Guro Jeff,

As with other groups, there is a protocol in our
organization.  I made that clarification mostly in
response to PG Mike's comment about his discussion
with someone associated with our organization.
Apparently, it seems that the person PG Mike has been
in contact with is either a rogue or very loosely
associated with my teacher's organization, if that.
Just protecting the integrity of my teacher, his
organization and what we represent.

I do appreciate the recognition of our group's
accomplishments, creativity and talent.

Salamat,

Guro Bob Manalo, Jr.

--- Stickman <stickman@...> wrote:

>  > Just offering my two centavos worth.  It's true
> that
> > we won't move or act without our teacher's
> permission,
> > out of respect.  Of all the years I've been with
> my
> > teacher (over ten), I have a good idea why we
> maintain
> > our autonomy from other groups.  I'm sure you,
> Guro
> > Jeff, also understand why.
>
> Bob -
>     I know that IESA will not do anything without
> the approval of its
> founder and I didn't mean to convey any different
> impression.  I have had
> conversations with him in the past concerning his
> journey from his roots in
> Stockton, so I know he values his independence.
> Whether or not he would
> personally care to be involved in this is unknown to
> me, but at least I want
> his organization to be recognized in this process.
>     What I am doing is raising discussion points
> because there are many who
> would like to see peace in the Serrada community.  I
> do not envision any
> group giving up their own independence, but rather
> an association where
> member groups could offer their creativity.  IESA is
> a talented organization
> whose input would be valuable, IMHO.  If the purpose
> of any association
> would be to honor Angel and help propogate his
> teachings, I don't see that
> such a charter would invalidate or restrict a group
> such as yours.  Of
> course this is all blue sky speculation.
> Nevertheless, if one never comes
> to the table, then there is no chance to shape an
> outcome, and of course if
> it never works out, people (and organizations) can
> always leave again.
>
> Jeff "Stickman" Finder
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>     WSEFflow-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>
>


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> Just offering my two centavos worth.  It's true that
> we won't move or act without our teacher's permission,
> out of respect.  Of all the years I've been with my
> teacher (over ten), I have a good idea why we maintain
> our autonomy from other groups.  I'm sure you, Guro
> Jeff, also understand why.

Bob -
     I know that IESA will not do anything without the approval of its
founder and I didn't mean to convey any different impression.  I have had
conversations with him in the past concerning his journey from his roots in
Stockton, so I know he values his independence.  Whether or not he would
personally care to be involved in this is unknown to me, but at least I want
his organization to be recognized in this process.
     What I am doing is raising discussion points because there are many who
would like to see peace in the Serrada community.  I do not envision any
group giving up their own independence, but rather an association where
member groups could offer their creativity.  IESA is a talented organization
whose input would be valuable, IMHO.  If the purpose of any association
would be to honor Angel and help propogate his teachings, I don't see that
such a charter would invalidate or restrict a group such as yours.  Of
course this is all blue sky speculation.  Nevertheless, if one never comes
to the table, then there is no chance to shape an outcome, and of course if
it never works out, people (and organizations) can always leave again.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

excellent point jeff, if those core instructors could unite it would
give a "center" of opportunity for an association.

mike


- In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, "Stickman" <stickman@...> wrote:
>
> >   i believe we may have began the process on 3/3/06.  i am
making strides
> on a personal level to bring >us closer to the inayan group out of
tennesee
> and working to get to Sultan Uddin thru a mutual >aquaintance.
>
> I doubt the Inayans are going to be a part of a Serrada unification
> movement.  Mike Inay incorporated other training methods to create
his own
> system.  He was to his group what Angel was to ours.  They are
certainly
> cousins, but more like an acorn sprouting a new tree rather than a
branch of
> the original.
>
> I think the core interest in any unification will come from those
who
> primarily identify their art as Serrada, most of whom will be from
the late
> 70's and 1980's generation of students rather than the earliest.
Hey, I
> could be wrong; perhaps guys like Dentoy Revillar, Al Concepcion
and Rene
> Latosa will want to be involved, but I suspect the longer a group
has been
> on its own, the less likely they'll care about integrating.  Like
the
> Inayans, many of these earlier students have branched out in their
own
> directions and are not as closely identified with promotion of
Serrada as
> with their own identity, which is ok.
>
> Guys like Sultan Uddin or Jimmy Tacosa still seem connected to the
Serrada
> label, but having left Stockton for the bright lights of bigger
cities, I
> have to wonder if they'll be interested in returning to home town
roots.
> There is an active IESA group here in the Bay Area but whether
they'd
> participate without
> Sultan is a question.  At this point he seems to be pursuing his
acting
> career more than teaching.
>
> For the most part I see the unification issue as between the
active Serrada
> instructors in the Central Valley.  These are people who for the
most part
> grew up close together and have deep roots in the community, and
many were
> training partners at one time in Angel's old association.  If
these guys can
> form a new Serrada association, that would start a nucleus that
might entice
> more distant people to re-connect as members.  Without a center to
attract
> mass, things will continue the way it is now.
>
> Jeff "Stickman" Finder
>

guro manalo,

several months ago, an individual contacted me via email;
associating himself with Sultan Uddin.

at that time, this individual expressed interest in support of and
not in complete unification, but discussing a affiliation.

by affiliation, i did not understand that either organization would
be "the governing body".

there has been a breath of time since we've had any other
discussion.  this may have been a false representation.  if it was,
i can only claim to the interest shown in that conversation.

i personally, as well as our GM Anthony Davis, do of course
appreciate your support in any fashion and thank you.

PG Mike Schwarz

-


-- In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, Bob Manalo <hc1358@...> wrote:
>
> PG Mike wrote:   i believe we may have began the
> process on 3/3/06.  i am making strides on a personal
> level to bring us closer to the inayan group out of
> tennesee and working to get to Sultan Uddin thru a
> mutual aquaintance.
>
> Guro Jeff wrote:
> > Guys like Sultan Uddin or Jimmy Tacosa still seem
> > connected to the Serrada
> > label, but having left Stockton for the bright
> > lights of bigger cities, I
> > have to wonder if they'll be interested in returning
> > to home town roots.
> > There is an active IESA group here in the Bay Area
> > but whether they'd
> > participate without
> > Sultan is a question.  At this point he seems to be
> > pursuing his acting
> > career more than teaching.
> >
> >
> > Jeff "Stickman" Finder
>
>
> Guro Jeff and PG Mike,
>
> Just offering my two centavos worth.  It's true that
> we won't move or act without our teacher's permission,
> out of respect.  Of all the years I've been with my
> teacher (over ten), I have a good idea why we maintain
> our autonomy from other groups.  I'm sure you, Guro
> Jeff, also understand why.
>
> He is pursuing his career, but it's not just in acting
> or entertainment, and he does teach a select few.  I
> am privy to some information, but not all.  And
> because of confidentiality clauses, I must refrain
> from repeating certain things that I do know.  All I
> can say is that he's doing things on a "global" scale.
>
> Being that I've been around the longest, I'm very
> curious to know whom the mutual acquaintance is that
> PG Mike is discussing unification with.  The few
> students Professor Uddin teaches are essentially the
> few people that are able to communicate directly with
> him when it comes to the martial arts.  If there was
> something going on, I can assure you that I'd be in
> the loop.  None of my other constituents, even my
> teacher, have mentioned any activity supporting
> unification with any Serrada group, even participating
> in a "democratic" type association.
>
> There are individuals that we support and appreciate,
> like Guro Finder, but IESA will maintain full
> autonomy.  Professor Uddin has earned that right and
> privilege not only from Angel himself, but from all
> others worldwide who have publicly recognized his
> knowledge and skill in the combative arts.
>
> Just my opinion...
>
>
> Salamat,
>
> Guro Bob Manalo, Jr.
> www.sultanuddin.com
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>

PG Mike wrote:   i believe we may have began the
process on 3/3/06.  i am making strides on a personal
level to bring us closer to the inayan group out of
tennesee and working to get to Sultan Uddin thru a
mutual aquaintance.

Guro Jeff wrote:
> Guys like Sultan Uddin or Jimmy Tacosa still seem
> connected to the Serrada
> label, but having left Stockton for the bright
> lights of bigger cities, I
> have to wonder if they'll be interested in returning
> to home town roots.
> There is an active IESA group here in the Bay Area
> but whether they'd
> participate without
> Sultan is a question.  At this point he seems to be
> pursuing his acting
> career more than teaching.
>
>
> Jeff "Stickman" Finder


Guro Jeff and PG Mike,

Just offering my two centavos worth.  It's true that
we won't move or act without our teacher's permission,
out of respect.  Of all the years I've been with my
teacher (over ten), I have a good idea why we maintain
our autonomy from other groups.  I'm sure you, Guro
Jeff, also understand why.

He is pursuing his career, but it's not just in acting
or entertainment, and he does teach a select few.  I
am privy to some information, but not all.  And
because of confidentiality clauses, I must refrain
from repeating certain things that I do know.  All I
can say is that he's doing things on a "global" scale.

Being that I've been around the longest, I'm very
curious to know whom the mutual acquaintance is that
PG Mike is discussing unification with.  The few
students Professor Uddin teaches are essentially the
few people that are able to communicate directly with
him when it comes to the martial arts.  If there was
something going on, I can assure you that I'd be in
the loop.  None of my other constituents, even my
teacher, have mentioned any activity supporting
unification with any Serrada group, even participating
in a "democratic" type association.

There are individuals that we support and appreciate,
like Guro Finder, but IESA will maintain full
autonomy.  Professor Uddin has earned that right and
privilege not only from Angel himself, but from all
others worldwide who have publicly recognized his
knowledge and skill in the combative arts.

Just my opinion...


Salamat,

Guro Bob Manalo, Jr.
www.sultanuddin.com





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>   i believe we may have began the process on 3/3/06.  i am making strides
on a personal level to bring >us closer to the inayan group out of tennesee
and working to get to Sultan Uddin thru a mutual >aquaintance.

I doubt the Inayans are going to be a part of a Serrada unification
movement.  Mike Inay incorporated other training methods to create his own
system.  He was to his group what Angel was to ours.  They are certainly
cousins, but more like an acorn sprouting a new tree rather than a branch of
the original.

I think the core interest in any unification will come from those who
primarily identify their art as Serrada, most of whom will be from the late
70's and 1980's generation of students rather than the earliest.  Hey, I
could be wrong; perhaps guys like Dentoy Revillar, Al Concepcion and Rene
Latosa will want to be involved, but I suspect the longer a group has been
on its own, the less likely they'll care about integrating.  Like the
Inayans, many of these earlier students have branched out in their own
directions and are not as closely identified with promotion of Serrada as
with their own identity, which is ok.

Guys like Sultan Uddin or Jimmy Tacosa still seem connected to the Serrada
label, but having left Stockton for the bright lights of bigger cities, I
have to wonder if they'll be interested in returning to home town roots.
There is an active IESA group here in the Bay Area but whether they'd
participate without
Sultan is a question.  At this point he seems to be pursuing his acting
career more than teaching.

For the most part I see the unification issue as between the active Serrada
instructors in the Central Valley.  These are people who for the most part
grew up close together and have deep roots in the community, and many were
training partners at one time in Angel's old association.  If these guys can
form a new Serrada association, that would start a nucleus that might entice
more distant people to re-connect as members.  Without a center to attract
mass, things will continue the way it is now.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

>   GM mentioned to me that he wants to form a new association and have
other people in it to help >make decissions.  Not just him.  It could be
different people from different Serrada groups.

Interesting.  People have been suggesting this to him since his dad died,
which seems a clear indicator there's an interest in supporting this kind of
association.

JF

There are 2 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Unity
From: "Stickman"
2. Re: Re: Unity
From: Guro Dennis Servaes


________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 09:15:03 -0800
From: "Stickman"
Subject: Re: Unity

> regarding a united serrada association is a utopian idea. not that
> it wouldn't be revolutionary.



> the art of serrada escrima has been taken from the stockton area and
> spread to the midwest, east coast, europe, and soon australia; this
> without a unifying organization.
>
> it will take much more than "major nelson" to put this "jeanie" back
> in the bottle.

Agreed. I don't necessarily see a unification as a single organization, but
rather an association of related organizations. One model might be
Kajukenbo, which despite differences retains an umbrella identity. Within
Kajukenbo are several formally recognized and distinct styles that have
evolved, and within each of them there are member organizations consisting
of businesses started and run by entrepreneurial teachers.

If Serrada were to try to organize into a larger body, I certainly don't see
the present organizations dissolving themselves. The model I'd envision
would base itself on a board of directors consisting of heads of various
member bodies and perhaps others elected at large according to a charter.
This isn't unlike many businesses whose boards are populated by
representatives of other businesses which hold shares in the corporation.
Vincent could be like the president, which is a largely ceremonial post.
The CEO does all the real work, so someone who is motivated to be involved
in that capacity could help move things forward. In fact, many countries
are like this too, with a President for ceremonial purposes and a Prime
Minister to carry out policies and to maintain coalitions of political
parties.

Certainly the little world of Serrada could find a way to emulate these
models, though truth be said, the toughest fights are often over the
smallest crumbs.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 23:59:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Guro Dennis Servaes
Subject: Re: Re: Unity

Stickman Good Post.
GM mentioned to me that he wants to form a new association and have other people in it to help make decissions. Not just him. It could be different people from different Serrada groups.
When Robert Trias started the World Karate Federation it benefited the martial arts community. Soon every major city had qualified instructors. He thought on a grand scale and produced great fighters, and people considered it a privilege to belong to WKF (while Robert Trias was still alive). He used a win win philosophy.
Train hard and have fun!
Dennis

Stickman wrote:

Agreed. I don't necessarily see a unification as a single organization, but
rather an association of related organizations. One model might be
Kajukenbo, which despite differences retains an umbrella identity. Within
Kajukenbo are several formally recognized and distinct styles that have
evolved, and within each of them there are member organizations consisting
of businesses started and run by entrepreneurial teachers.

If Serrada were to try to organize into a larger body, I certainly don't see
the present organizations dissolving themselves. The model I'd envision
would base itself on a board of directors consisting of heads of various
member bodies and perhaps others elected at large according to a charter.
This isn't unlike many businesses whose boards are populated by
representatives of other businesses which hold shares in the corporation.
Vincent could be like the president, which is a largely ceremonial post.
The CEO does all the real work, so someone who is motivated to be involved
in that capacity could help move things forward. In fact, many countries
are like this too, with a President for ceremonial purposes and a Prime
Minister to carry out policies and to maintain coalitions of political
parties.

Certainly the little world of Serrada could find a way to emulate these
models, though truth be said, the toughest fights are often over the
smallest crumbs.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder




[This message contained attachments]



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________



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I agree with everyone on the unity!!


Be safe.. Ben

Agreed. I don't necessarily see a unification as a single organization, but
rather an association of related organizations. One model might be
Kajukenbo, which despite differences retains an umbrella identity. Within
Kajukenbo are several formally recognized and distinct styles that have
evolved, and within each of them there are member organizations consisting
of businesses started and run by entrepreneurial teachers.

If Serrada were to try to organize into a larger body, I certainly don't see
the present organizations dissolving themselves. The model I'd envision
would base itself on a board of directors consisting of heads of various
member bodies and perhaps others elected at large according to a charter.
This isn't unlike many businesses whose boards are populated by
representatives of other businesses which hold shares in the corporation.
Vincent could be like the president, which is a largely ceremonial post.
The CEO does all the real work, so someone who is motivated to be involved
in that capacity could help move things forward. In fact, many countries
are like this too, with a President for ceremonial purposes and a Prime
Minister to carry out policies and to maintain coalitions of political
parties.

Certainly the little world of Serrada could find a way to emulate these
models, though truth be said, the toughest fights are often over the
smallest crumbs.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

> regarding a united serrada association is a utopian idea.  not that
> it wouldn't be revolutionary.

<snip>

> the art of serrada escrima has been taken from the stockton area and
> spread to the midwest, east coast, europe, and soon australia; this
> without a unifying organization.
>
> it will take much more than "major nelson" to put this "jeanie" back
> in the bottle.

Agreed.  I don't necessarily see a unification as a single organization, but
rather an association of related organizations.  One model might be
Kajukenbo, which despite differences retains an umbrella identity.  Within
Kajukenbo are several formally recognized and distinct styles that have
evolved, and within each of them there are member organizations consisting
of businesses started and run by entrepreneurial teachers.

If Serrada were to try to organize into a larger body, I certainly don't see
the present organizations dissolving themselves.  The model I'd envision
would base itself on a board of directors consisting of heads of various
member bodies and perhaps others elected at large according to a charter.
This isn't unlike many businesses whose boards are populated by
representatives of other businesses which hold shares in the corporation.
Vincent could be like the president, which is a largely ceremonial post.
The CEO does all the real work, so someone who is motivated to be involved
in that capacity could help move things forward.  In fact, many countries
are like this too, with a President for ceremonial purposes and a Prime
Minister to carry out policies and to maintain coalitions of political
parties.

Certainly the little world of Serrada could find a way to emulate these
models, though truth be said, the toughest fights are often over the
smallest crumbs.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

jeff as always, very eloquent with your response.

regarding a united serrada association is a utopian idea.  not that
it wouldn't be revolutionary.

with the wsef, iesa, the isec & the inayan groups to name only 5
that i am aware of outside of those associated directly with
vincent, the task could be daunting.  each federation(organization)
has different issues they would need to address 1st before a totally
united front could be established.  this is not including the
problems the Inayan group has with it's divisional problems as well,
in addition to the fact that they don't really recognize Angel at
the heart of what they do either.

additionally, all of these organizations and their members have
accomplishments of their own, that they may not be willing to share,
or to share authority over their members.

I've had conversation with a gentleman who represented Sultan Uddin,
and he was very supportive of the WSEF, at least at that time.

But again, much like the american kempo, chinese kenpo and others
the division and divide can be a huge one.

a pollyanic viewpoint is often a great thought at the start, but
this would challange everyone to believe that being "one" is greater
than the separate parts.

the art of serrada escrima has been taken from the stockton area and
spread to the midwest, east coast, europe, and soon australia; this
without a unifying organization.

it will take much more than "major nelson" to put this "jeanie" back
in the bottle.

that being said, the thought of all one is a interesting one indeed.

respects,

PG Mike

Oh yeah.  That's why Sports Illustrated's swimsuit edition is so huge.  For
the articles ;)
Maybe Khalid had the right idea with his "bad girls of Serrada."

> Stickman, you make me laugh.  Of course I read the article.  Did you think
I just looked at the pictures?

> Some good pictures. Tell us more.
> Dennis

I hope you read the entry below the pictures. That tells more about the
event. The pictures came later.

> Any news about the next Gathering?
> Dennis

Dude! It took 15 years for this one to happen, and a lot was going on
behind the scenes in just the last couple of days to bring everyone
together.

My proposal would be to have an annual memorial for Angel, a reason for
everyone to put aside whatever differences they have for one day, to get
together and honor him with a show of appreciation for the growth of the art
he propogated. Anthony Davis suggested someone different could host it each
time, though I think he has the skills and personality to MC this thing as
long as he has the desire.

What I hope is that everyone there remembers the good vibes in the room.
Yes, there were a few awkward moments as folks didn't know quite how to
react to developments, but I also saw how their better natures came through.
There was a lot of love in that room; if people can remember that, this can
happen again.

It reminds me of a story I heard from my late Tai Chi teacher up in
Fairfield, John Wong. He and Tony Ramos were lifelong adversaries. They
both had high rank in Kajukenbo and were close friends of Sijo Emperado.
They raised families and taught in the same small town, and they even looked
alike (Tony looked to me like John's evil twin). However, their families
were friends, and every so often they'd all wind up together at a luau,
where Tony and John would play Hawaiian music together, setting aside
whatever differences they had in the true spirit of aloha.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder




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> Some good pictures.  Tell us more.
>   Dennis

I hope you read the entry below the pictures.  That tells more about the
event.  The pictures came later.

>   Any news about the next Gathering?
>   Dennis

Dude!  It took 15 years for this one to happen, and a lot was going on
behind the scenes in just the last couple of days to bring everyone
together.

My proposal would be to have an annual memorial for Angel, a reason for
everyone to put aside whatever differences they have for one day, to get
together and honor him with a show of appreciation for the growth of the art
he propogated.  Anthony Davis suggested someone different could host it each
time, though I think he has the skills and personality to MC this thing as
long as he has the desire.

What I hope is that everyone there remembers the good vibes in the room.
Yes, there were a few awkward moments as folks didn't know quite how to
react to developments, but I also saw how their better natures came through.
There was a lot of love in that room; if people can remember that, this can
happen again.

It reminds me of a story I heard from my late Tai Chi teacher up in
Fairfield, John Wong.  He and Tony Ramos were lifelong adversaries.  They
both had high rank in Kajukenbo and were close friends of Sijo Emperado.
They raised families and taught in the same small town, and they even looked
alike (Tony looked to me like John's evil twin).  However, their families
were friends, and every so often they'd all wind up together at a luau,
where Tony and John would play Hawaiian music together, setting aside
whatever differences they had in the true spirit of aloha.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

Any news about the next Gathering?

Dennis

Stickman <stickman@...> wrote:

> For further photos go to the group's photo albums. Also, I'd like
> to mention that the photos are courtesy of Jeff Find and may also be
> seen at www.stickman.com

Nope! That link has nothing to do with me, even though I hold the trademark
for "stickman". It's some graphic artist. The correct url for my blog
(pictures and a link to other photos) is http://escrima.blogspot.com/  .
Also, my stick website is http://www.stickman-escrima.com .

Thanks.

Jeff Finder




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> For further photos go to the group's photo albums. Also, I'd like
> to mention that the photos are courtesy of Jeff Find and may also be
> seen at www.stickman.com

Nope! That link has nothing to do with me, even though I hold the trademark
for "stickman". It's some graphic artist. The correct url for my blog
(pictures and a link to other photos) is http://escrima.blogspot.com/  .
Also, my stick website is http://www.stickman-escrima.com .

Thanks.

Jeff Finder




Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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> For further photos go to the group's photo albums.  Also, I'd like
> to mention that the photos are courtesy of Jeff Find and may also be
> seen at www.stickman.com

Nope!  That link has nothing to do with me, even though I hold the trademark
for "stickman".  It's some graphic artist.  The correct url for my blog
(pictures and a link to other photos) is http://escrima.blogspot.com/ .
Also, my stick website is www.stickman-escrima.com .

Thanks.

Jeff Finder

For those of us who were fortunate enough to attend, I believe
there is a verse in a song which describes the event best by Dave
Mason...

"So let's leave it alone, 'cause we can't see eye to eye...
there are no good guys & there are no bad guys...there's only you &
me and we just DISAGREE."


In these recent, trying times within the Serrada Escrima community,
we all found our own way back to the LIGHT March 3, 2006.

On this date in history the many students of the truth of Cabales
Serrada Escrima came together as one light for all to see.

The smiles, conversation & heart felt handshakes & hugs took us all
thru a day on which Angel Cabales' spirit was with us all and smiled
upon us.

There were Grandmasters & masters from distant days to the present
in attendance.  There were so many, I'm not sure I can recall them
all.

But to point out a few ... GM Anthony Davis(WSEF),GM Vincent Cabales
Sr.(Cabales family), GM Arquilla(Dragon Kosho Shorei Kenpo System),
Punong Guros Vincent Cabales Jr., Darren Tibon(Angel's Disciples)
Wade Williams, Jeff Finder, Jerry Preciado, Ron Saturno, Carlito
Bonjoc,Michael Schwarz and our distiguished host Master Bob Langley
(Dragon Kosho Shorei Kenpo System).  Additionally, as I say many
others, but too many to name.

A special thanks and appreciation to the recipients of the awards
this fine day...

Punong Guro Darren Tibon was given a special award of appreciation
and acknowledgement for his endless support of Cabales Serrada
Escrima.

Gelmar & Mary Gel Cabales(Angel's youngest children) recieved the
commemoration certificate at their brother Vincent Sr,& uncle
Vincent Jr.'s side.

  These were special surprises that the whole of the Serrada family
attending enjoyed.

For further photos go to the group's photo albums.  Also, I'd like
to mention that the photos are courtesy of Jeff Find and may also be
seen at www.stickman.com

Respects,

Punong Guro Mike

How about an update (time, location) for the event being hosted this
upcoming weekend by Anthony Davis in Sacramento?

Jeff,

Thanks for the info....Much appreciated...Ben

--- Stickman <stickman@...> wrote:

> > Any details to what hospital Sony is in?? I would
> like to pay my
> > respects to visit a knowledgeable instructor and a
> great friend of
> > many years
>
> Highland in Oakland.  No visitors yet except
> immediate family.  I called
> yesterday, no answer in his room, but the nurses
> said he's doing well.  I
> heard he was in a coma for awhile (perhaps medically
> induced) but he's awake
> now.
>
> Jeff "Stickman" Finder
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>     WSEFflow-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>
>
>


__________________________________________________
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> Any details to what hospital Sony is in?? I would like to pay my
> respects to visit a knowledgeable instructor and a great friend of
> many years

Highland in Oakland.  No visitors yet except immediate family.  I called
yesterday, no answer in his room, but the nurses said he's doing well.  I
heard he was in a coma for awhile (perhaps medically induced) but he's awake
now.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder

I had been curious, as it was my understanding that when vincent sr.
& vincent jr. had attended a class with darren tibon, that vincent
sr. seemed ill and not quite himself.


  In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, "Guru Ben Pagtanac"
<homiedacop_98@...> wrote:
>
> I worked out with Vince Sr. He's fine.. No, "Slow to the Draw" at
all
>
>
> --- In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, "excalibur921" <excalibur921@>
> wrote:
> >
> > greetings all,
> >
> > perhaps someone close to vincent sr could say how he is feeling.
> >
> > i understand within the past 3 weeks, vincent sr. has not been
quite
> > himself.
> >
>

Any details to what hospital Sony is in?? I would like to pay my
respects to visit a knowledgeable instructor and a great friend of
many years


--- In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, Guro Dennis Servaes
<dennisservaes@...> wrote:
>
> I would like to see Sonny write more too.  I will remember Sonny in
my prayers.
>
>   Train hard and have fun!
>   Dennis
>
> alan stewart <spadaydaga@...> wrote:
>   Dear Stickman,
>
> Thanks for the heads up!  Our prayers are with him.  I just
recently got one of his books.  One that was written with Sid
Campbell.
>
> I hope that he will cover soon and get back to more writing - it
was a very good read, that book.
>
> alan in Southold, NY.
>
>
>
> Stickman <stickman@...> wrote:  I just learned a short while ago
that Sonny Umpad is in the hospital.
> Evidently he had a stroke a day or two ago and a student brought
him to the
> hospital. Doctors found a brain tumor, which is most likely related
to lung
> cancer from smoking (it's not unusual for cancer cells to migrate
to the
> brain). The tumor has been removed. Please send prayers for his
recovery.
>
> Jeff "Stickman" Finder
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   test'; " type=text/css>
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I worked out with Vince Sr. He's fine.. No, "Slow to the Draw" at all


--- In WSEFflow@yahoogroups.com, "excalibur921" <excalibur921@...>
wrote:
>
> greetings all,
>
> perhaps someone close to vincent sr could say how he is feeling.
>
> i understand within the past 3 weeks, vincent sr. has not been quite
> himself.  possibly slow to draw if you will.  from appearance, i've
> heard that he seems ill, is this true???
>

greetings all,

perhaps someone close to vincent sr could say how he is feeling.

i understand within the past 3 weeks, vincent sr. has not been quite
himself.  possibly slow to draw if you will.  from appearance, i've
heard that he seems ill, is this true???

Dear Stickman,

Thanks for the heads up!  Our prayers are with him.  I just recently got one of his books.  One that was written with Sid Campbell. 

I hope that he will cover soon and get back to more writing - it was a very good read, that book.

alan in Southold, NY.



Stickman <stickman@...> wrote:

I just learned a short while ago that Sonny Umpad is in the hospital.
Evidently he had a stroke a day or two ago and a student brought him to the
hospital. Doctors found a brain tumor, which is most likely related to lung
cancer from smoking (it's not unusual for cancer cells to migrate to the
brain). The tumor has been removed. Please send prayers for his recovery.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder




Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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---

Brings words and photos together (easily) with
PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail.

I just learned a short while ago that Sonny Umpad is in the hospital.
Evidently he had a stroke a day or two ago and a student brought him to the
hospital. Doctors found a brain tumor, which is most likely related to lung
cancer from smoking (it's not unusual for cancer cells to migrate to the
brain). The tumor has been removed. Please send prayers for his recovery.

Jeff "Stickman" Finder




Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WSEFflow/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WSEFflow-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/