----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Cedeno

To: NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 4:18 PM

Subject: RE: [NostalgiaDragRacing] Re: Have you been Affected by USDOT Regulations?

Ken,

 

I have again confirmed what I have already told you.  I spoke today with NYDOT head of the Truck & Motor carrier Bureau in Albany, Bill Leonard.  He confirmed that the exception I told you apply would certainly apply - provided you were not writing off expenses, or corporately sponsored.  He said he very much discourages people from gettting a number unless they are truly commercial.  I told him about folks like you being told they need a number, he said he would contact the Batavia officer directly and speak to him about the regulations.

 

I do not know if, when you were stopped, your car had the name of your plumbing business, or if you were indeed writing off your expenses....which are of course, commercial indicators.  If you were - then you need a number...but if not...you don't.

 

Please let me know if you have had any additional dealings with DOT officers in your area.  I am very interested and continue to pursue information to help the hobbyists.

 

I have a series of articles being published in the North American Trailer Dealers Assoc. trade journal on this subject, if you would like a copy of these articles please let me know and I'll add you to my email list.

 

Mary

KENNETH IAMELE <KIAMELE@...> wrote:

HI, I have a question; I own my own plumbing business with a cube van, what if I wanted to pull my race trailer with it? It is a DBA and the van is registered to me as personal registration not a business. I have been using my fathers pickup to tow the race trailer but when I was stopped and when I went to the local DOT office in Henrietta  NY I was told both times that the registered owner has to have DOT #’s on the truck when ever you tow a trailer. I have been in the plumbing business since 1982 and have driven all kinds of trucks from pickups to box trucks and we never had to pull over at truck inspection stations. In July of 07’ my employee was pulled over in my cube van for going past one on rt 490 east and he received 6 tickets and I got 8. the first one for both of us was no DOT #’s. he called me and I talked to the dot cop, he stated that in July of 06’ NYS put in to law that any commercial truck, 10,001lbs or over and under has to stop at the inspection stations and have DOT #’s. I got them for my van. Not to long after is when I was pulled over on I90 coming home from a night of Jr Drag racing at Lancaster, as stated below. Is there something in writing that we should carry with us to defend our self’s on the road? My father all ready got the DOT #’s for his truck because I told him I had to have them to tow the trailer. I’m hoping I didn’t screw him here. Any help or info would be greatly appreciated. KILLER KEN IAMELE    

---

From: NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com [mailto:NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carlos & Mary
Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 11:33 AM
To: NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [NostalgiaDragRacing] Re: Have you been Affected by USDOT Regulations?

Guys,
I have forwarded the email to Mary and of course we all have to
do what we think is best for us individually.
Mary did a Power Point presentation that points out all the issues
and was backed up by lawyers and at least one State DOT supervising
officer,
There is a problem with just getting a DOT number when it doesn't
really apply to you. Yes you may think I got the number now I am
safe!!
Well its not that easy. By getting the number you are now telling
the DOT that you are in business and you have now accepted and are
now required to follow all the regulations including hours of
service, rest time, drug/alcohol testing, safety reviews and service
logs. It must be followed in precisely the methods and manners the
law requires, not just what you think they may want.
You have accepted and are now being held to the same standards as
the professional trucking companies and professional truckers must
adhere to.
Your number is also now on the database and when a DOT officer pulls
up next to you on the highway they can simply enter it into the
computer and receive a percentage result of how many times you have
been stopped and been found out of compliance. Ignorance of the law
and requirements will not be an excuse and fines for not being in
compliance will begin at $1000.00 per infraction! :(
Both a lawyer familiar with the subject, and a Florida DOT
supervisor have stated that getting a number when it does not apply,
or not being able to fully answer the roadside officer gives that
officer a mixed signal and they will therefore think that some sort
of business is going on.
Racing for prize money and or a trophy is not being in commerce as
some road side officers would have folks believe. It is either
ignorance on their part, or an argument that justifies their view
and makes their job easier, your life harder and brings in $ in
revenue to local jurisdictions.
Just last week talking to a couple of former Professional drivers
who said folks signing up for a DOT number when its not warranted
will cause them a lot of headaches.
Recently a father and son racing team that have a big rig to tow
their race cars with their name asked Mary for info. She directed
them to their state DOT with all the information and in the end they
where told they did not need a DOT number for what they where doing
in their case.
If you have not seen Mary's presentation ask her directly for it and
check it out, it is not the end all but it may give a better
understanding of the issues.

All that said do what you think is best for you and we wish you the
best and safe motoring.

Carlos

--- In NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com, "KEN IAMELE"
<KIAMELE@...> wrote:
>
> HI, Iwas pulled over coming back to rochester from lancaster
speedway
> on a tuesday night this past year. I was towing a 24' enclosed
> trailer with "NOT FOR HIRE" on it using my fathers pickup truck. I
> did not get any tickets but the truper told me that becouse i am
> racing for money weather its cash or a thropie with a cash value
you
> are in buisness and you need dot #'s. I had all of the safty items
in
> place, ie; fire extigisher, firts aid kit, safty tri-angles ect.
he
> let me off with a warnning. i have since gotten the dot #'s & i
hope
> there is nothing more i need incase i get pulled over again.
> KILLER KEN
>
>
>
> -- In NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com, Mary Cedeno
> <fairenforcement@> wrote:
> >
> > Oh the injustice of it all!! Makes one want to stay in bed.
> I'll keep at it though. The difference is that you are in the
> trucking business. My cause is really for the hobbyist - someone
NOT
> in business on the road with a CMV. There are many of us. Thanks
> for the feedback though. This is what I'm looking for.
> > M
> >
> > everhartsgarage <everhartsgarage@> wrote:
> > Fairenforsement, having spent 17 years in the trucking
> bussiness I
> > can tell you that it does not really matter what the law may be
as
> > you and I read it to be or even what we have been told by the
> people
> > who wrote the law. In reality it is up to the officer who may
write
> > you a ticket and then you can go before the judge and make your
> case
> > to him and he will decide if you were right in your thinking of
> what
> > the law was in your case. Usually you are about 3 states from
home
> > and
> > you'll need to pay the fine or post a bond before you can
continue
> > on your way. And
> > then at a later date you can go back 3 states and see the judge.
> > Maybe you'll get to see him 2 or 3 times, or until you get tired
of
> > making the trip to see him. He'll tell you what he
> > thinks about it. I know, because I'll done it a couple of times.
> You
> > keep up the good work, and good luck in your cause.
> > though.
> >
> >
> > --- In NostalgiaDragRacing@yahoogroups.com,
> > Mary Cedeno <fairenforcement@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I'm a new member to your group. I joined so that I could learn
> > how hobbyists are being affected by the USDOT Regulations, and
so
> > that I could help folks to know what the regulations are. I am
not
> > a regulatory official or a lawyer, I have simply done a ton of
> > research on this subject and would like share what I have
learned
> > and learn even more.
> > >
> > > Many people all over the country who are NOT in business have
> > been reporting that they have been stopped by law enforcement
and
> > told they need a USDOT number. Here is what the Federal
Regulations
> > state as far as applicability of that regulation goes:
> > >
> > > 390.3(f) Exceptions: Unless otherwise specifically provided,
> > the rules in this subchapter do not apply to
> > > (f)(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by
> > individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a
> > commercial enterprise;
> > >
> > > Furthermore, the FMCSA even provided GUIDANCE on what they
> > meant. Here is that guidance:
> > >
> > > Question 21: Does the exemption in §390.3(f)(3) for
> > the "occasional transportation of personal property by
individuals
> > not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial
> > enterprise" apply to persons who occasionally use CMVs to
transport
> > cars, boats, horses, etc., to races, tournaments, shows or
similar
> > events, even if prize money is offered at these events?
> > >
> > > Guidance: The exemption would apply to this kind of
> > transportation, provided: (1) The underlying activities are not
> > undertaken for profit, i.e., (a) prize money is declared as
> ordinary
> > income for tax purposes, and (b) the cost of the underlying
> > activities is not deducted as a business expense for tax
purposes;
> > and, where relevant; (2) corporate sponsorship is not involved.
> > Drivers must confer with their State of licensure to determine
the
> > licensing provisions to which they are subject.
> > >
> > > Although these are Federal Regulations, each state has adopted
> > these regulations as their own, in order to be able to enforce
> > them. ( A deal the states made with Feds -for which they get
paid
> > of course).
> > >
> > > My understanding is that unless there are additional STATE
> > regulations that make it so, if you are not in business, not
> writing
> > off your expenses, etc., then the USDOT regulations do not apply
to
> > you. I have been working hard at contacting the individual
states
> > to confirm that there are no additional rules that would apply,
and
> > the dozen or so I've contacted so far, have no additional rules.
> > >
> > > I would like to know if you are not in business and have been
> > pulled over by enforcement - what happened?
> > >
> > > As my username implys, I am fighting for Fair Enforcement of
> > this regulation...
> > > Thanks.
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo!
> > Mobile. Try it now.
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
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Yahoo!
> Search.
> >
>

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