Agreed.

Maybe it's actually possible. What we need is an angle for a grant from a
health-related foundation so that the clubhouse can be a place to promote
running.

Some current facts make this a possibility. Consider:

• 60% of americans are overweight.

• An article in Nature proved that, BY DESIGN, humans are runners.

• No one promotes running. Think of it. Running shoe companies sell shoes to
runners, but no one sells the benefits of running and the running lifestyle.
You can't turn on the TV or radio without seeing those infomercials for
gimmick diets and weird machines, but no one says a good word on the most
effective and enjoyable weight control method - running.

We'll recreate ourselves as The American Society To Promote the Benefits Of
Running. We'll seek an annual grant to finance the clubhouse and to fund
outreach activities.

Think of it.



>Even greater justification for an LRRC club house with: smooth no
>traffic roads to run in front, all types of trails in the back, the
>complete LRRC Newsletter library both in real & electronic form,
>tons of LRRC related other stuff like the bylaws framed &
>temp/security protected much like the dead sea scrolls, walls
>donning pics of all things LRRC from all years-both real &
>electronic,  all the S beers save the Schlitz, a cook on staff,
>great adventure reads, maybe a few flat screens for active/adventure
>movies(absolutely no chick flix!), a shower spa & hot tub &
maybe a
>creek to dip in when weather & other variables permit.
>
>
>
>--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson"
<csilrun@h...> wrote:
> > I counted 37 LRRC members and hangers-on at Valentino's. Plus,
>some people
> > ran and didn't do Part 2, so I think the total count was about 45.
>Great
> > start.
> >
> >
> > >Fav comment on the run:
> > >"If it wicked anymore it would be a
candle"
> > >
> > >
> > >--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com,
"ultrabuzzardlrrc"
> > >ultrabuzzard@h... wrote:
> > > >
> > > > The Kleinfeltersville Hotel rules!  One of the
best
>roadhouses
> > > > around.
> > > >
> > > > Andy Charles
> > > >
> > > > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com,
"lrrclub"
> > lrrclub@y... wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Good turnout at last nite's first
out-of-the park
>fun run.  1
> > > > count
> > > > > yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We
know a few
>others ran
> > some
> > > > > trails in the park and a few walkers
walked
>elsewhere.  The
> > Red
> > > > Rose
> > > > > course is certainly 1 of the classic
courses out
>there-with a
> > >lull
> > > > you
> > > > > into running fast first 3 miles,
followed by 2
>challenging
> > up-
> > > > hilly
> > > > > final miles.
> > > > >
> > > > > Some comments on the run included
"gee this
>doesn't look
> > like
> > > > Long's
> > > > > Park………but I'm not sure what that looks
like as
>it's always
> > >dark."
> > > > > Also "Daylight……… what a
concept, hope we
>don't get
> > taxed for it
> > > > on
> > > > > 4/15"  and still others
commented on Part 2:
>"This
> > menu doesn't
> > > > look
> > > > > like the Villa-wait a minute it's not
the Nova,
>where's that
> > > > hulking
> > > > > TV and that Buddha person?" As
well as the old
>"is
> > this an
> > >Italian
> > > > > place owned by Greeks or
Italians?"
> > > > >
> > > > > In any case, good kick off to the
get-outta-the
>park
> > "season".
> > > > Next
> > > > > week will be another great course (or
many fine
>trails)
> > > > >  – The Spring fever course at Middle
Creek,
>followed by a
> > duck
> > > > into
> > > > > the K-Ville after.
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>
>

sounds like we need a grantwriter. Given the great concern about rising levels
of obesity and related health concerns, without the mention of beer (although
some wine is supposed to be good for your health) I think we should be able
finagle something.

Megan Gallagher Clark

Even greater justification for an LRRC club house with: smooth no
traffic roads to run in front, all types of trails in the back, the
complete LRRC Newsletter library both in real & electronic form,
tons of LRRC related other stuff like the bylaws framed &
temp/security protected much like the dead sea scrolls, walls
donning pics of all things LRRC from all years-both real &
electronic,  all the S beers save the Schlitz, a cook on staff,
great adventure reads, maybe a few flat screens for active/adventure
movies(absolutely no chick flix!), a shower spa & hot tub & maybe a
creek to dip in when weather & other variables permit.



--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson" <csilrun@h...> wrote:
> I counted 37 LRRC members and hangers-on at Valentino's. Plus,
some people
> ran and didn't do Part 2, so I think the total count was about 45.
Great
> start.
>
>
> &gt;Fav comment on the run:
> &gt;&quot;If it wicked anymore it would be a candle&quot;
> &gt;
> &gt;
> &gt;--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, &quot;ultrabuzzardlrrc&quot;
> &gt;ultrabuzzard@h... wrote:
> &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; The Kleinfeltersville Hotel rules!  One of the best
roadhouses
> &gt; &gt; around.
> &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; Andy Charles
> &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, &quot;lrrclub&quot;
> lrrclub@y... wrote:
> &gt; &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; &gt; Good turnout at last nite's first out-of-the park
fun run.  1
> &gt; &gt; count
> &gt; &gt; &gt; yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We know a few
others ran
> some
> &gt; &gt; &gt; trails in the park and a few walkers walked
elsewhere.  The
> Red
> &gt; &gt; Rose
> &gt; &gt; &gt; course is certainly 1 of the classic courses out
there-with a
> &gt;lull
> &gt; &gt; you
> &gt; &gt; &gt; into running fast first 3 miles, followed by 2
challenging
> up-
> &gt; &gt; hilly
> &gt; &gt; &gt; final miles.
> &gt; &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; &gt; Some comments on the run included &quot;gee this
doesn't look
> like
> &gt; &gt; Long's
> &gt; &gt; &gt; Park………but I'm not sure what that looks like as
it's always
> &gt;dark.&quot;
> &gt; &gt; &gt; Also &quot;Daylight……… what a concept, hope we
don't get
> taxed for it
> &gt; &gt; on
> &gt; &gt; &gt; 4/15&quot;  and still others commented on Part 2:
&quot;This
> menu doesn't
> &gt; &gt; look
> &gt; &gt; &gt; like the Villa-wait a minute it's not the Nova,
where's that
> &gt; &gt; hulking
> &gt; &gt; &gt; TV and that Buddha person?&quot; As well as the old
&quot;is
> this an
> &gt;Italian
> &gt; &gt; &gt; place owned by Greeks or Italians?&quot;
> &gt; &gt; &gt;
> &gt; &gt; &gt; In any case, good kick off to the get-outta-the
park
> &quot;season&quot;.
> &gt; &gt; Next
> &gt; &gt; &gt; week will be another great course (or many fine
trails)
> &gt; &gt; &gt;  – The Spring fever course at Middle Creek,
followed by a
> duck
> &gt; &gt; into
> &gt; &gt; &gt; the K-Ville after.
> &gt;
> &gt;
> &gt;

I counted 37 LRRC members and hangers-on at Valentino's. Plus, some people
ran and didn't do Part 2, so I think the total count was about 45. Great
start.


>Fav comment on the run:
>"If it wicked anymore it would be a candle"
>
>
>--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "ultrabuzzardlrrc"
><ultrabuzzard@h...> wrote:
> >
> > The Kleinfeltersville Hotel rules!  One of the best roadhouses
> > around.
> >
> > Andy Charles
> >
> > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "lrrclub"
<lrrclub@y...> wrote:
> > >
> > > Good turnout at last nite's first out-of-the park fun run.  1
> > count
> > > yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We know a few others ran
some
> > > trails in the park and a few walkers walked elsewhere.  The
Red
> > Rose
> > > course is certainly 1 of the classic courses out there-with a
>lull
> > you
> > > into running fast first 3 miles, followed by 2 challenging
up-
> > hilly
> > > final miles.
> > >
> > > Some comments on the run included "gee this doesn't look
like
> > Long's
> > > Park………but I'm not sure what that looks like as it's always
>dark."
> > > Also "Daylight……… what a concept, hope we don't get
taxed for it
> > on
> > > 4/15"  and still others commented on Part 2:  "This
menu doesn't
> > look
> > > like the Villa-wait a minute it's not the Nova, where's that
> > hulking
> > > TV and that Buddha person?" As well as the old "is
this an
>Italian
> > > place owned by Greeks or Italians?"
> > >
> > > In any case, good kick off to the get-outta-the park
"season".
> > Next
> > > week will be another great course (or many fine trails)
> > >  – The Spring fever course at Middle Creek, followed by a
duck
> > into
> > > the K-Ville after.
>
>
>

Fav comment on the run:
"If it wicked anymore it would be a candle"


--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "ultrabuzzardlrrc"
<ultrabuzzard@h...> wrote:
>
> The Kleinfeltersville Hotel rules!  One of the best roadhouses
> around.
>
> Andy Charles
>
> --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "lrrclub" <lrrclub@y...> wrote:
> >
> > Good turnout at last nite's first out-of-the park fun run.  1
> count
> > yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We know a few others ran some
> > trails in the park and a few walkers walked elsewhere.  The Red
> Rose
> > course is certainly 1 of the classic courses out there-with a
lull
> you
> > into running fast first 3 miles, followed by 2 challenging up-
> hilly
> > final miles.
> >
> > Some comments on the run included "gee this doesn't look like
> Long's
> > Park………but I'm not sure what that looks like as it's always
dark."
> > Also "Daylight……… what a concept, hope we don't get taxed for it
> on
> > 4/15"  and still others commented on Part 2:  "This menu doesn't
> look
> > like the Villa-wait a minute it's not the Nova, where's that
> hulking
> > TV and that Buddha person?" As well as the old "is this an
Italian
> > place owned by Greeks or Italians?"
> >
> > In any case, good kick off to the get-outta-the park "season".
> Next
> > week will be another great course (or many fine trails)
> >  – The Spring fever course at Middle Creek, followed by a duck
> into
> > the K-Ville after.

The Kleinfeltersville Hotel rules!  One of the best roadhouses
around.

Andy Charles

--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "lrrclub" <lrrclub@y...> wrote:
>
> Good turnout at last nite's first out-of-the park fun run.  1
count
> yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We know a few others ran some
> trails in the park and a few walkers walked elsewhere.  The Red
Rose
> course is certainly 1 of the classic courses out there-with a lull
you
> into running fast first 3 miles, followed by 2 challenging up-
hilly
> final miles.
>
> Some comments on the run included "gee this doesn't look like
Long's
> Park………but I'm not sure what that looks like as it's always dark."
> Also "Daylight……… what a concept, hope we don't get taxed for it
on
> 4/15"  and still others commented on Part 2:  "This menu doesn't
look
> like the Villa-wait a minute it's not the Nova, where's that
hulking
> TV and that Buddha person?" As well as the old "is this an Italian
> place owned by Greeks or Italians?"
>
> In any case, good kick off to the get-outta-the park "season".
Next
> week will be another great course (or many fine trails)
>  – The Spring fever course at Middle Creek, followed by a duck
into
> the K-Ville after.

Good turnout at last nite's first out-of-the park fun run.  1 count
yielded 23 Red Rose run – runners.  We know a few others ran some
trails in the park and a few walkers walked elsewhere.  The Red Rose
course is certainly 1 of the classic courses out there-with a lull you
into running fast first 3 miles, followed by 2 challenging up-hilly
final miles.

Some comments on the run included "gee this doesn't look like Long's
Park………but I'm not sure what that looks like as it's always dark."
Also "Daylight……… what a concept, hope we don't get taxed for it on
4/15"  and still others commented on Part 2:  "This menu doesn't look
like the Villa-wait a minute it's not the Nova, where's that hulking
TV and that Buddha person?" As well as the old "is this an Italian
place owned by Greeks or Italians?"

In any case, good kick off to the get-outta-the park "season".  Next
week will be another great course (or many fine trails)
  – The Spring fever course at Middle Creek, followed by a duck into
the K-Ville after.

Good Luck to everyone headed to Bull Run this weekend!!!  Given all the
rain we've had, the Blue Bells should be beautiful.  Bull Run is a long
but very fun day on the trails.

First timers--it's a totally a kickass doable course.  Go out EASY on
the North loop, then just keep moving forward on the South loop.
You'll be shaking Chris Scott's hand at the finish before you know it!!

LL

Awe might be a strong word which is used all too frequently in
today's lexicon (esp. the word "awesome").  You are right, respect
is a much better word.  I just think we should all be careful in
focusing too much on the negative (i.e., "self-promotion") versus
the actual positive accomplishments.  I don't have a problem with a
little more attention focused on the ultra sport.  Perhaps it will
bring a little more understanding from the "why do you run that far"
crowd, or if not understanding, at least more knowledge.

Andy Charles

--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Cramer" <ratbuzzard@p...> wrote:
> no sour grapes on my part
> having run 22 hours myself, I surely respect her determination and
strength
> to complete 80 hours.
> I just found Dean's book on my porch today
> I'm sure it's going to be interesting and motivating, but I can't
really say
> I'm in awe.
> I'm in awe of soldiers who get limbs blown off in Iraq, and want
to go back
> and fight again
> I'm in awe of what the pope accomplished in his life.
> I'm in awe of unselfish sacrifices
> Pam and Dean....well they just run.
>
> Jim
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ultrabuzzardlrrc" <ultrabuzzard@h...>
> To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 6:14 AM
> Subject: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report
>
>
> >
> >
> > I'll never understand why the "ultra community" doesn't embrace
> > these athletes with open arms rather than with the disdain that
> > seems evident from some folks both here, on the VHTRC site and
> > various ultra publications.  Do Dean and Pam have sizeable egos?
> > Sure they do!  So what exactly is wrong with that?  Wouldn't you
say
> > that having an ego would be a REQUIREMENT for being able to
convince
> > yourself that you have the physical ability to just be able to
> > attempt such a feat, much less complete it?  I'm simply in awe of
> > these accomplishments, and have tons of respect for each of them.
> > I'm sure Pam's completion of the 300 will motivate Dean further.
> > Nothing wrong with that.  I suspect that members of the ultra
> > community that "pooh-pooh" these athletes might be engaging in
just
> > a smidgeon of sour grapes.
> >
> > Andy Charles
> >
> > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Cramer" <ratbuzzard@p...>
wrote:
> > > What will be the next distance challenge ultra runners will
> > attempt ?
> > > 400.....500 miles ?
> > > Being motivated by Dean's failure at the distance makes it
appear
> > like a
> > > massive 300 mile ego trip on her part.
> > > Just my opinion on the article, news coverage can give the
wrong
> > impression
> > > occasionally (note sarcasm)
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Hunt Bartine" <hbartine@y...>
> > > To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>; "Trail Dawgs"
> > <traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 8:12 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Pam Reed did finish her epic 300 mile yesterday in
> > > > under 80 hours:
> > > > http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/breaking/032805reed.php
> > > >
> > > > --- ultrabuzzardlrrc <ultrabuzzard@h...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > RE: your question, has Pam Reed replaced Ann Trason
> > > > > as the best woman
> > > > > ultra runner.  That's a very difficult question to
> > > > > answer.  Lumping
> > > > > all ultrarunners together in one category would be
> > > > > like asking "who is
> > > > > the best distance runner"?  The difference between a
> > > > > garden variety
> > > > > 50K and the Badwater 135 mile race are obviously
> > > > > huge.  Pam Reed is
> > > > > quite a versatile runner, not just a Badwater
> > > > > specialist.  I am sure
> > > > > that Badwater is the central focus of her running
> > > > > life these days, but
> > > > > she also has some pretty awesome non-Badwater
> > > > > credentials.  For
> > > > > example, she was the top American woman in 2003 at
> > > > > the World 24-hour
> > > > > championships in the Netherlands, covering 134.86
> > > > > miles.  She was
> > > > > sixth overall.  My guess (and it's only a guess) is
> > > > > that Ann Trason
> > > > > was a better pure 100 mile trail racer than Pam,
> > > > > evidenced by her
> > > > > multiple year mastery at Western States.  However,
> > > > > the things that Pam
> > > > > Reed has accomplished on the track and road through
> > > > > a hellish training
> > > > > schedule combined with sheer guts and determination
> > > > > are remarkable.
> > > > > She shares a certain "strength of will" quality with
> > > > > Dean Karnazes
> > > > > that I don't think too many others can match.  I
> > > > > thought the piece on
> > > > > 60 Minutes was very well done.
> > > > >
> > > > > Andy Charles
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson"
> > > > > <csilrun@h...> wrote:
> > > > > > In preparation for Badwater, numerous LRRC members
> > > > > journeyed to
> > > > > Lititz for
> > > > > > the Sauder's Easter Egg 5 Miler. Many, excluding
> > > > > this writer, ran
> > > > > well.
> > > > > > Faces spotted included Bill Doherty, who blistered
> > > > > 32:07, and
> > > > > probably
> > > > > > should have been under 32 because the course was a
> > > > > little long. Also
> > > > > there
> > > > > > were Donovan, Doris, the Buckwalters, Dave
> > > > > Greiner, and many more
> > > > > whom I
> > > > > > forget.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I saw the 60 Minutes on Badwater. Has Pam Reed
> > > > > surpassed Ann Trason
> > > > > as the
> > > > > > best woman ultra runner, or is Reed merely a
> > > > > Badwater specialist?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________
> > > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > > Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
> > > > http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

no sour grapes on my part
having run 22 hours myself, I surely respect her determination and strength
to complete 80 hours.
I just found Dean's book on my porch today
I'm sure it's going to be interesting and motivating, but I can't really say
I'm in awe.
I'm in awe of soldiers who get limbs blown off in Iraq, and want to go back
and fight again
I'm in awe of what the pope accomplished in his life.
I'm in awe of unselfish sacrifices
Pam and Dean....well they just run.

Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "ultrabuzzardlrrc" <ultrabuzzard@...>
To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 6:14 AM
Subject: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report


>
>
> I'll never understand why the "ultra community" doesn't embrace
> these athletes with open arms rather than with the disdain that
> seems evident from some folks both here, on the VHTRC site and
> various ultra publications.  Do Dean and Pam have sizeable egos?
> Sure they do!  So what exactly is wrong with that?  Wouldn't you say
> that having an ego would be a REQUIREMENT for being able to convince
> yourself that you have the physical ability to just be able to
> attempt such a feat, much less complete it?  I'm simply in awe of
> these accomplishments, and have tons of respect for each of them.
> I'm sure Pam's completion of the 300 will motivate Dean further.
> Nothing wrong with that.  I suspect that members of the ultra
> community that "pooh-pooh" these athletes might be engaging in just
> a smidgeon of sour grapes.
>
> Andy Charles
>
> --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Cramer" <ratbuzzard@p...> wrote:
> > What will be the next distance challenge ultra runners will
> attempt ?
> > 400.....500 miles ?
> > Being motivated by Dean's failure at the distance makes it appear
> like a
> > massive 300 mile ego trip on her part.
> > Just my opinion on the article, news coverage can give the wrong
> impression
> > occasionally (note sarcasm)
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Hunt Bartine" <hbartine@y...>
> > To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>; "Trail Dawgs"
> <traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 8:12 AM
> > Subject: Re: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Pam Reed did finish her epic 300 mile yesterday in
> > > under 80 hours:
> > > http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/breaking/032805reed.php
> > >
> > > --- ultrabuzzardlrrc <ultrabuzzard@h...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > RE: your question, has Pam Reed replaced Ann Trason
> > > > as the best woman
> > > > ultra runner.  That's a very difficult question to
> > > > answer.  Lumping
> > > > all ultrarunners together in one category would be
> > > > like asking "who is
> > > > the best distance runner"?  The difference between a
> > > > garden variety
> > > > 50K and the Badwater 135 mile race are obviously
> > > > huge.  Pam Reed is
> > > > quite a versatile runner, not just a Badwater
> > > > specialist.  I am sure
> > > > that Badwater is the central focus of her running
> > > > life these days, but
> > > > she also has some pretty awesome non-Badwater
> > > > credentials.  For
> > > > example, she was the top American woman in 2003 at
> > > > the World 24-hour
> > > > championships in the Netherlands, covering 134.86
> > > > miles.  She was
> > > > sixth overall.  My guess (and it's only a guess) is
> > > > that Ann Trason
> > > > was a better pure 100 mile trail racer than Pam,
> > > > evidenced by her
> > > > multiple year mastery at Western States.  However,
> > > > the things that Pam
> > > > Reed has accomplished on the track and road through
> > > > a hellish training
> > > > schedule combined with sheer guts and determination
> > > > are remarkable.
> > > > She shares a certain "strength of will" quality with
> > > > Dean Karnazes
> > > > that I don't think too many others can match.  I
> > > > thought the piece on
> > > > 60 Minutes was very well done.
> > > >
> > > > Andy Charles
> > > >
> > > > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson"
> > > > <csilrun@h...> wrote:
> > > > > In preparation for Badwater, numerous LRRC members
> > > > journeyed to
> > > > Lititz for
> > > > > the Sauder's Easter Egg 5 Miler. Many, excluding
> > > > this writer, ran
> > > > well.
> > > > > Faces spotted included Bill Doherty, who blistered
> > > > 32:07, and
> > > > probably
> > > > > should have been under 32 because the course was a
> > > > little long. Also
> > > > there
> > > > > were Donovan, Doris, the Buckwalters, Dave
> > > > Greiner, and many more
> > > > whom I
> > > > > forget.
> > > > >
> > > > > I saw the 60 Minutes on Badwater. Has Pam Reed
> > > > surpassed Ann Trason
> > > > as the
> > > > > best woman ultra runner, or is Reed merely a
> > > > Badwater specialist?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
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The first step is to search carefully your partner's trunks.

Most foreign objects are not explosive. Be on the lookout for tongue
depressors wrapped with adhesive tape. They're a favorite foreign object.
And, expect your soup to be mighty salty. I understand there's a new line of
sobi/tofu soup called Fuji's Finest, but it's about 88% salt by volume.
>
>Sil,
>
>As a gift, we received some soup type mix.  The instructions say open
>bag & check for foreign objects.  Is there a straight set of
>procedures to check for these foreign objects?  I really don't want to
>slurp down a hidden pair of brass knuckles when I'm having my soup.
>
>
>

Way to go, Ed!  Sounds like you've got the trail running bug.  In my
opinion, there is no equal to trail running for sheer physical
enjoyment and challenge, and the camaraderie with other trail runners
is wonderful.  Of course, I'm too chicken to do serious mountain
biking.  As much as I love to bike the roads, and enjoy doing some
road running, trail running is my favorite workout.

Andy Charles

--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "forloveofrunning" <edsplace@p...>
wrote:
>
>
> Who knew trail races could be this much fun!As a rookie trail
runner,I
> never expected to have this blasted of a good time.The
> creeks,mud,rocks,hills and challenges abounded ;causing one to have
> good strategies to do well.Went out easy,picked it up along the way,
> and after the beer stop brought it home fairly well,passing a couple
> dozen folks on the way.Met and made some new frinds during and after
> the run.Really nice,friendly people these trail runners,except the
one
> lady whose back I ran over.O-WELL!Will definetly be back for more.
> ED Stauffer

A dead giveaway as to whether they are referring to wrestling foreign
objects...check the ingredients in the soup mix.  If the package
says, "flavored with Fuji salt", you'd better be on the lookout for
those brass knuckles.

Andy Charles

--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "lrrclub" <lrrclub@y...> wrote:
>
> Sil,
>
> As a gift, we received some soup type mix.  The instructions say
open
> bag & check for foreign objects.  Is there a straight set of
> procedures to check for these foreign objects?  I really don't want
to
> slurp down a hidden pair of brass knuckles when I'm having my soup.

Sil,

As a gift, we received some soup type mix.  The instructions say open
bag & check for foreign objects.  Is there a straight set of
procedures to check for these foreign objects?  I really don't want to
slurp down a hidden pair of brass knuckles when I'm having my soup.

hi guys, is this mtn or road biking? kathi

Larry Peters <larry.peters@...> wrote:

> All,
>
> We are forwarding a message from Kathy Watts concerning Stony Creek. See
> below:
>
>
>
>
> I am leading a "Save Stony Creek" Bike Ride on Sunday April 17th, a gate
to
> gate Stony Creek Ride (36 miles)start time 8:00AM at the Stony Parking
> Lot/gate. There is also a hike (same time) for the non riders in the
family.
> It's an awareness and petition signing campaign to protect and save our
> valuable and beautiful Stony Creek Valley (State Game Lands 211-appr. 2100
> acres) from being swapped out to Fort Indiantown Gap. The Gap has already
> said they would fence off the "buffer zone" and patrol it during firing
> times. The land is being swapped without any vote from the public, so
> writing our elected officials is important (McNaughton, Piccola, Rendell
and
> more). This land is St. Anthony's Wilderness Area and was protected 30
years
> ago when PPL wanted to steal it away. A wilderness area should not have
> fences and "Do not enter" signs. We need more protected wilderness areas
in
> Pennsylvania not less. There is a website, www.savestonycreek.com if you
> need more information.
>
> Thanks
> Kathy Watts
> 717-921-2173
> kwatts@...
>
>
>
>








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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

This is Evan-the human replying (with not an ounce of canine blood
flowing about him)

Start time for all Thursday runs is 6:30 PM.  This will be the time
to meet until time gets short in the fall.  Those familiar with the
Thursday action need to only know that it is what it is - way
Informal.  Courses are not marked - groups do form but any and all
are encouraged to get to know the trails over time or know the ABC's
of out-and-back running.

The trails we get to run are some of the nicest in the region and
living here allows us to hit 'em after work.  If we lived in metro
central, we'd only dream about such fun on some random weekend.  So
come one, come all, opportunity's blinding us in the face.



--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, Kathi Franco <kmfishere@y...> wrote:
> what time, doggg?
>
> lrrclub <lrrclub@y...> wrote:
>
> Thursday April 5, 2005 will be the first Thursday night trail run,
> which will be held at Money Rocks Park. See:
>
> http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/lib/parks/moneyrxL.jpg
>
> for the map as well as
> http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/cwp/view.asp?
> a=676&q=518297&parksNav=%7C7871%7C
>
> for add'l info on the park. The easiest way to get to Money Rocks
> (from Lancaster) is head all the way up 222, get off at Rt 322 and
> go east, proceed to the Rt 23/322 intersection, proceed east on
322
> for approx 4 miles (after the interesection/not from 222....!)
turn
> right on Narvon Rd. head up the hill (you'll see the Narvon Post
> office on the left), somewhere near the top of the hill on the
right
> is the parking area for the park. Run for 1-1.5 hrs & we'll figure
> outta part 2 for the after. It's far yeah, but the left wingers
love
> it cuz they can complain about the ozone depletion as well as the
> cost of gas and the right wingers love it cuz they can argue with
> the left wingers. I love it cuz money rocks is a nice place to
spend
> a thurz evening outside.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Messenger
>  Show us what our next emoticon should look like. Join the fun.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> All,
>
> We are forwarding a message from Kathy Watts concerning Stony Creek. See
> below:
>
>
>
>
> I am leading a "Save Stony Creek" Bike Ride on Sunday April 17th, a gate
to
> gate Stony Creek Ride (36 miles)start time 8:00AM at the Stony Parking
> Lot/gate. There is also a hike (same time) for the non riders in the
family.
> It's an awareness and petition signing campaign to protect and save our
> valuable and beautiful Stony Creek Valley (State Game Lands 211-appr. 2100
> acres) from being swapped out to Fort Indiantown Gap. The Gap has already
> said they would fence off the "buffer zone" and patrol it during firing
> times. The land is being swapped without any vote from the public, so
> writing our elected officials is important (McNaughton, Piccola, Rendell
and
> more). This land is St. Anthony's Wilderness Area and was protected 30
years
> ago when PPL wanted to steal it away. A wilderness area should not have
> fences and "Do not enter" signs.  We need more protected wilderness areas
in
> Pennsylvania not less. There is a website, www.savestonycreek.com if you
> need more information.
>
> Thanks
> Kathy Watts
> 717-921-2173
> kwatts@...
>
>
>
>

This weekend, 3 LRRCers, and 2 LRRC inlaws traveled north to where
there is still snow falling in spring and ran the Ithaca "Skunk
Cabbage Classic" 10K or 1/2 Marathon.

In her first race of this distance - LRRCer Kathy Friedburg ran the
10K in a great time of about 53 minutes.  Gina Shiley also completed
the 10K with a smile in the "wintry mix".  Keith Shiley and Evan &
Karen Sandt ran the 1/2 Marathon together in celebration of Keith's
27th birthday.

This was a real nice course, nicely organized starting at Cornell
University in amongst the ivy.  Evan and I had spent several days in
Ithaca in July and on this trip returned to see some of the waterfalls
we had hiked in the summer to find them overflowing onto the
surrounding trails and walkways.  Water was definitely the theme for
the weekend as it rained/wet snowed from sun-up to sun-down both days,
but we still managed to drink some great coffee, beer, and have a real
nice run with family and friends.

I'll never understand why the "ultra community" doesn't embrace
these athletes with open arms rather than with the disdain that
seems evident from some folks both here, on the VHTRC site and
various ultra publications.  Do Dean and Pam have sizeable egos?
Sure they do!  So what exactly is wrong with that?  Wouldn't you say
that having an ego would be a REQUIREMENT for being able to convince
yourself that you have the physical ability to just be able to
attempt such a feat, much less complete it?  I'm simply in awe of
these accomplishments, and have tons of respect for each of them.
I'm sure Pam's completion of the 300 will motivate Dean further.
Nothing wrong with that.  I suspect that members of the ultra
community that "pooh-pooh" these athletes might be engaging in just
a smidgeon of sour grapes.

Andy Charles

--- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Cramer" <ratbuzzard@p...> wrote:
> What will be the next distance challenge ultra runners will
attempt ?
> 400.....500 miles ?
> Being motivated by Dean's failure at the distance makes it appear
like a
> massive 300 mile ego trip on her part.
> Just my opinion on the article, news coverage can give the wrong
impression
> occasionally (note sarcasm)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Hunt Bartine" <hbartine@y...>
> To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>; "Trail Dawgs"
<traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 8:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report
>
>
> >
> > Pam Reed did finish her epic 300 mile yesterday in
> > under 80 hours:
> > http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/breaking/032805reed.php
> >
> > --- ultrabuzzardlrrc <ultrabuzzard@h...> wrote:
> > >
> > > RE: your question, has Pam Reed replaced Ann Trason
> > > as the best woman
> > > ultra runner.  That's a very difficult question to
> > > answer.  Lumping
> > > all ultrarunners together in one category would be
> > > like asking "who is
> > > the best distance runner"?  The difference between a
> > > garden variety
> > > 50K and the Badwater 135 mile race are obviously
> > > huge.  Pam Reed is
> > > quite a versatile runner, not just a Badwater
> > > specialist.  I am sure
> > > that Badwater is the central focus of her running
> > > life these days, but
> > > she also has some pretty awesome non-Badwater
> > > credentials.  For
> > > example, she was the top American woman in 2003 at
> > > the World 24-hour
> > > championships in the Netherlands, covering 134.86
> > > miles.  She was
> > > sixth overall.  My guess (and it's only a guess) is
> > > that Ann Trason
> > > was a better pure 100 mile trail racer than Pam,
> > > evidenced by her
> > > multiple year mastery at Western States.  However,
> > > the things that Pam
> > > Reed has accomplished on the track and road through
> > > a hellish training
> > > schedule combined with sheer guts and determination
> > > are remarkable.
> > > She shares a certain "strength of will" quality with
> > > Dean Karnazes
> > > that I don't think too many others can match.  I
> > > thought the piece on
> > > 60 Minutes was very well done.
> > >
> > > Andy Charles
> > >
> > > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson"
> > > <csilrun@h...> wrote:
> > > > In preparation for Badwater, numerous LRRC members
> > > journeyed to
> > > Lititz for
> > > > the Sauder's Easter Egg 5 Miler. Many, excluding
> > > this writer, ran
> > > well.
> > > > Faces spotted included Bill Doherty, who blistered
> > > 32:07, and
> > > probably
> > > > should have been under 32 because the course was a
> > > little long. Also
> > > there
> > > > were Donovan, Doris, the Buckwalters, Dave
> > > Greiner, and many more
> > > whom I
> > > > forget.
> > > >
> > > > I saw the 60 Minutes on Badwater. Has Pam Reed
> > > surpassed Ann Trason
> > > as the
> > > > best woman ultra runner, or is Reed merely a
> > > Badwater specialist?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
> > http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

What will be the next distance challenge ultra runners will attempt ?
400.....500 miles ?
Being motivated by Dean's failure at the distance makes it appear like a
massive 300 mile ego trip on her part.
Just my opinion on the article, news coverage can give the wrong impression
occasionally (note sarcasm)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hunt Bartine" <hbartine@...>
To: <LRRClub@yahoogroups.com>; "Trail Dawgs" <traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: [LRRClub] Re: Weekend Race Report


>
> Pam Reed did finish her epic 300 mile yesterday in
> under 80 hours:
> http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/breaking/032805reed.php
>
> --- ultrabuzzardlrrc <ultrabuzzard@...> wrote:
> >
> > RE: your question, has Pam Reed replaced Ann Trason
> > as the best woman
> > ultra runner.  That's a very difficult question to
> > answer.  Lumping
> > all ultrarunners together in one category would be
> > like asking "who is
> > the best distance runner"?  The difference between a
> > garden variety
> > 50K and the Badwater 135 mile race are obviously
> > huge.  Pam Reed is
> > quite a versatile runner, not just a Badwater
> > specialist.  I am sure
> > that Badwater is the central focus of her running
> > life these days, but
> > she also has some pretty awesome non-Badwater
> > credentials.  For
> > example, she was the top American woman in 2003 at
> > the World 24-hour
> > championships in the Netherlands, covering 134.86
> > miles.  She was
> > sixth overall.  My guess (and it's only a guess) is
> > that Ann Trason
> > was a better pure 100 mile trail racer than Pam,
> > evidenced by her
> > multiple year mastery at Western States.  However,
> > the things that Pam
> > Reed has accomplished on the track and road through
> > a hellish training
> > schedule combined with sheer guts and determination
> > are remarkable.
> > She shares a certain "strength of will" quality with
> > Dean Karnazes
> > that I don't think too many others can match.  I
> > thought the piece on
> > 60 Minutes was very well done.
> >
> > Andy Charles
> >
> > --- In LRRClub@yahoogroups.com, "sil simpson"
> > <csilrun@h...> wrote:
> > > In preparation for Badwater, numerous LRRC members
> > journeyed to
> > Lititz for
> > > the Sauder's Easter Egg 5 Miler. Many, excluding
> > this writer, ran
> > well.
> > > Faces spotted included Bill Doherty, who blistered
> > 32:07, and
> > probably
> > > should have been under 32 because the course was a
> > little long. Also
> > there
> > > were Donovan, Doris, the Buckwalters, Dave
> > Greiner, and many more
> > whom I
> > > forget.
> > >
> > > I saw the 60 Minutes on Badwater. Has Pam Reed
> > surpassed Ann Trason
> > as the
> > > best woman ultra runner, or is Reed merely a
> > Badwater specialist?
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
> http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

the terrain is more runable than conestoga or north of
lock 12.
stew, meet at boomers at 11:15 and car pool, or find
your own way; its not overly confusing to get to coal
beach as i roughly explained.
raining hard now-- out to run on roads this am ......
ugggh
by 1:00 tommorow it should be a bit better; forecast
is for partial clearing, chance of showers, about 50
degrees

-h
--- "Stewart P. Dotts" <57599@...> wrote:
> Sounds nice.  I'm going to try for this run, too.  I
> don't know if I'm
> ready for 11 miles of that terrain, but I can always
> just run my own
> pace and turn around when I meet the others
> returning.
>
> Hunt, is this the same place we ran from Lock 12 (?)
> or another
> location?  Can you send directions?  Or just tell me
> where it is & I'll
> find my own way.  Oh, wait, I just re-read the
> message below:  End of
> Coal Cabin Road, etc.  D'oh!
>
> Dave?  John?  Gail?  Greg?  Tom?  Rick(s)?  Dawgs?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hunt Bartine [mailto:hbartine@...]
> Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 8:42 AM
> To: lrrclub@yahoogroups.com; Trail Dawgs
> Subject: Bull Run Training 1:00 pm sun.
>
>
> People who are doing the Bull Run 50 & others may be
> interested in a last training run a couple of us are
> planning for this Sunday, apr 3  on a great section
> of
> Mason Dixon trail near Muddy Creek above Peach
> Bottom
> that has similarity to BRR terrain, although i think
> even prettier. The plan is to meet at 12:45 at the
> boat launch/ small county park at Coal Cabin beach
> at
> the end of Coal Cabin Road, on the Mason Dixon
> trail.
> The run will be an out and back 10.8 mi. on mostly
> single track heavily forested trail following Muddy
> Creek, which at this time of year is typically wild.
> An option to do a loop instead of out and back by
> returning on road also can be done.
>
> Run start: 1:00 PM
> Approx Finish: 3:00 PM
>
> Coal Cabin Beach is about 5 miles east of   PA rt 74
> and a few miles north of the Peach Bottom power
> plant(
> on west side of susquahanna, approx 10 miles north
> of
> maryland border)
> Please respond if you will make it.
>
> Hunt Bartine
> 302 528 1480 - cell
> 215 204 3315 - work
>
> alt work email: hunt.bartine@...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
> http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>
>



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what time, doggg?

lrrclub <lrrclub@...> wrote:

Thursday April 5, 2005 will be the first Thursday night trail run,
which will be held at Money Rocks Park. See:

http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/lib/parks/moneyrxL.jpg

for the map as well as
http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/cwp/view.asp?
a=676&q=518297&parksNav=%7C7871%7C

for add'l info on the park. The easiest way to get to Money Rocks
(from Lancaster) is head all the way up 222, get off at Rt 322 and
go east, proceed to the Rt 23/322 intersection, proceed east on 322
for approx 4 miles (after the interesection/not from 222....!) turn
right on Narvon Rd. head up the hill (you'll see the Narvon Post
office on the left), somewhere near the top of the hill on the right
is the parking area for the park. Run for 1-1.5 hrs & we'll figure
outta part 2 for the after. It's far yeah, but the left wingers love
it cuz they can complain about the ozone depletion as well as the
cost of gas and the right wingers love it cuz they can argue with
the left wingers. I love it cuz money rocks is a nice place to spend
a thurz evening outside.







Yahoo! Groups Links










---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger
  Show us what our next emoticon should look like. Join the fun.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thursday April 5, 2005 will be the first Thursday night trail run,
which will be held at Money Rocks Park.  See:

http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/lib/parks/moneyrxL.jpg

for the map as well as
http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/parks/cwp/view.asp?
a=676&q=518297&parksNav=%7C7871%7C

for add'l info on the park.  The easiest way to get to Money Rocks
(from Lancaster) is head all the way up 222, get off at Rt 322 and
go east, proceed to the Rt 23/322 intersection, proceed east on 322
for approx 4 miles (after the interesection/not from 222....!) turn
right on Narvon Rd. head up the hill (you'll see the Narvon Post
office on the left), somewhere near the top of the hill on the right
is the parking area for the park.  Run for 1-1.5 hrs & we'll figure
outta part 2 for the after. It's far yeah, but the left wingers love
it cuz they can complain about the ozone depletion as well as the
cost of gas and the right wingers love it cuz they can argue with
the left wingers. I love it cuz money rocks is a nice place to spend
a thurz evening outside.

Yes, Let's carpool to Coal Cabin Beach...catchy name.

    The rain should stop by then and dry up a bit for a nice run.

Great..all household chores should be done.   Nice afternoon run.

                  Margie

-----Original Message-----
From: Hunt Bartine <hbartine@...>
To: lrrclub@yahoogroups.com; Trail Dawgs <traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Fri, 1 Apr 2005 05:42:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Bull Run Training 1:00 pm sun.



People who are doing the Bull Run 50 & others may be
interested in a last training run a couple of us are
planning for this Sunday, apr 3  on a great section of
Mason Dixon trail near Muddy Creek above Peach Bottom
that has similarity to BRR terrain, although i think
even prettier. The plan is to meet at 12:45 at the
boat launch/ small county park at Coal Cabin beach at
the end of Coal Cabin Road, on the Mason Dixon trail.
The run will be an out and back 10.8 mi. on mostly
single track heavily forested trail following Muddy
Creek, which at this time of year is typically wild.
An option to do a loop instead of out and back by
returning on road also can be done.

Run start: 1:00 PM
Approx Finish: 3:00 PM

Coal Cabin Beach is about 5 miles east of   PA rt 74
and a few miles north of the Peach Bottom power plant(
on west side of susquahanna, approx 10 miles north of
maryland border)
Please respond if you will make it.

Hunt Bartine
302 528 1480 - cell
215 204 3315 - work

alt work email: hunt.bartine@...









__________________________________
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Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Who knew trail races could be this much fun!As a rookie trail runner,I
never expected to have this blasted of a good time.The
creeks,mud,rocks,hills and challenges abounded ;causing one to have
good strategies to do well.Went out easy,picked it up along the way,
and after the beer stop brought it home fairly well,passing a couple
dozen folks on the way.Met and made some new frinds during and after
the run.Really nice,friendly people these trail runners,except the one
lady whose back I ran over.O-WELL!Will definetly be back for more.
ED Stauffer

Sounds good to me Hunt and thanks in advance for organizing what seems to me a
very pretty run.

Count me in,,but not quite sure on how to get there...yes, would you send me
directions.

              Margie "Happy Tails" Hughes



-----Original Message-----
From: Hunt Bartine <hbartine@...>
To: lrrclub@yahoogroups.com; Trail Dawgs <traildawgs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Fri, 1 Apr 2005 05:42:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Bull Run Training 1:00 pm sun.



People who are doing the Bull Run 50 & others may be
interested in a last training run a couple of us are
planning for this Sunday, apr 3  on a great section of
Mason Dixon trail near Muddy Creek above Peach Bottom
that has similarity to BRR terrain, although i think
even prettier. The plan is to meet at 12:45 at the
boat launch/ small county park at Coal Cabin beach at
the end of Coal Cabin Road, on the Mason Dixon trail.
The run will be an out and back 10.8 mi. on mostly
single track heavily forested trail following Muddy
Creek, which at this time of year is typically wild.
An option to do a loop instead of out and back by
returning on road also can be done.

Run start: 1:00 PM
Approx Finish: 3:00 PM

Coal Cabin Beach is about 5 miles east of   PA rt 74
and a few miles north of the Peach Bottom power plant(
on west side of susquahanna, approx 10 miles north of
maryland border)
Please respond if you will make it.

Hunt Bartine
302 528 1480 - cell
215 204 3315 - work

alt work email: hunt.bartine@...









__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/




Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]