Wow, thanks for all the help. I'll look into this.

--- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, Scott Bernstein <saberns@...> wrote:
>
> I have a lot of experience with GPS, especially Garmin.  I own several,
including a Nuvi (for the car), GPS60CS, eTrex Vista Hcx, Edge 705
(bike-specific unit).  The "bike" mode on the car or outdoor/hiking models
refers to routing functions.  When you program a destination and have the
device make a route for you in "bike" mode, it tries to avoid things like toll
roads or highways.  So this is good if you're on a ride and want the device to
suggest a route home.  The device does not factor in topographic data
(hills) into auto-routing.  There are, however, topographic data sets which
can be uploaded to most units and this would at least let you see where the
hills are and avoid them manually - or seek them out!  This would be most
useful for planning your bike rides on your PC, then uploading those routes to
your unit.
>
> As far as mounting, it depends on which specific unit you have.  Most of the
car-specific units are not designed to be mounted on handlebars so this may
require a universal bar mount.  You can look online at places like
thegpsstore.com - they have lots of accessories.  Be aware that the universal
mounts are most often used on motorcycles, so although sturdy they will be
heavy. Some of the outdoor/recreational units such as the eTrex series or 60cs
have optional handlebar mounts that are available directly from Garmin.
>
> As far as battery life, it depends on which unit, the age of the rechargable
battery, or if you are using alkaline batteries.  Most units have a "battery
saver" option which will extend the life of the battery a little bit by slowing
down the position updates from continuous to once per second or so.
>
> My favorite GPS for biking is the Edge 705.  It has a color screen, a great
many bike-specific features that the other units do not have, and is very small
and light.  It basically looks like a large cycle computer.  It also has full
mapping capabilities with auto-routing, and wireless cadance and HR monitors.
>
> If you let me know which specific unit you have I might be able to give more
specific info.
>
> PS:  I don't work for Garmin - I just have no sense of direction so I always
need to find my way!
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: David Karel <lerakd@...>
> To: WCCChat@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tue, December 1, 2009 7:57:15 AM
> Subject: RE: [WCCChat] Use of regular Car GPS for bicycle?
>
>  
> My garmin has a "bike" mode as well.  Unfortunately, the garmin doesn't avail
itself of bike paths or other "off road" routes, so certain routes cannot be
selected.
>
>
>  
> David Karel
>
>
> --- On Tue, 12/1/09, Norman Sherran <norman@sherran. net> wrote:
>
>
> >From: Norman Sherran <norman@sherran. net>
> >Subject: RE: [WCCChat] Use of regular Car GPS for bicycle?
> >To: WCCChat@yahoogroups .com
> >Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 3:15 AM
> >
> >
> > 
> > Use the software on my computer to plan a route. I don’t think the
battery lasts that long about 2 hours.
> > 
> >
> ________________________________
>
> >From:WCCChat@yahoogroups .com [mailto: WCCChat@yahoogroups .com ] On Behalf
Of long_slowrider_ bob
> >Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 10:42 PM
> >To: WCCChat@yahoogroups .com
> >Subject: [WCCChat] Use of regular Car GPS for bicycle?
> > 
> > 
> >I just discovered that my regular car Garmin GPS also has a bicycle mode. Has
anyone used this? How does it take in account hills, or does it just find the
most direct path, or does it avoid hills? How long does battey last without
charge? How to mount on bike? Courious, as this could be good when I am lost.
Anyone have experience with it?
>

I just discovered that my regular car Garmin GPS also has a bicycle mode. Has
anyone used this? How does it take in account hills, or does it just find the
most direct path, or does it avoid hills? How long does battey last without
charge? How to mount on bike? Courious, as this could be good when I am lost.
Anyone have experience with it?

Labonne's Market

22 Academy Street

Salisbury, CT 06068

Can't go Sun but hope to go Sat if still on.

--- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, Brian Sharlach <brian.sharlach@...> wrote:
>
> Right now the weather for Saturday looks questionable (30% chance of rain &
> snow showers), but Sunday looks better (mostly sunny).  Would anyone
> planning to ride let me know if you would prefer to change the ride to
> Sunday or keep it on Saturday?  I will leave it on Saturday for now, and
> post an update early Friday evening.  Ride details are below and please
> contact me if you have any questions.
>
> Happy Thanksgiving!
> Brian
> 203-938-8057 (h)
> 203-858-0841 (c)
>
> For mapping purposes the start location is:
>
> Labonne's Market
>
> 22 Academy Street
>
> Salisbury, CT 06068
>
> Saturday, November 28
> THE 6TH ANNUAL HAT CITY ALICE'S RESTAURANT RIDE
> Another Thanksgiving weekend ride that couldn't be beat! Start in
> Salisbury, CT for a 66 mile scenic ride through the southern
> Berkshires (almost all back roads) before passing the site of Alice's
> Restaurant and "the scene of the crime" in Stockbridge, and on the
> way back, "the church where Alice lived". No big hills and shorter
> options possible. Start at 10:00am from the Salisbury IGA parking
> lot. C Pace, RO, MP, RG, Faster riders welcome. Ride Leader: Brian
> Sharlach;
brian.sharlach@...<http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/hcc-announcements/post?p\
ostID=uol7CAKoKMN6aQW7pRSn9M5uudpCcGJ3WPsCakfzbjk9AUUy7flGYW2frzpqr8UYBafjUfBiv1\
-zg_8k0JuDHbWkwQ>;
> 203-938-8057; cell 203-858-0841
> (morning of ride). More info about Alice's Restaurant at:
> http://www.arlo.net/lyrics/alices.shtml
>

Labonne's Market

22 Academy Street

Salisbury, CT 06068

http://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/roadway_dept/policy_guide/t504035.cfm

The above link is to a Federal Highway administration policy #T 5040.35
on highway rumble strips. While is largely espouses the type of strips that we have had such problems with, it makes some recommendations that would keep it off of most county roads that we ride upon.

For example:
How can the adverse effects of rumble strips on bicyclists be reduced?
The
FHWA fully supports the following statement from the 1999 American
Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials (AASHTO)
Guide for the Development of Bicycle Facilities:


"Rumble strips or raised pavement markers are not recommended where
shoulders are used by bicyclists unless there is a minimum clear path
of 0.3 m (1 ft) from the rumble strip to the traveled way, 1.2 m (4 ft)
from the rumble strip to the outside edge of paved shoulder, or 1.5 m
(5 ft) to adjacent guardrail, curb or other obstacle."
Rumble
strips should only be installed when an adequate unobstructed width of
paved surface remains available for bicycle use. To aid a bicyclist's
movement to the left of a shoulder rumble strip when needed to avoid
debris, make turns or avoid other shoulder users, some states provide
periodic gaps of 3.0 m (10 ft) to 3.6 m (12 ft) between groups of the
milled-in elements throughout the length of the shoulder rumble strip.
A study by one state recommends a gap of 3.6 m (12 ft) between
milled-in elements of 8.5 m (28 feet) to 14.6 m (48 feet). Other states
have specified 3.0 m (10 ft) gaps between 3.0 m (10 ft) milled-in
elements.
Small stones, sand and other debris
often collect on roadway shoulders. Usually the air turbulence caused
by passing traffic will keep the portion of the shoulder closest to
traffic relatively clear of such debris. For this reason, most
bicyclists prefer to ride on that portion of the shoulder nearest to
traffic to avoid debris. To provide a clear area beyond the rumble
strip for bicycle travel, highway maintenance agencies should
periodically sweep shoulders along identified bicycle routes and other
routes of high bicycle usage.
Recent studies by
two states attempted to develop modified rumble strip designs that
would be more acceptable to bicyclists. The principle adjustments to
the milled-in strip elements considered were reduced depth, reduced
width and changes to the center-to-center spacing. Also, several types
of raised elements have been tested and evaluated. These studies are
identified in references m. and n. in paragraph 10. Both studies
concluded that a reasonable compromise between maximum warning to
errant motorists and tolerable discomfort to bicyclists were
reduced-depth, milled rumble strips.

2.)Rumble strips should not normally be used in urban or suburban areas or
along roadways where prevailing speeds are less than 80 km/h (50 mph).
When used on non-access controlled facilities, they should be
discontinued in advance of driveways and intersections and other
locations where they would be crossed on a regular basis. Where rumble
strips are being installed for the first time or where their use might
be unexpected, appropriate signs and pavement markings alerting both
motorists and cyclists to their presence are advisable. Since standard
signing and markings do not presently exist, one state has initiated an
experimental study under Section 1A-10 of the Millennium Edition of the
Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices to develop and evaluate
proposed signing and marking for rumble strips.


Alternatives are mentioned, but the ones I saw in Florida may not be good with snowplow use. For some reason, the reflector equipped recessed markers are not considered to be adequate audible devices, probably because they are too far apart and cars may not hit enough of them while going off the road to wake the driver.

Some observations:
1) I am not particularly confident that shallower rumbles will make them that much safer.
2) The width can be cut down considerably on roads where large trucks are not likely to be used heavily at night.
3) Fogging with liquid asphalt sealer could have prevented the rapid decomposition of route 100. Too bad DOT is unfamiliar with such things. Perhaps we could teach them to read.
4) The shoulder maintenance issue recommended here has a ZERO compliance rate in our county, including Route 100. Gravel is not removed from the shoulders on any scheduled basis.
5) Many of the roads in question would not allow for 12 inches between the white line and the rumble strip. Currently there is often NO SPACE between the white line and potholes, or a dirt shoulder.
6) Clearly, no one from NY DOT knows or cares about Federal standards anyway, but it is nice to know that they exist, and a good attorney might be able to use them to get a court to issue a stop work order on some of this foolishness.
7) The less than 50mph exclusion, even though it states "not normally", at least sets the bar high, as to justification of spending taxpayer dollars on MOST of the county's roads when this is not the federal standard.

Bill


William F. O'Connell O.D., F.A.A.O.




To: WCCRides@yahoogroups.com
From: wolfpics@...
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 06:42:51 -0500
Subject: RE: [WCCRides] Good article on rumble strips.....




























Bill, would you be able to write a short note about the different types. I'd

be happy to post it my blog. Florida also has the 3-foot law. Did you notice

that in effect?

Randall



-----Original Message-----

From: WCCRides@yahoogroups.com [mailto:WCCRides@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf

Of William Oconnell

Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 12:20 AM

To: WCC Rides

Subject: RE: [WCCRides] Good article on rumble strips.....



Dave, (and everyone else),

I just returned from a ride in Florida, where I encountered MANY roads with

warning strips of some form or another. NONE OF THEM BOTHERED MY CYCLING!!!

As most of us are aware, there are a multitude of warning type devices that

can be placed on the side of the roads. Many of them do not seem to cause

nearly as much trouble for cyclists as the strips that are along Route 100

do. No question, the strips on 100 are the strongest signal to a driver,

they would wake up the dead. They also, however, seem to result in the most

damage to road surfaces and cause a big shortening in useful road surface

life, something the other solutions appear NOT to do if installed correctly.

We should do a study of these alternatives and recommend a few to the state

as "acceptable alternatives" when rumble warnings are merited.

Granted, they are all annoying to cyclists, but the other types did not seem

to create a fall or a loss of control hazard.



Let us be proactive and have alternatives ready.



Bill



William F. O'Connell O.D., F.A.A.O.



To: WCCRides@yahoogroups.com

From: davidmckaywilson@...

Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:06:25 +0000

Subject: [WCCRides] Good article on rumble strips.....



Here's a good article on DOT policy on rumble strips. An excellent

point is made: they are put in to help the inattentive driver from hurting

himself. And by doing that, you put in peril the cyclist, who is the most

attentive person on the road.



http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/11/24/to-snap-drivers-awake-state-dot-may-sa

crifice-cyclist-safety/



dave







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------



Please be kind to those who subscribe to the "daily digest": try to delete

excessive quoting of old messages in your own posts to this group.



WCCRides group home page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WCCRides

WCC homepage: http://www.westchestercycleclub.org/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:

WCCRides-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links



















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Please be kind to those who subscribe to the "daily digest": try to delete excessive quoting of old messages in your own posts to this group.

WCCRides group home page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WCCRides
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To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: WCCRides-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links

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Please go to LoHud.com to voice your opinion on the proposed 3-foot law.
http://www.lohud.com/article/20091117/NEWS/911170376/Should-cyclists-get-a-3-foo\
t-buffer?-Give-us-your-thoughts.

Also check out the posts on Cycling Central. http://cycling.lohudblogs.com/

Thanks

This bike is now for sale:

-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  [CRW] Sheldon Brown bicycle for sale
Date:  Sat, 14 Nov 2009 10:14:19 -0500
From:  John S. Allen <jsallen@...>
To:  Charles River Wheelmen <charlesriverwheelmen@yahoogroups.com>
References:  <A5CC762518BD4465B1E27796F10BD7AE@LIBRARYHP>


Another of Sheldon Brown's bicycles is for sale, a 2006 Raleigh
Cadent 4.0 with a carbon fiber frame, 10-speed cassette and triple
cranks -- weight 20 1/2 pounds. This bicycle rather uniquely combines
a relaxed riding position (higher head tube than on a road-racing
bicycle), relatively short top tube and all the most modern features
for light weight. This bicycle is especially suitable for club rides
and day tours.

The eBay listing is at:

http://tinyurl.com/ykht64v

More details about this bicycle are on Sheldon's Web site:

http://sheldonbrown.org/raleigh-cadent/index.html

John S. Allen

jsallen *at* bikexprt.com

http://bikexprt.com

----- end message -----


--- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, "petesalomone" <pete@...> wrote:
>
> Harris Cyclery is just outside Boston off the Mass Pike.  While they do mail
order they have a real store with new bikes and lots of hard to get parts. 
While Sheldon Brown is no longer, his website is maintained
>
> --- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, "long_slowrider_bob" <lillieishot@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I found this bike:
> >
> > http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/raleigh/cadent1.0.html
> > <http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/raleigh/cadent1.0.html>
> >
> > It says it is specially designed for confor and less strain on back and
> > hands, exactly what I am looking for, and they have higher end models.
> > However, I can't seem to find it anywhere else except this mail order
> > place. Anyone know anything about this?
> >
> >
> > --- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, "tyn531" <nee.t@> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > On the subject of trying many bikes and demoing before buying, a lot
> > of information can be gathered by doing homework on different
> > manufacturers' websites. Most post the geometries of the frames. Whereas
> > most manufacturers are using very similar quality equipment, the frame
> > is where much of the ride difference will be derived - the wheels would
> > be the second determinant.
> > >
> > > Sheldon Brown's site gives some insights on how to interpret frame
> > geometry information.
> > >
> > > http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-sizing.html
> > >
> > > Below are geometries from several popular manufacturers. The
> > Performance Road category is often where recreational riders are steered
> > towards. You can see that the geometries of this class are less
> > aggressive than the modern racing geometries (bottom set). In principle,
> > this Performance class has higher headtubes and slacker head tube
> > angles. This should promote more upright riding positions and more
> > steering stability.
> > >
> > > The Perfomance Hybrids, aside from handlebar difference, do not have
> > higher headtubes, and likely not for sure offer more upright position
> > than the Performance Road class. What they offer is longer wheelbases
> > and shallower headtube angles, which translates into more stable comfy
> > rides.
> > >
> > > Going back to the Felt Z70 and Specialized Sequoia from Bob's posts.
> > They are both more towards the comfy end of the four Performance Road
> > bikes shown below. That said, the Specialied has the higher head tube
> > (more upright) and longer wheelbase and lower bottom bracket (more
> > stable) and shallower angles (more stable and more comfy). If one wanted
> > a better climbing bike, one would move more towards the Pilot, which has
> > a shorter chainstay and wheelbase, which still maintaining a long
> > headtube. A centimeter here, and a degree there does make a difference
> > in ride characteristics. In modern days, so does the frame material in
> > combination with the geometry.
> > >
> > > ETT HA SA CS BB WB HT
> > >
> > > Performance Road
> > > Trek Pilot 2.1 55 72.5 73.3 42 26.9 99.9 18.5
> > > Cann Synapse 56 72.5 73.5 43 69 99.9 18
> > > Felt Z70 56 72.5 73.5 41.7 70 101.2 18
> > > Spec Sequoia 56.5 72 73 43 72 102.9 20
> > >
> > > Performance Hybrids
> > > Felt Speed 30 56 72.5 73.5 41.7 70 100.7 18
> > > Cann Quick 2 56 71.5 74 43 27.4 103.9 17
> > > Trek 7.6 FX 56.8 71.5 73.5 44.5 28.5 105.8 16
> > > Spec Sirrius 56 71.5 74 43.5 70 104.5 18.5
> > >
> > > Moderne Racing
> > > Trek Madone 56 73.5 73.3 41 26.8 98.3 14
> > > Felt F1 56 73.5 73.5 41 70 98.8 14
> > > Spec Tarmac 56.5 73.5 73.25 40.5 69 98.6 17
> > >
> > > ETT = Effective Horizontal Top Tube Length (cm)
> > > HA = Head Tube Angle (steeper generally means quicker steering)
> > > SA = Seat Tube Angle (steeper generally means position further
> > forward, more power goes to wheel, but may be less comfy)
> > > CS = Chain Stay Length (cm) (longer generally means more comfy rear
> > end, but more flex when power applied)
> > > BB = Bottom Bracket (cm) (either drop or height; lower BB height is
> > more stable in turns, but has less pedaling clearance)
> > > WB = Wheel Base Length (cm) (shorter is quicker like a race car, good
> > for racing, can be fatiguing for longer rides or day after day touring)
> > >
> > > ------------
> > >
> > > This is a long winded way of saying that one should do a good deal of
> > research before plunking down $1200-$1500 on a first higher quality road
> > bike. Understand what you really would like the bike to do. What are the
> > trade offs that you really want to make. For example, skiing long high
> > speed turns on a racing salom ski might not be the most enjoyable
> > combination.
> > >
> > > Decades ago when I sold bikes for a living, I remember a customer
> > coming in wanting to buy Grab-ons for a new Bianchi that he bought a few
> > weeks ago from another shop, which was a very good value for the money.
> > Value aside, he was being "pounded to death" by the aggressive racing
> > geometry (for that day and age), 74 degree head and seat tube angles,
> > 99cm wheelbase. I was willing to sell him the Grab-ons (big foam tubes
> > that are put over the handle bar), but I talked with him about what he
> > wanted to do with the bike, what type of riding. I had him try a Miyata
> > 1000 just to have him see the Grab-ons that were standard equipment. He
> > then found out what the difference a touring geometry (72 degree
> > parallel angles, 103cm wheelbase) would have on the ride. He bought the
> > Miyata. For months afterwards, I would see him on century rides and
> > checked in with him that this was really the right choice or not. I
> > wanted to assure him that I wasn't trying to force him into a purchase.
> > He consistently said it was the right choice, and I didn't force the
> > choice.
> > >
> > > On other occassions, I referred customers to that shop that sold that
> > model of Bianchi, as in my opinion, that was the best buy for the class,
> > but only for riders who were athletic and wanted to power away at speed
> > (I asked for their driving styles too). It may not be good immediate
> > business, but I believe I should refer customer to other brands that
> > might fit better, or for them to try and compare to what I had in stock.
> > In my case, I'd rather have a happy long term customer who came back to
> > buy accessories and their next bike from me than the immediate sale of a
> > bicycle.
> > >
> >
>

Thanks Kate! For this valuable advice and info on a great site for road riders
:-)

--- In WCCChat@yahoogroups.com, Katie Marshall <kttrue@...> wrote:
>
> Some of you may get the RBR newsletter.  If not, check it out:
> http://www.roadbikerider.com/newsletter.htm
>
> Here is a choice bit from this week.
>
> *Davis Phinney's Tips for Winter Riding*
>
> ---*Ride with a friend or group.*  Sharing conversation as well as a draft
> helps the miles go by. But group rides must be cohesive. Don't let them
> degenerate into hammerfests. You shouldn't do any hard, fast riding when the
> temperature is below 50F degrees (10C). Instead, use winter to accumulate
> base miles.
>
> ---*Don't overdress.*  If you're not chilly in the first few minutes, you
> have probably worn too much and will overheat.
>
> ---*Start with hot drinks* in freezing temperatures and use insulated
> bottles or covers to increase the time before liquids turn to slush.
>
> ---*Be wary of shaded corners*, which may hide ice.
>
> ---*Wear light, bright colors* to help motorists see you on dim days.
>
> ---*Install rear reflectors* or carry reflective ankle bands for times when
> dusk catches you a few minutes from home.
>
> ---*Carry two tubes.*  Patching a tube with freezing fingers isn't easy,
> should a second flat occur.
>
> ---*Don't stop for long*, if at all. Resumption of the windchill will make
> you cold, and you may be unable to shake the shivers for the rest of the
> ride.
>
> ---*Ride short on frigid days.*  As a rule, you can be fairly comfortable
> for 90 minutes in subfreezing temperatures. But things may deteriorate
> quickly after that, particularly if you have raised a sweat.
>
> ---*Take time to recover after riding.*  Winter takes more out of you.
> Because of the elements and your lower fitness level, a 50-mile (90-km)
> winter ride feels like 80 miles (128 km).
>
> ---*Be extra careful when you've been sick.*  Don't try to make up a week of
> lost training by riding before you're completely well. There is plenty of
> time to get back on track when spring arrives.
>
> ---*Even if you live where winters are mild, you still need to go easy.* Use
> winter for recovery. Don't get caught in the flying-in-January, dead-by-June
> trap.
> Kate Marshall
>