My brother just bought a new BP rifle and gave me his CVA Hawken.The
only problem I have is the set triggers. No matter how much I adjust
the screw tension I can set the rear trigger but the front trigger is
a hair triger. If you breathe on it, it will go off. My brother got
rid of it because he couldn't figure it out.
Anybody have any ideas on how to adjust the triggers or is it the
lock?

For those who are interested, the single trigger from the Lyman Trade
Rifle will not swap out directly with the one on the GPR.  The trigger
plate which everything mounts on is much shorter on the trade rifle. I
ordered one to put on my GPR but right now it is a no-go.  I need to
see if I can take out the two triggers on the GPR and just put the new
trigger in its place, but that will leave a hole where the set trigger
goes.  Oh fiddle!

-Kees-

--- In Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com, greg marts <gmarts_1999@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi Kees- Thank you for the kind words. The two Lyman triggers should
be easy to switch out.

It does not hurt to polish all parts under stress where other metals
ride like the frizzen where the spring rides and also the pan it will
help things work better.
Here is some good reading links
http://members.aol.com/illinewek/faqs/tuning.htm
http://www.barrettwebs.com/ibha/flint1.htm

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Provin" <robert.provin@...>
To: <Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 1:56 PM
Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Frizzen Problem


> Hi All,
> Well, the other day I was playing with my flintlock and found that
> when the rifle was fired the frizzen did not open all the way after
> being struck by the flint. Nothing I did seemed to fix the problem
> until I applied a bit of grease on the frizzen spring where the
> frizzen makes contact. It works fine now, but I haven't heard or read
> that the frizzen spring needs this kind of lubrication. Any one have
> any thoughts about this?


Hi Rob,

I always like to keep a little dab of gun grease in that spot.  It not only
makes the frizzen run more smoothly, but it also prevents wear on the spring
and/or frizzen where they meet.

Kev

Robert-
It can't hurt to put a little REM Oil on it- anything under tension with
a little friction could always use a little lubrication.
My neighbor welded my frizzen back together and it works great.  I just
need to shoot the thing now.  These guns are just so hard to stay away
from.  But once I've built the Blunderbuss, I'll take a break from
building them for a little while.
And it's hard to find a place in Nebraska where there's no public land
to shoot on.  And ranges sure like to charge a fair amount- just because
you COULD have one blow up in your face.
J


Robert Provin wrote:

> Hi All,
> Well, the other day I was playing with my flintlock and found that
> when the rifle was fired the frizzen did not open all the way after
> being struck by the flint. Nothing I did seemed to fix the problem
> until I applied a bit of grease on the frizzen spring where the
> frizzen makes contact. It works fine now, but I haven't heard or read
> that the frizzen spring needs this kind of lubrication. Any one have
> any thoughts about this?
>
> TIA,
> Robert
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.bp-outdoors.com/muzzleloader.html . . . Muzzleloaders,
> Shooting, Hunting and Outdoor resources.
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS
> Hunting leases
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Hunting+leases&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hun\
ting&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=7dYCByxHw9Ep3hQSTGBcSA>
>  Bow hunting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Bow+hunting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+huntin\
g&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=pNsLNrBglFp0lgGEz4vLXA>
>  Turkey hunting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Turkey+hunting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hun\
ting&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=KPcJDrNvTrR6NzTaH63vgg>
>
> Shooting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hunting&w\
3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=UIFWiepSxnp7k56IGEm-Qg>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>     *  Visit your group "Muzzleloaders
>       <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Muzzleloaders>" on the web.
>
>     *  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>        Muzzleloaders-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>       <mailto:Muzzleloaders-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
>
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>       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

Hi All,
Well, the other day I was playing with my flintlock and found that
when the rifle was fired the frizzen did not open all the way after
being struck by the flint. Nothing I did seemed to fix the problem
until I applied a bit of grease on the frizzen spring where the
frizzen makes contact. It works fine now, but I haven't heard or read
that the frizzen spring needs this kind of lubrication. Any one have
any thoughts about this?

TIA,
Robert

> Do NOT, and I repeat in CAPS DO NOT use a piece of hardwood dowel
for a ramrod unless
> you want to see how your hand (and/or wrist) look impaled on a skewer

Which is why I said to look it over very carefully to make sure the
grain goes all the way through.  My original GPR ramrod had the grain
coming out the side, about halfway down and it sheared there.  I was
lucky not to have my hand over the rod or it would have been
shishkebab also!  If the grain is straight from top to bottom you
don't have that weak point.  I have a hickory rod I bought through the
mail and it also has the grain running out the side, and it is sitting
on the shelf where it (and I) is safe.

I have heard of the kerosene soak, that it limbers up the rod.  If it
works that's probably a good thing to do.  I haven't ever done it, and
the GPR rod breaking was the first one I have had a problem with since
1968.

Fiberglass may wear out the muzzle....

-Kees-

I'm probably going to just buy a composite or plastic one.  I don't
know.  I hammered the ramrod into the loops, gently.  Getting it out of
there when the temperature gets above freezing will be the next
challenge.  7 degrees is too cold for me to be outside shooting.  Unless
my survival depends on it.  Hamburger is 65 cents a pound, so it doesn't.
Copy that, no pine ramrods.
J


John W. wrote:

> Do NOT, and I repeat in CAPS DO NOT use a piece of hardwood dowel for
> a ramrod unless
> you want to see how your hand (and/or wrist) look impaled on a skewer
> ready to
> barbecue!!!  Order a REAL hickory ramrod from a reputable black powder
> supplier, trim it
> to length, fit the appropriate attachments (if you want any at all),
> place the ramrod in a
> section of PVC pipe that's long enough to completely enclose the
> entire length, fill with
> kerosene and soak for at least a week to "temper" the ramrod.
>
> Then, and only then, will the ramrod be suitably flexible to withstand
> the rigors of setting
> a tightly patched roundball without the opportunity to prepare
> yourself for an informal
> shish-kabob!
>
> This comes from practical experience from when I started this hobby
> (1970), and I
> wouldn't want anyone to have to pick splinters out of themselves as I
> did for several
> months (wood doesn't show up in X-Ray) following a ramrod "shortcut".
>
> I DO agree that you need to get out and burn some powder though!!!
>
> John in Arizona
>
> >
> >
> > > The Flintlock kit is finished.  The only problem now is
> > > the ramrod won't fit in the loops
> >
> > From the photo it looks like you figured out what that piece of brass
> > was for!  You might want to chuck the ramrod in a drill and turn it
> > down a tad with sandpaper.  Of course if the end fitting won't go
> > through then you may need to get a new ramrod which is smaller
> > diameter.  Another thought is to get a smaller diameter dowel and
> > attach the fittings from the old ramrod to the new.  Just look the
> > dowel over real careful before you buy it to make sure the grain is
> > straight all the way through so there are no weak spots.  I made one
> > for my GPR that way when the original broke, and it has worked fine
> > for several years now.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.bp-outdoors.com/muzzleloader.html . . . Muzzleloaders,
> Shooting, Hunting and Outdoor resources.
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS
> Hunting leases
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Hunting+leases&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hun\
ting&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=7dYCByxHw9Ep3hQSTGBcSA>
>  Bow hunting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Bow+hunting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+huntin\
g&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=pNsLNrBglFp0lgGEz4vLXA>
>  Turkey hunting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Turkey+hunting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hun\
ting&w3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=KPcJDrNvTrR6NzTaH63vgg>
>
> Shooting
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting&w1=Hunting+leases&w2=Bow+hunting&w\
3=Turkey+hunting&w4=Shooting&c=4&s=71&.sig=UIFWiepSxnp7k56IGEm-Qg>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>     *  Visit your group "Muzzleloaders
>       <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Muzzleloaders>" on the web.
>
>     *  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>        Muzzleloaders-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>       <mailto:Muzzleloaders-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
>
>     *  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

Do NOT, and I repeat in CAPS DO NOT use a piece of hardwood dowel for a ramrod
unless
you want to see how your hand (and/or wrist) look impaled on a skewer ready to
barbecue!!!  Order a REAL hickory ramrod from a reputable black powder supplier,
trim it
to length, fit the appropriate attachments (if you want any at all), place the
ramrod in a
section of PVC pipe that's long enough to completely enclose the entire length,
fill with
kerosene and soak for at least a week to "temper" the ramrod.

Then, and only then, will the ramrod be suitably flexible to withstand the
rigors of setting
a tightly patched roundball without the opportunity to prepare yourself for an
informal
shish-kabob!

This comes from practical experience from when I started this hobby (1970), and
I
wouldn't want anyone to have to pick splinters out of themselves as I did for
several
months (wood doesn't show up in X-Ray) following a ramrod "shortcut".

I DO agree that you need to get out and burn some powder though!!!

John in Arizona

>
>
> > The Flintlock kit is finished.  The only problem now is
> > the ramrod won't fit in the loops
>
> From the photo it looks like you figured out what that piece of brass
> was for!  You might want to chuck the ramrod in a drill and turn it
> down a tad with sandpaper.  Of course if the end fitting won't go
> through then you may need to get a new ramrod which is smaller
> diameter.  Another thought is to get a smaller diameter dowel and
> attach the fittings from the old ramrod to the new.  Just look the
> dowel over real careful before you buy it to make sure the grain is
> straight all the way through so there are no weak spots.  I made one
> for my GPR that way when the original broke, and it has worked fine
> for several years now.

> The Flintlock kit is finished.  The only problem now is
> the ramrod won't fit in the loops

From the photo it looks like you figured out what that piece of brass
was for!  You might want to chuck the ramrod in a drill and turn it
down a tad with sandpaper.  Of course if the end fitting won't go
through then you may need to get a new ramrod which is smaller
diameter.  Another thought is to get a smaller diameter dowel and
attach the fittings from the old ramrod to the new.  Just look the
dowel over real careful before you buy it to make sure the grain is
straight all the way through so there are no weak spots.  I made one
for my GPR that way when the original broke, and it has worked fine
for several years now.

Nice looking piece!  Now get out there and burn some powder!

> and then work on a blunderbuss from scratch- I just don't
> know what to do about the barrel.  Any suggestions?

You might want to contact Track of the Wolf and/or Dixie Gunworks and
ask them if they carry a blunderbus barrel.  If they don't have one,
they can surely point you in the right direction for finding one.

-Kees-

Justin
if you look at Robert Baird photo Album in the photo section of the
muzzleloaders group page you will see 3 not to good of pictures of my
CVA Kentucky it is just like your Traditions Kentucky mine is percussion

Robert Baird

The Flintlock kit is finished.  The only problem now is the ramrod won't
fit in the loops without a hammer to slam it down in there- which I
don't want to do, because it'll never come out of there.
I used sawed-off nails as tenon-pins and I guess the barrel supports the
other piece of the stock.  I'll upload the image to the website this
morning- then I'll get all the tools and parts out of the dining room!
Thanks for everyone's help in this project.  I'm going to take a break
and then work on a blunderbuss from scratch- I just don't know what to
do about the barrel.  Any suggestions?
J

Well I have the CVA version of that rifle and the 2 pins that are
between the main stock and forearm is where that piece of brass is to
go. I thought you where talking about the long thin piece that is the
toe plate  The  tenon pins is what keep them from coming apart once
the stock and barrel are put together there is a picture on the photo
page of the group that shows this its under Robert Baird
you can see the piece of brass between the two pieces of stock it just
slides over the 2 pins that hold the two stock halves together.
I hope this is as clear as mud



--- In Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com, "kees99919" <kees99919@...> wrote:
>
> > it will show you the pins that hold the barrel to the stock and you
> > can see where the piece of brass that you where talking about goes toe
> > plate
>
> The kit he is talking about has the two-piece stock (see the original
> post).  The forearm is actually seperate from the rest of the stock,
> and there is a brass piece which goes between them.  I believe this is
> what he is referring to.  How it attaches is not known to me, as I have
> just seen the kits put together at a distance.  I understand that some
> folks have replaced the brass with a thin sliver of wood to make it
> look more like a one piece stock.
>
> I hope this doesn't sound like a flame.  No offense was meant, and we
> all appreciate your willingness to help.  Besides, I may be all wet and
> you correct!  :>)
>
> -Kees-
>

On Wednesday, February 15, 2006, at 04:12  PM, Ken Nellis wrote:

> Walt:
>
> Nice to meet you! What do you shoot, or is that still under
> development?
>
> I do .45 flintlock long rifle, 1858 Remington copy revolver, and have
> owned
> a 12 Gauge Pedersoli double.  (Deeply regret selling it...)
>
> We look forward to hearing more from you.
>
> Ken

Hi Ken,

Good to hear from you. I'm not shooting anything right now. I'm new to
Skinnin' although I've had an interest for many years. Before I jump
into buying a smoke-pole I need to define a persona and nail down a
time period. I sold my 36 cal. navy pistol and a 50 cal. flintlock
before I moved from California (and my good 150 lb. English anvil too).
I hung onto my flint & steel, shooting bag, powder measure, haversack,
dutch ovens, fire irons and misc. stuff common to most periods.

I have bought from Panther Primitives while doing medieval stuff, I
like their tents, do you know of anyone owning one of their pyramid
tents? or does everyone go for the lean-to or teepee?

Walt Cornell

waltcornell@...
archer92284@...

If you're singing Christmas songs on your neighbor's lawn at night with
your church group, it's called  "caroling." But if you're doing it
alone with no pants on, it's called "drunk and disorderly."

Does anyone know about a Blunderbuss kit or has anyone built one?  I
think I'm ready to start from scratch, and a Blunderbuss would be a good
thing for me to start.
It's going to be a huge project, but I'd like to try it.  Does anyone
have any dimensions I could use to start and know what metals to use to
each part?
I think I can get a big piece of Beechwood- or even Ash, since all the
Ash trees in Nebraska are now dead.
J

Walt:

Nice to meet you! What do you shoot, or is that still under development?

I do .45 flintlock long rifle, 1858 Remington copy revolver, and have owned
a 12 Gauge Pedersoli double.  (Deeply regret selling it...)

We look forward to hearing more from you.

Ken



----Original Message Follows----
From: Walt <waltcornell@...>
Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
To: archer92284@...
Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Hello! New to the list
Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2006 12:49:52 -0600

Hello everyone,

I've just joined your list and I wanted to say "hello". I've had an interest
in Buckskinning for quite some time, but because my (then) other half (now
ex) was interested in medieval history we did SCA 12th century stuff. I'm
looking forward to the upcoming Pomme de Terre Rendezvous in my new home
state of Missouri. I live in a log cabin on 27 wooded acres close to the
Arkansas state line. I look forward to "meeting you all

Walt Cornell

waltcornell@...
archer92284@...

> I have a Traditions Pennsylvania flintlock rifle
> that needs (or will
> soon need) a new jaw screw

Have you tried contacting Traditions?  they may be able to help you out:
http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/contactUs.asp

-Kees-

> it will show you the pins that hold the barrel to the stock and you
> can see where the piece of brass that you where talking about goes toe
> plate

The kit he is talking about has the two-piece stock (see the original
post).  The forearm is actually seperate from the rest of the stock,
and there is a brass piece which goes between them.  I believe this is
what he is referring to.  How it attaches is not known to me, as I have
just seen the kits put together at a distance.  I understand that some
folks have replaced the brass with a thin sliver of wood to make it
look more like a one piece stock.

I hope this doesn't sound like a flame.  No offense was meant, and we
all appreciate your willingness to help.  Besides, I may be all wet and
you correct!  :>)

-Kees-

Robert:

If you have trouble finding a new one the existing screw can probably be
repaired by heating it with a propane torch until cherry red, and then
bending it back into shape.

Also, for what it's worth, it's possible to tap the threads to a standard
American thread, and buy a screw from Dixie, or another supplier.  I've done
that to metric nipple holes, to make them 1/4 x 28.

Ken

----Original Message Follows----
From: "Robert Provin" <robert.provin@...>
Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Top Jaw Screw
Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2006 18:54:59 -0000

Hi All,
I have a Traditions Pennsylvania flintlock rifle that needs (or will
soon need) a new jaw screw preferably a little longer than the
one supplied.. The screw that's in there now is bent and I am
afraid it may soon break. Any one out there know where I can
get a new jaw screw?  I believe it is metric as well.

TIA,
Robert

Check with Deer Creek Prod.
Phone #765-525-6181
They do not have a webpage

Robert Baird



--- In Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Provin"
<robert.provin@...> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> I have a Traditions Pennsylvania flintlock rifle
> that needs (or will
> soon need) a new jaw screw preferably a little
> longer than the one
> supplied.. The screw that's in there now is bent and
> I am afraid it
> may soon break. Any one out there know where I can
> get a new jaw screw?
> I believe it is metric as well.
>
> TIA,
> Robert
>

Hi All,
I have a Traditions Pennsylvania flintlock rifle
that needs (or will
soon need) a new jaw screw preferably a little
longer than the one
supplied.. The screw that's in there now is bent and
I am afraid it
may soon break. Any one out there know where I can
get a new jaw screw?
I believe it is metric as well.

TIA,
Robert

I have put a file on the files page of the group for you to look at
	  dp kentucky.tif
Davide Pedersoli Kentucky Standard Flintlock model

it will show you the pins that hold the barrel to the stock and you
can see where the piece of brass that you where talking about goes toe
plate

This is a very nice Kit for the Money

Hello everyone,

I've just joined your list and I wanted to say "hello". I've had an
interest in Buckskinning for quite some time, but because my (then)
other half (now ex) was interested in medieval history we did SCA 12th
century stuff. I'm looking forward to the upcoming Pomme de Terre
Rendezvous in my new home state of Missouri. I live in a log cabin on
27 wooded acres close to the Arkansas state line. I look forward to
"meeting you all

Walt Cornell

waltcornell@...
archer92284@...



"At the birth of the Sun, and his brother the Moon, their Mother died.
So the Sun gave to the earth her body from which was to spring all
life, And he drew forth from her breast the stars and he threw them
into the night sky to remind him of her soul."

For those following the saga of the broken frizzen- it has been
repaired.  My neighbor (the best Chevy Mechanic in Nebraska) took it to
work and welded it.  While it isn't pretty, it looks more like a REAL
flintlock because they we're guns that were supposed to be ornate.  It
is actually more durable now.  The lock works and throws surprising good
sparks.  And kudos to the suggesters of the English flints.  I can't
believe how little the flint chips off- so this may end up being cheaper
than caps.  Someday I'll actually get to shoot these things!
J

I have put a fill on the fill page of the group for you to look at
	 dp kentucky.tif
Davide Pedersoli Kentucky Standard Flintlock model

it will show you the pins that hold the barrel to the stock and you
can see where the pice of brass that you where talking about goes toe
plate

This is a very nice Kit for the Money

Robert Baird






--- In Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com, "Ken Nellis" <knellis@...> wrote:
>
> Justin:
>
> The flat piece of brass sounds like a toe plate to me.  If so, it
goes un
> the underside of the butt, touching the butt plate.  Its purpose is
to keep
> the thin maple at that point from splitting or breaking.
>
> Regarding that frizzen, have you contacted the seller of the kit?
(While
> you're at it tell the seller you didn't get the screws with your toe
plate!)
>   I once hamhandedly broke off a trigger I had bought from Dixie.
When I
> called they told me to send the entire assembly back with a sum of
money,
> and they replaced it.  The embarrassment, and aggravation at myself
were the
> worst of it.
> Good luck!
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: Justin Hall <justin.hall1@...>
> Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
> To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Putting the kit together
> Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 16:28:46 -0600
>
> One last post and I'll be quiet for the rest of the week!
> I have a Traditions Kentucky .50 cal flintlock kit (the one with the
> broken frizzen now) and I'm attempting to put the stock together.  It's
> in 2 pieces, and I have the pins that I put through the barrell tangs,
> but I also have a piece of brass with 3 holes in it.  It is about 6
> inches long and 1/2 inch wide, and 1/10 inch thick.  I think it goes
> under the barrel, but it doesn't have any screws with it, and if I did
> put it in, the ramrod wouldn't go into the hole unless I sheared off the
> screws.  It seems there needs to be more holding the 2 pieces of the
> stock together.  Hopefully the frizzen can be welded back together in
> time to actually shoot the thing.
> In any case, if anyone out there has any experience with these, I'd
> appreciate the help.
> J
>

Justin:

The flat piece of brass sounds like a toe plate to me.  If so, it goes un
the underside of the butt, touching the butt plate.  Its purpose is to keep
the thin maple at that point from splitting or breaking.

Regarding that frizzen, have you contacted the seller of the kit? (While
you're at it tell the seller you didn't get the screws with your toe plate!)
   I once hamhandedly broke off a trigger I had bought from Dixie.  When I
called they told me to send the entire assembly back with a sum of money,
and they replaced it.  The embarrassment, and aggravation at myself were the
worst of it.
Good luck!

Ken



----Original Message Follows----
From: Justin Hall <justin.hall1@...>
Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Putting the kit together
Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2006 16:28:46 -0600

One last post and I'll be quiet for the rest of the week!
I have a Traditions Kentucky .50 cal flintlock kit (the one with the
broken frizzen now) and I'm attempting to put the stock together.  It's
in 2 pieces, and I have the pins that I put through the barrell tangs,
but I also have a piece of brass with 3 holes in it.  It is about 6
inches long and 1/2 inch wide, and 1/10 inch thick.  I think it goes
under the barrel, but it doesn't have any screws with it, and if I did
put it in, the ramrod wouldn't go into the hole unless I sheared off the
screws.  It seems there needs to be more holding the 2 pieces of the
stock together.  Hopefully the frizzen can be welded back together in
time to actually shoot the thing.
In any case, if anyone out there has any experience with these, I'd
appreciate the help.
J

Kees:

Sure, I'll be glad to elaborate a bit.  In short, I had picked up a
crazy-quilt mishmash of folklore that mixed good advice for casual shooting
(minute of deer), and good advice for bench rest (minute of angle)
requirements.

This is written with a .45 flintlock longrifle and real blackpowder in mind.

1. I heard years ago that for the tightest groups you should use a ball .005
undersize with a .010 patch.  This may be true for bench rest shooting, but
to make it work I believe you have to maintain a very clean barrel, meaning
perhaps two wet cleaning patches and a dry one after each shot.  My mistake
was to attempt it without wiping, or wiping with only one patch.  My results
included holes all over the target, not just in the black, and recovered
patches that had holes where they had contacted the rifling.

I returned to using a ball a full caliber smaller than the lands with a .016
patch, and saw immediate improvement.

2. When I purchased a ML shotgun I had switched from FFFg powder to FFg in
the rifle as well.  It seemed sensible to just buy one granulation, and the
various ML books implied that .45 caliber was on the "border" and ought to
work with either.  Within the last few weeks I discovered that they yield
different pressures, and that FFFg is reputed to burn noticeably cleaner,
thus reducing the fouling problem.

I wasn't getting good results with FFg using the same charge (55 gr) that I
had used with FFFg.  When I went past 70 grains of FFg I started seeing some
improvement.  Recently I saw a web site that claimed that when going from
3Fg to 2Fg you had to increase the charge by 40%.  My own experience bears
this assertion out.

I use FFFFg powder for priming.  When in a big hurry, as in timed
competition, or when hunting critters with big tusks and ornery
dispositions, a person is perhaps better off to prime straight from the main
horn with 2F or 3F.

3.  I had been using Bore Butter as a lube.  Someone suggested that the
beeswax actually contributed to fouling, and that I'd do better with Neat's
Foot Oil, or a "Water Soluble Oil" and water concoction.  Between the latter
two I'm getting better groups with the latter mixed 50-50 with water.

ML folklore insists that each patch cleans the bore as it is rammed, but
that isn't working for me with FFg, regardless of lube.  Maybe people who
claim to shoot all day and never wipe their bores have shallower rifling
than I??? Mine is .010 deep, a Green Mountain barrel.

The three big fixes for me were: smaller ball size, larger powder charge,
and maybe or maybe not a change in patch lube.  Hope these ideas help
someone.  To the best of my knowledge the conclusions above are correct or
nearly so, but I'd appreciate any rebuttal or good advice you could offer.

All the best,

Ken



----Original Message Follows----
From: "kees99919" <kees99919@...>
Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Muzzleloaders] Re: FW: Welcome to Muzzleloaders
Date: Tue, 07 Feb 2006 17:53:34 -0000

Welcome aboard, Ken!

If you could be so kind as to elaborate on how you are undoing the
changes we can all benefit.  Most of us are trying to get better
accuracy out of our smokepoles, and what you do might help someone else
also.

Again glad to have you here.  You will find this a good group to confab
with.

-Kees-

Justin:

Region 2 is New York and New Jersey
I have a General Ticket, and like CW (Morse Code) best, though I'm very
slow; about 10 wpm. I mostly work 40 and 80 Meters.

I also play tenor banjo.

Sorry to hear about your lock.  I hope the repair goes well for you.  The
frizzen needs to be hardened in a certain way to enable it to spark.  My
first ML rifle had a lock that was of a disappointing quality, so I made
sure my second had the best.  I am very happy with my L&R Durs Egg lock, and
would not hesitate to recommend them.  They make a line of replacements for
several of the well known repro rifles.  Maybe they make one that would drop
right in your lock mortise.  It'd be more than $35, but probably faster,
longer lasting and better looking.

All the best,

Ken Nellis



----Original Message Follows----
From: Justin Hall <justin.hall1@...>
Reply-To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
To: Muzzleloaders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Muzzleloaders] Knapping Flints
Date: Wed, 08 Feb 2006 19:00:47 -0600

So there's other ham-muzzleloaders besides me?  I thought I was all
alone in the world.
Where is 2 land?  NY?
I'm displaced to Omaha from Idaho, where I started muzzleloading in 1990
as a high-schooler.
I hope I don't have to knap them from scratch, because I just ordered
some from Indian Creek.  Got cheap English ones and expensive English ones.
I have the printout from someone that suggested how to do it, so I could
knap one in the field.  I just couldn't believe it was $40 for the ring
of tools to do it.  I have a Leatherman that would probably work just fine.
But now I have to decide what to do when I finish the stock of the
rifle- I broke the frizzen off when I was doing a test dry-fire.  Did I
mention I have a 50 IQ?
So I'll have my neighbor fix that and hopefully it'll work, but I have
my doubts and it's $35 for a new lock.  Mama would never agree to that
one, so I hope I can get it fixed.  Know any blacksmiths?
Thanks for the info- have to get on HF one of these days if you do that.
J

One last post and I'll be quiet for the rest of the week!
I have a Traditions Kentucky .50 cal flintlock kit (the one with the
broken frizzen now) and I'm attempting to put the stock together.  It's
in 2 pieces, and I have the pins that I put through the barrell tangs,
but I also have a piece of brass with 3 holes in it.  It is about 6
inches long and 1/2 inch wide, and 1/10 inch thick.  I think it goes
under the barrel, but it doesn't have any screws with it, and if I did
put it in, the ramrod wouldn't go into the hole unless I sheared off the
screws.  It seems there needs to be more holding the 2 pieces of the
stock together.  Hopefully the frizzen can be welded back together in
time to actually shoot the thing.
In any case, if anyone out there has any experience with these, I'd
appreciate the help.
J

> They're about to get rid of the morse code requirement for
everything.

I wonder if anyone uses code at all any more?  Back then it was
easier to get a code signal through than voice when conditions were
poor.  I haven't kept up with things but I would think that with new
advances in electronics that is a thing of the past.

>Apparently there's NO guns out there you can dry-fire!

Lots of folks dry fire their flinters, me included.  The stresses are
no different than when the piece is charged.  Be sure the frizzen is
down on the pan, so the hammer is not coming down full force on its
stop.  Instead of dry firing with a flint in the jaws, cut one out of
a piece of wood and use it.  That won't wear down the frizzen.  You
can also get a pink eraser and cut that to fit which makes a little
less noise in the house.  If you have a set trigger, don't cock the
piece but set the trigger.  Then you will get a click when you fire
the gun but the lock doesn't operate.

I hadn't thought of Deer Creek for a lock.  They advertise that their
guns are all American made, but I have been told that the locks look
suspiciously Spanish.  Have you tried contacting Track of the Wolf or
Dixie Gunworks?  If you just need a frizzen they can probabaly help
you out.  If nothing else get Track's catalog.  They have their gun
parts illustrated full size, so you should be able to put the parts
of your old frizzen on the pictures until you find one which will
work.

Take care,
-Kees-