----
From: Nicolas Pottier [mailto:nicpottier@...]
Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 2:42 PM
To: bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Another reason to get that full suspension bike?


Though it seems like a pretty lame study:

  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/12/02/health/main531381.shtml



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

You've got it all wrong.  Its not a reason to get a FS bike.  It *is*, however,
a (rather lame) reason to get a singlespeed bike ... you'll be standing on all
the climbs keeping any pressure off those "vital" pressure points.  ;)

Kevin

--- Nicolas Pottier <nicpottier@...> wrote:
> Though it seems like a pretty lame study:
>
>  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/12/02/health/main531381.shtml

__________________________________________________
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No, you've got it all wrong. Don't forget, chicks dig scars.
  Kevin Axt <mtnwuff@...> wrote:You've got it all wrong.  Its not a reason
to get a FS bike.  It *is*, however,
a (rather lame) reason to get a singlespeed bike ... you'll be standing on all
the climbs keeping any pressure off those "vital" pressure points.  ;)

Kevin

--- Nicolas Pottier <nicpottier@...> wrote:
> Though it seems like a pretty lame study:
>
>  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/12/02/health/main531381.shtml

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Nah, you're both wrong. Who say's it's a BAD thing? We've got all the
children we want, and I know I prefer riding a bike to changing diapers!
Been there. Done that. Did NOT enjoy it. And, more mouths to feed = fewer
$$ for that new (FS/HT/SS/Unicycle) rig!

>
> No, you've got it all wrong. Don't forget, chicks dig scars.
>  Kevin Axt <mtnwuff@...> wrote:You've got it all wrong.  Its not
> a reason to get a FS bike.  It *is*, however,
> a (rather lame) reason to get a singlespeed bike ... you'll be standing
> on all
> the climbs keeping any pressure off those "vital" pressure points.  ;)
>

he has 4? kids.  He rode lots of cobble stones.

Luckily, my wife and I agree with Thom about not having kids.  I'd still
prefer to avoid testicular abuse to the point of scaring though.   Sounds
unpleasant.

Mostly, it sounds like the Endero is a solid bike.  The reviews say the seat
post and handle bars aren't the best but those can be replaced.

Thanks to everyone who sent advice.

John





-----Original Message-----
From: Thom Randolph [mailto:thom@...]
Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 3:36 PM
To: bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Another reason to get that full suspension bike?


Nah, you're both wrong. Who say's it's a BAD thing? We've got all the
children we want, and I know I prefer riding a bike to changing diapers!
Been there. Done that. Did NOT enjoy it. And, more mouths to feed = fewer
$$ for that new (FS/HT/SS/Unicycle) rig!

>
> No, you've got it all wrong. Don't forget, chicks dig scars.
>  Kevin Axt <mtnwuff@...> wrote:You've got it all wrong.  Its not
> a reason to get a FS bike.  It *is*, however,
> a (rather lame) reason to get a singlespeed bike ... you'll be standing
> on all
> the climbs keeping any pressure off those "vital" pressure points.  ;)
>


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Hi all,
I am anticipating having a reporter and photographer from the Seattle P-I
join us on our monthly ride through Tolt. He will be  writing a story on the
BBTC. Pretty exciting stuff! And a great opportunity to get the word out
about the BBTC and mountain biking. If you can't make the ride but you might
have a comment or suggestion please email me before the end of the week.

Happy trails,
Valerie




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"...he studied about 55 avid mountain bikers and found nearly 90% had
low sperm counts and scrotal abnormalities.

Only 26% of the 35 non-bikers he studied had similar damage..."

The question here is what the hell were these kinky 26% doing ???

So Peter... I guess the "ballbuster" at RatPac equates to oh, 9000
miles of riding ???  :o


--- In bbtcmembers@y..., "Ken O. Bonn" <kenobonn@y...> wrote:
>
> No, you've got it all wrong. Don't forget, chicks dig scars.

I hope this catches anyone that was wondering, BEFORE you leave.

I just returned from Hawaii and thought I'd pass along a little info
in case Armando's Ironman mountain climb didn't exactly sound like
the best way to see Maui's trails.  If you go and don't do any
research, the only offering you'll see is the whacked out tourist
downhill from Haleakela.  It's $140 and you have to wake up at 2 a.m.
because a big part of the trip is supposed to be the sunrise at the
summit.  The downhill is just a line of a bunch of people that may or
may not have been on a bike in the last decade flying down a paved
road for 38 miles.  (No thanks!)
I talked to Brian and Glenn at "Extreme Sports Maui". I went there
because they sell/rent Rocky Mountains.  According to them, there are
only 2 legal trails on all of Maui.  The hunters have kept many of
the trails closed to bikes and other trails are on private property
and 'Hawaiian Homelands'.  It sounded like you may be able to hook up
with someone from the shop though for some of the "unofficial" rides
since they are locals and know some of the people that own these
trails.  I only had time to ride on one day so the two trails were
plenty for me.  About 8 miles total; think "Hawaiian Tiger".  If you
rent a Jeep (recommended) and have a co-pilot, you will be able to
shuttle up to the top of the Mamane trail in Poli Poli State Park as
many times as you want.  It is about a 2 mile down hill similar to
Preston RR in terrain with roots and rocks to launch off of.  [Side
note here, if you're going to rent a bike, I'd recommend trying to
squeeze the following into your luggage in this order: 1. GLOVES 2.
Pedals you like and the shoes to go with them.  3. Hydration pack of
choice 4. Your favorite saddle/seat.]  Otherwise, you'll be riding up
(and up)the jeep trail which makes it close to a 5 mile ride and the
bike might as well be a BMX without the luxo features you're used
to.  I would spend the extra $10 on a full susp next time.
The trail is killer though.  The map they gave me shows some other
trail that splits off of this one that isn't off limits to bikes but
it says it is an "unconstructed trail" on the map and 7.5
miles...hmmm GPS and camping gear might make it an interesting
instead of irritating excursion.  The other official bike trail is
called "Waikoa Loop".  It's a 3 mile loop of varied terrain and a
good balance of ups and downs.  It was pouring rain Seattle-style
when I did it which made it even more technical; the lava rocks are
as slippery as they look when wet and that rich soil really clogs up
your tires something fierce.  This trail is supposedly in "wild pig"
country and they may or may not charge when the see you.  I didn't
see any.  Both of these trail are in the same park so they can easily
be done in half a day.  Poli Poli is on Haleakela about a 30-40
minute drive from the bike shop in Kahului (airport).  The best part
is that there are no tourists here.  It is a park like Paradise is a
park.
The guys at the shop will also tell you that Lana'i has some killer
riding and that is just a short boat ride away when you get bored on
Maui.
I didn't do much research on the big island other than finding that
there are 3 trails that are a blast according to the "Big Island
Revealed" book.  I stayed at the Waipio Wayside B&B the last night
and discovered that the best map to get is the one from the
University.  It apparently shows a lot more trails and 4x4 roads.  As
well, Jackie the owner of the B&B is happy to mark up the map for you
and let you know where some killer hikes, 4x4 and moutain bike routes
are.  Hope this helps.  --n

This immediately raises the Dave Barry Question:
Wouldn't "Scrotal Abnormalities" be a great name for a rock band?

TFitz

----- Original Message -----
From: "armando_4u2" <armando@...>
To: <bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: Another reason to get that full suspension bike?


> "...he studied about 55 avid mountain bikers and found nearly 90% had
> low sperm counts and scrotal abnormalities.
>
> Only 26% of the 35 non-bikers he studied had similar damage..."

Does anyone have any advice on bike cases for travel?  Can these be
rented?



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

John Bradford wrote:
> Does anyone have any advice on bike cases for travel?  Can these be
> rented?

I don't know about rentals, but if any BBTC members want to
borrow a Trico hard case, free, on simple you-break-it-you-buy-it
terms, I have one that spends most of the year taking up space in
my storage locker.

--
josh@... is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Updated Infrared Photography Books List:
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/photo/irbooks.html>

Most, if not all, bike stores sell bike travel cases; prices vary.  Gregg's
sells the Serfas case for $299.99. and rents them as well.
Tom Fitzpatrick
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Bradford" <jmbradfo@...>
Subject: Bike Luggage


> Does anyone have any advice on bike cases for travel?  Can these be
> rented?

I have traveled a number of times with my road bike for long tours/rides. I
have had great success and found others using boxes had damage time after
time. I have rented from a fellow Cascade Bicycle Club member that
advertises in the club newsletter. You may want to give him  a call. As I
remember he has two different styles.

Do be prepared to pay up to $50 each way if you put it on the plane. If
there is time, and someone on the other end that will except the bike, send
it UPS. About half the price and they seem to be easier on bikes.

Howard = 206.458.5665

Rich Smith

I have a Performance bike case that I will rent out
for $10 a week.

z

__________________________________________________
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If you have a Norba or USCF License, you can get two vouchers per year to
transport your bike on United, free of charge.
http://www.usacycling.org/?vouchermail.html

Greggs also has cases for rent.

-mike

-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Smith [mailto:rwsmith@...]
Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 7:50 AM
To: bbtcmembers@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Bike Cases for Rent


I have traveled a number of times with my road bike for long tours/rides. I
have had great success and found others using boxes had damage time after
time. I have rented from a fellow Cascade Bicycle Club member that
advertises in the club newsletter. You may want to give him  a call. As I
remember he has two different styles.

Do be prepared to pay up to $50 each way if you put it on the plane. If
there is time, and someone on the other end that will except the bike, send
it UPS. About half the price and they seem to be easier on bikes.

Howard = 206.458.5665

Rich Smith




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Wed, 4 Dec 2002, Mike Jancola wrote:

> If you have a Norba or USCF License, you can get two vouchers per year to
transport your bike on United, free of charge.
> http://www.usacycling.org/?vouchermail.html

-OR-

yet another reason to become an IMBA member: bikes fly free.

http://www.imba.com/membership/bikes_fly_free.html

i've used this on my past three fly-with-the-bike trips and have no
complaints.

-kelly