Picking up on old threads here.

> It would help alleviate the problem that the overall champ
> is so often decided on freestyle which is the only time
> the top guys in each class get to compete person-on-person

Freestyle is a specialised affair. It should be a minor 'title' of
its own, on the side, with racing being the main reason of a get-
together. Then all other racing 'affairs' - triangular, slalom if
any, long distance if any, should have an overall racing champ.

Freestyle should not decide these things. This suggestion above will
still interest racers and freestylists alike. The only reason we'd
wanta force freestyle to be part of an overall decision would be to
encourage freestyle - surely not the goal.

The overall champion concept was a Schweitzer invention that was
relevant in the 80s, when OD regattas attracted 100s of sailors.

My 2 cents in.


--- In WindsurferOD@yahoogroups.com, Chris Thompson <cthom249@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi Ross,
>
> Thanks for that, and by the way I fully understand that there's no
way
> you could be there and the amount of work you do for windsurfing
> already. The guys we were missing another bunch who missed the
regatta
> en masse.
>
> It's interesting to hear your views. This year, with the small
fleet, I
> was thinking about dropping the weight divisions but it seemed a
drastic
> decision to make inside a regatta. There was also the problem that
I
> would have been the main beneficiary and therefore even raising the
idea
> would have been in poor taste!
>
> I think the weight divisions are important; for example I see how
> quickly the relative performance of Marty and I change as the wind
does,
> and around 8-10 there's nothing the heavier sailor can do.
Basically,
> the winner among the NSW fleet would be largely known as soon as
the gun
> went, or even when we got the forecast for the titles. My
recollection
> from Geelong is that Stu, for example, was further back in the
light
> airs and miles faster in the breeze (I'm pretty sure on this
because I
> was hoping to knock him off in the heavy and was disappointed when
he
> just went even faster when it kicked in!). The heavy guys also have
the
> perception that they are drastically slower in most conditions, and
that
> perception that Wallys (and Mistrals too) are only for lightweights
is a
> big problem for us IMHO.
>
> Historically the nationals top men's course-racing order goes 1-
LW, 2-
> LW, 3 - MW, 4- LW, 5- HW, 6- MW or something similar. I don't know
if
> say Jason (the Vic lightweight who was top overall last year) is
> actually 4, 5 or 6 places better as a sailor than Dennis
Winstanley.
> However, that's probably affected by the fact that I think we
mainly
> concentrate on beating the other guys in our weight division, and
often
> let lighter guys get away just to cover the others in our class.
>
> The FW guys have actually introduced a weight division (their
> "lightweight" is under 85kg though!) and even Div 2 boards had
them. The
> new Exocet Kona "super wally" will (IIRC) race in weight divisions
if it
> gets going because the veteran guy pushing it believes in them so
much.
>
> So overall I think weight divisions in some form are vital in a
board
> with only 170-180L or so of volume (which is apparently what the
Wally
> really is). However, given the current situation we should consider
some
> way of emphasising the overall winner, and/or trying to find some
other
> way of evening out the weights.
>
> I've spoken to Bill and Johnsy about the weight divisions in slalom
> because I agree that (from what I've seen) there is no difference
in
> weights. They say that the results prove that over time, there is
an
> advantage to lighter sailors. It would be a very good idea to open
this
> up for more discussion. It would help alleviate the problem that
the
> overall champ is so often decided on freestyle which is the only
time
> the top guys in each class get to compete person-on-person. It
could
> allow a heavier sailor to actually score over the lightweights.
>
> Interesting point to raise; perhaps we need to get the full set of
old
> results from Bill and bash them around to see what would happen if
> weight divisions were dropped?
>
> With luck and the interest from Wind Surf 'n Snow and Windsurfing
NSW
> and the kids, hopefully this year's small fleet will not be
repeated so
> the problem of small weight divisions will be reduced.
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Ross Kelly wrote:
>
> > Hi Chris,
> > Am sorry the numbers were disappointing, but it is good to hear
that
> > WindsurfingNSW is behind the class. It really should give it a
boost.
> >
> > While I couldn't have made the weekend anyway, my enthusiasm for
> > racing the wally 'titles' regattas is very diminished by the
> > pre-eminence of the weight divisions.
> >
> > I appreciate that others, perhaps the majority, may disagree,
but...
> >
> > * it seems odd in a small fleet of less than say 25 boards to
have any
> > need for divisions at all. If I'm racing in a fleet of 15, I want
to
> > race the whole fleet, not a handful of boards scattered
throughout it.
> >
> > * The divisions were historically introduced as a means of
splitting
> > up large fleets / start lines. Where there is no need for more
than
> > one start line, there's no need for divisions.
> >
> > * The weight thing/argument is six of one and half a dozen of the
> > other anyway. In a light breeze the lighter man should do better,
vice
> > versa in the stronger breeze. Over time it evens out. There is
> > evidence that below 8 knots there is no advantage to any
particular
> > weight, and that the window of advantage is very narrow above
that. At
> > the the nationals in Geelong, Stuart Gilbert did brilliantly in
the
> > light air, and Marty was stunning in the strong stuff. The thing
that
> > gets them home is talent, not weight. I'd much rather attend a
title
> > regatta where StuartG and Marty and DennisW and yourself were all
> > intensely racing each other for THE title of national (or state)
> > champion. (For slalom, I think weight divisions are completely
> > superfluous. The 'final' invariably has a mix of light, middles,
and
> > heavies - what the light guy gains for weight, the heavy guy
gains for
> > strength - so the scoring should be fleet wide)
> >
> > * The arguments in favour weight divisions could apply equally to
> > Formula racing - but there is no move to introduce such a thing
at
> > title regattas. At the recent Worlds the big guys (110kg+) headed
the
> > fleet and won the regatta as the wind roared across Port Philip.
In
> > different conditions, the result might well have been different -
> > that's sailing.
> >
> > * If regatta fleets are large enough, then weight divisions might
be
> > ok, as the secondary prizes - not the primary.
> >
> > Not wanting to be controversial - just letting you know what I'm
> > thinking - perhaps some others feel similarly, perhaps not.
> >
> > Cheers. Well done on the win.
> > Ross
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* WindsurferOD@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:WindsurferOD@yahoogroups.com]*On Behalf Of *ct249
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, 21 March 2006 21:34
> > *To:* WindsurferOD@yahoogroups.com
> > *Subject:* [WindsurferOD] NSW State titles
> >
> > Well, it was a very disappointing turnout for the state
titles,
> > but many thanks to those who came. Conditions were light, but
the
> > weather was nice and there was always some wind and Kyeemagh
was a
> > pleasant placeto sail.
> >
> > The day after the regatta we got good news - the head of
> > WindsurfingNSW, Brett Morris, rang to say that he had been
really
> > impressed by theWindsurfers ODs. He liked the friendly people
who
> > enjoyed theirsailing, the visibility of the bright sails, and
the
> > accessible imagethey gave to a sport which can look pretty
> > intimidating. So he has asked the major Sydney retailer to
start
> > pushing the Windsurfer One Design, and he's keen to see it as
a
> > major part of the sport and THE major entry/junior section.
We may
> > now be able to ride that enthusiasm a long way.
> >
> > Considering how much we have lost in the past by being seen
as old
> > fashioned, it's great to see such positive feelings coming
from
> > the"high performance" end of the sport. It can only help
Windsurfers.
> >
> > The wavesailor/short board freestylers were pretty good
natured
> > when it came to the Windsurfers taking the first prizes
(worth a
> > few hundred bucks) in both sections of the freestyle, too!
> >
> > Notable performances were seen from Justin Steel, who showed
why
> > he has been a world-class dinghy sailor on the way to top
> > lightweight andtaking out the intermediate section of the
> > freestyle comp. The women's fleet was the largest division
with 5
> > sailors in total, more than we've seen for some time
(excepting
> > the uni sailors), and some good racing.
> >
> > So thanks to all those who turned up, especially Kerry Bergman
> > from Victoria.
> >
> > Narrabeen is looking healthier than it has been for some
time, and
> > downat DAC the fleet's been looking OK too ; 10 "senior"
> > Windsurfers last twilight.The interest from the kids has been
> > increasing and now 6 of them have their own Windsurfers
(two "Mk
> > 2s" with retracting centreboards andthree older "Mk 1s"). The
> > Belmont (Lake Macquarie) interest has tailedoff and I'm
bringing
> > one of the training boards back from there toboost the DAC
fleet
> > because we have lots of kids who want to get into the class.
It
> > can also be loaned to anyone who has juniors who want to try
> > windsurfing. The kid's section of the states didn't end up
> > happening and the intention is to run a regatta at DAC in a
few weeks.
> >
> > Preliminary ideas for next year have the NSW States and
University
> > nationals combined in early December, possibly at Narrabeen;
and
> > the nationals around Anzac Day at Batemans Bay. Please throw
me
> > anythoughts.
> >
> > Part of the loss of numbers at the states may have been the
fact
> > that I had a sudden work trip to Bourke, Lightning Ridge etc
just
> > beforehand and that meant I had no time to ring around people
to
> > rev them up. I did find a keenWally sailor at Bathurst though!
> >
> > It underlined that support from other class members is vital
if we
> > are to take advantage of the interest we have from kids and
from
> > Windsurfing NSW.
> >
> > I have probably more of my own commitments (kids etc) than
just
> > about anyone in the class and I cannot do it all by myself. We
> > need to hold a meeting to work out what is going to happen
next
> > year; it would be great to see everyone after the first round
of
> > the DAC winter series. Steve Barton and Steve Welsh have
agreed to
> > help with the nationals next year if we are running them,
Roger
> > does Narrabeen which is great - anyone else?
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > *WINDSURFER ONE DESIGN*
> >
> > *2005/2006 NSW CHAMPIONSHIPS*
> >
> > *SILVER FLEET*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 1*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 2*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 3*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 4*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 5*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Total*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Place*
> >
> > *Stephen Barton*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> > *Leanne Murdoch*
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> > *Jorn Kronke *
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 18
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> > *Elise Trask*
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 25
> >
> >
> >
> > 4^th
> >
> > *Mischa Aizatulin*
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 26
> >
> >
> >
> > 5^th
> >
> > *WOMEN*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 1*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 2*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 3*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 4*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 5*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Total*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Place*
> >
> > *Karen Constable*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> > *Deb Apthorp*
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> > *Leanne Murdoch*
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 14
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> > *Kerry Bergman*
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 15
> >
> >
> >
> > 4^th
> >
> > *Elise Trask*
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 25
> >
> >
> >
> > 5^th
> >
> > *Men - HW*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 1*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 2*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 3*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 4*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 5*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Total*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Place*
> >
> > *Stephen Barton*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1st
> >
> > *Men - MW*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 1*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 2*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 3*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 4*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Race 5*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Total*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Place*
> >
> > *Chris Thompson*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> > *Mick **Griffith***
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> > *Roger Crawford*
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 12
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> > *Mischa Aizatulin*
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > DNF
> >
> >
> >
> > DNF
> >
> >
> >
> > DNF
> >
> >
> >
> > DNF
> >
> >
> >
> > 18
> >
> >
> >
> > 4^th
> >
> > Men - LW
> >
> >
> >
> > Race 1
> >
> >
> >
> > Race 2
> >
> >
> >
> > Race 3
> >
> >
> >
> > Race 4
> >
> >
> >
> > Race 5
> >
> >
> >
> > Total
> >
> >
> >
> > Place
> >
> > *Justin Steel*
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> > *Steve Newman*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> > *Steve Walsh*
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> > Just for interest........
> >
> > *OVERALL*
> >
> >
> >
> > *No.*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Fleet*
> >
> >
> >
> > *RACE 1*
> >
> >
> >
> > *RACE 2*
> >
> >
> >
> > *RACE 3*
> >
> >
> >
> > *RACE 4*
> >
> >
> >
> > *RACE 5*
> >
> >
> >
> > *O'A*
> >
> > *Pts*
> >
> >
> >
> > *O'all*
> >
> > *Plc*
> >
> > *Elise Trask*
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > MacU
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 62
> >
> >
> >
> > 14^th
> >
> > *Justin Steel*
> >
> >
> >
> > X
> >
> >
> >
> > Narra
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> > *Kerry Bergman*
> >
> >
> >
> > O
> >
> >
> >
> > Vic.
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 42
> >
> >
> >
> > 12^th
> >
> > *Leanne Murdoch*
> >
> >
> >
> > MU
> >
> >
> >
> > MacU
> >
> >
> >
> > 10
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > 10
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > 42
> >
> >
> >
> > 11^th
> >
> > *Mischa Aizatulin *
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > MacU
> >
> >
> >
> > 12
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 63
> >
> >
> >
> > 15^th
> >
> > *Jorn Kronke*
> >
> >
> >
> > 01
> >
> >
> >
> > St G.
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 10
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 53
> >
> >
> >
> > 13^th
> >
> > *Stephen Walsh*
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > Narra
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 18
> >
> >
> >
> > 5^th
> >
> > *Chris Thompson*
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > DAC
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 1
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> > *Mick **Griffith***
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > DAC
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 16
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> > *Karen*
> >
> > *Constable*
> >
> >
> >
> > 11
> >
> >
> >
> > N/A
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 19
> >
> >
> >
> > 6^th
> >
> > *Stephen Barton*
> >
> >
> >
> > 20
> >
> >
> >
> > DAC
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 10
> >
> >
> >
> > 10
> >
> >
> >
> > 36
> >
> >
> >
> > 10^th
> >
> > *Roger Crawford*
> >
> >
> >
> > 141
> >
> >
> >
> > Narra
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 2
> >
> >
> >
> > DNS
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 28
> >
> >
> >
> > 8^th
> >
> > *Steve Newman*
> >
> >
> >
> > 326
> >
> >
> >
> > N/A
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 16
> >
> >
> >
> > 4^th
> >
> > *Deb Apthorp*
> >
> >
> >
> > 331
> >
> >
> >
> > MacU
> >
> >
> >
> > 5
> >
> >
> >
> > 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 9
> >
> >
> >
> > 23
> >
> >
> >
> > 7^th
> >
> > **
> >
> > **
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *CLUBS*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Best Three Results*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Total*
> >
> >
> >
> > *Place*
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *Dobroyd Aquatic Club *
> >
> >
> >
> > Stephen Barton 1, Chris Thompson 1, Mike Griffiths 2
> >
> >
> >
> > 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 1^st
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *"All Stars"!*
> >
> >
> >
> > Karen Constable (Nth Beaches) 1, Steve Newman (Nth Beaches) 2,
> > Kerry Bergman (Parkdale Vic) 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 6
> >
> >
> >
> > 2^nd
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *Narrabeen** **SC***
> >
> >
> >
> > Justin Steel 1, Roger Crawford 3, Stephen Walsh 3
> >
> >
> >
> > 7
> >
> >
> >
> > 3^rd
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *Mac Uni*
> >
> >
> >
> > Leanne Murdoch 2, Deb Apthorp 2, Elise Trask 4
> >
> >
> >
> > 8
> >
> >
> >
> > 4^th
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > <!--[if !supportMisalignedColumns]-->
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > <!--[endif]-->
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > NOTICE
> > This e-mail and any attachments are confidential and may
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are
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> >
> >
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> >
> > Hamilton island resort
> > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?
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lton+island+reef+view+hotel&c=6&s=150&.sig=casxvHVu2YjqyPYQlA5jVg>
> > Hamilton island palm terrace
> > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?
t=ms&k=Hamilton+island+palm+terrace&w1=Design+class&w2=Windsurfing&w3=
Windsurfer&w4=Hamilton+island+resort&w5=Hamilton+island+palm+terrace&w
6=Hamilton+island+reef+view+hotel&c=6&s=150&.sig=6sEPd-G4smo-
l2_jnMGA8Q>
> > Hamilton island reef view hotel
> > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?
t=ms&k=Hamilton+island+reef+view+hotel&w1=Design+class&w2=Windsurfing&
w3=Windsurfer&w4=Hamilton+island+resort&w5=Hamilton+island+palm+terrac
e&w6=Hamilton+island+reef+view+hotel&c=6&s=150&.sig=2ByRpVDB7zRLsFjSLU
qJgQ>
> >
> >
> >
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