Group, does anyone know of a source for knock-down plates that may be reset from
the firing line.  I looking for a set that would have five or six steel plates
that we would not have to call for a cease-fire to reset.  It should be able to
transported fairly easily.  Thanks for any information.

Llama45ACP,
AKA Norm,
NRA Basic Pistol, Shotgun,
and Personal Protection
in the Home Instructor

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Top Ten reasons why Men prefer guns over Women

#10. You can trade an old 44 for a new 22.

#9.  You can keep one gun at home and have another for when you're
on the road.

#8.  If you admire a friend's gun and tell him so, he will probably
let you try it out a few times.

#7.  Your primary gun doesn't mind if you keep another gun for a
backup.

#6.  Your gun will stay with you even if you run out of ammo.

#5.  A gun doesn't take up a lot of closet space.

#4.  Guns function normally every day of the month.

#3.  A gun doesn't ask, "Do these new grips make me look fat?

#2.  A gun doesn't mind if you go to sleep after you use it.

And the number one reason a gun is favored over a woman....

#1.  YOU CAN BUY A SILENCER FOR A GUN

**(I have a personal slot in each class that I
will sell for a discount. Contact me directly at
texastactical@...)**


Tactical Response is coming to the Texas Tactical
Range between Austin and San Antonio.

The dates are
February 3-4 for Fighting Pistol
http://www.tacticalresponse.com/cour...tingpistol.php

February 5-6 for Fighting Rifle
http://www.tacticalresponse.com/cour...htingrifle.php

The location for all classes is the Texas
Tactical Range in between
San Antonio and Austin. WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

Each Class is $400 + a $15 Range fee
per student per class.

Please sign up ASAP Classes are filling up fast!

www.tacticalresponse.com/training/schedule.php


P.S. I have a personal slot in each class that I
will sell for a discount. Contact me directly at
texastactical@...


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Texas Tactical will be putting on a
3 GUN "COMBAT" MATCH on Saturday January 21st
at the Texas Tactical Range between Austin and
San
Antonio.

Any and All Safe Shooters are welcome to attend!
If you would like to attend but do not have all 3
guns, there are usually plenty of people willing
to share a rifle or shotgun. If you bring Ammo
for the gun you are short ie: 12 guage or .223
someone will be glad to let you shoot their gun.

Sign up: 0830 - 0915hrs


From our website:

"Texas Tactical holds 3 Gun combat matches at
various times throughout the year. The objective
of these matches is to allow people to become
more familiar with and to improve and test their
skills in a simulated CQC (close quarters combat)
environment with their 3 main defensive tools:
Rifle, Pistol and Shotgun. It also provides a
venue where shooters can show how well rounded
their "combat" skills are in one match.


Our 3 Gun Matches generally consist of 2 Handgun
stages, 2 Rifle stages and 2 Shotgun stages. We
will be using IDPA targets for the Handgun and
Rifle stages and steel, balloons and other
reactive targets for the Shotgun stages. IDPA
rules and scoring will be utilized! Use of
available cover will be required. No "competition
only" equipment may be used. All equipment must
be of a practical nature. If you have any
questions please Email us at:

texastactical@....

Map and directions to the Range can be
found on our website: WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET


MATCH FEE: $20




DIVISIONS OF COMPETITION:


Handgun:


Custom Defensive Pistol


Stock Service Pistol


Enhanced Service Pistol


Stock Service Revolver.


Rifle:


Iron Sights


Optical Sights


Limited Division
Limited Division is for those wishing to compete
with CCUs, Camp Carbines, Lever Actions or
anything else that has a limited ammo capacity.
(This Division will be limited to 10 rounds
maximum in your rifle.)


Battle Rifle
(Battle Rifle Division is for large caliber
service rifles, such as Fals, Galils, M1s etc.)


Class III




Shotgun: To keep a level playing field shotguns
competeing in the Manual and Autoloader Divisions
will be loaded with 6 rounds maximum to start a
COF. Open Division may start fully loaded.
Speedloaders are not permitted for any division.
(birdshot only unless otherwise stated by the
COF)


Auto Loaders


Manual


(Manual Division will include any Manually
operated shotgun, ie: Pumps, Bolt Action, Lever
Actions)


Open
(Open division is for shotguns with optics or
compensators. Shotguns used in this division may
be loaded to full capacity.)"


If You have any questions feel free to Email or
call. Hope to see y'all there!


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET



Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Here ya go!

http://proofhouse.com/colt/

scroll down the menu on the left until you get to Python

good luck

Jack

Jack McLain
Maricopa, AZ

K-9 Search and Rescue
"That Others May Live"

   -----Original Message-----
   From: Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of tim galish
   Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2006 1:30 PM
   To: Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com
   Subject: [Combat-Handgun] colt serial nos.


   I recently purchased a colt python w/ ser # Vxxxxx. does anyone know
   how to find the time frame of when this gun was manufactured?








   "...there is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb, and that can
best be made by the Winchester rifle." - Teddy Roosevelt, 1887



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

     a..  Visit your group "Combat-Handgun" on the web.

     b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      Combat-Handgun-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

     c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I recently purchased a colt python w/ ser # Vxxxxx. does anyone know
how to find the time frame of when this gun was manufactured?

Texas Tactical will be putting on an IDPA Match
this *Sunday* January 15th at the Texas
Tactical Range (Formerly Hays County
range)between Austin and San Antonio. Bring a
friend or two or 3 and introduce them to all the
fun! Everyone is welcome!

Date: *SUNDAY* January 15th, 2006
Sign up: 0830 - 0915 hrs

For more info and directions check out:

WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

********************************************
Please arrive on time for sign up and promptly
sign up. This helps us bring you a more efficient
and enjoyable match.
*********************************************

Depending on interest and help there will
be a Shotgun Sidestage after the match. (Birdshot
only)

Hope to see y'all there.


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

AuctionArms.com is always a good place to start.
Check out the following .44 spcl.:
http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=7170043<http://www.auc\
tionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=7170043>

Also, for S&W and Charter Arms, check out:
http://www.katsko.net<http://www.katsko.net/>

Kent

   ----- Original Message -----
   From: tim galish<mailto:tcgalish@...>
   To: Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com>
   Sent: Saturday, January 07, 2006 3:48 PM
   Subject: [Combat-Handgun] 44 spec


   I'm looking for a 44 spl  in a rossi or s&w. does anyone know where I can find
one at a reasonible price ?


   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





   "...there is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb, and that can best
be made by the Winchester rifle." - Teddy Roosevelt, 1887



   SPONSORED LINKS Shooting
accessory<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting+accessory&w1=Shooting+acc\
essory&w2=Shooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue&w5=Shooti\
ng+sportsman+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=ia7uanSPyj6eNm5Z7URZzw> 
Shooting hearing
protection<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting+hearing+protection&w1=Sh\
ooting+accessory&w2=Shooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue\
&w5=Shooting+sportsman+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=pV36j6h8lb6HWyDmO\
qN2DQ> 
Shooting<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting&w1=Shooting+accessory&w2=S\
hooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue&w5=Shooting+sportsma\
n+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=bS_wnf5F9drt5lN81298NQ>
         Backyard
barbecue<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Backyard+barbecue&w1=Shooting+acces\
sory&w2=Shooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue&w5=Shooting\
+sportsman+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=lIOKbgS42EiJUfrG8ogQnw> 
Shooting sportsman
magazine<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Shooting+sportsman+magazine&w1=Shoo\
ting+accessory&w2=Shooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue&w\
5=Shooting+sportsman+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=lZ961hi_AyV8NJe35Ni\
zvg>  Hall
monitor<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Hall+monitor&w1=Shooting+accessory&w\
2=Shooting+hearing+protection&w3=Shooting&w4=Backyard+barbecue&w5=Shooting+sport\
sman+magazine&w6=Hall+monitor&c=6&s=145&.sig=OlRWSZwXLNWA2EgIGu3ZHQ>


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

     a..  Visit your group
"Combat-Handgun<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Combat-Handgun>" on the web.

     b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
     
Combat-Handgun-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Combat-Handgun-unsubscribe@yah\
oogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

     c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

There was a very nice M24-3 4" and a M624 4" at the Dallas Market Hall
gun show today.

FWIW

Chuck.


tim galish wrote:

> I'm looking for a 44 spl  in a rossi or s&w. does anyone know where I can find
one at a reasonible price ?
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>"...there is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb, and that can best
be made by the Winchester rifle." - Teddy Roosevelt, 1887
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

At 04:48 PM 1/7/2006, you wrote:

>  I'm looking for a 44 spl  in a rossi or s&w. does anyone know
> where I can find one at a reasonible price ?

I only see the Model 21 on the S&W site. Taurus has a much wider line
of .44 spl revolvers which are better quality than the Rossi guns.
Gun shows are always a good place to look. Some of the online sites
like auctionarms or gunsamerica may have good deals but you'll need
to go through a local FFL to make a purchase.

Karl

I'm looking for a 44 spl  in a rossi or s&w. does anyone know where I can find
one at a reasonible price ?


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Texas Tactical will be putting on an IDPA Match
this ***SATURDAY*** January 7th at the Texas
Tactical Range (Formerly Hays County
range)between Austin and San Antonio. Bring a
friend or two or 3 and introduce them to all the
fun!


Date: ***SATURDAY*** January 7th, 2006
Sign up: 0830 - 0915 hrs


********************************************
Please arrive on time for sign up and promptly
sign up. This helps us bring you a more efficient
and enjoyable match.
*********************************************

VOLUNTEERS NEEDED FOR SHOTGUN SIDESTAGE:
Due to my increased responsibilities associated
with the range, I will not be able to quickly and
efficiently set up a shotgun sidestage.

I would however like to continue to have the
shotgun side stage. If someone would like to
volunteer to organize a crew to set it up and get
it underway that would be greatly appreciated by
me and all the other scattergunners. :)

So.....depending on interest and help there will
be a Shotgun Sidestage after the match. (Birdshot
only)

Hope to see y'all there.


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET


Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET



__________________________________________
Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about.
Just $16.99/mo. or less.
dsl.yahoo.com

As I already said, the difference is that it has a heavier slide and a
dovetailed front sight.  The advantage of a front sight that can be replaced
without a milling machine should be obvious.  The heavier and slightly
larger slide is a heavier and slightly larger slide with all the advantages
and disadvantages.  Softer recoil, slower cycling time and some holsters
won't fit.

I personally don't consider the heavier slide worth it by itself, but the
Brig slide is used on several models of pistol that are worthwhile upgrades
over the regular FS.

> Well, I guess that makes three of us who haven't really answered his
> question.  Are there any real benefits of purchasing the Bridadier
> Upgrade?
>
>
>
> I'd say, practically, NO.  It was a solution to a problem that didn't
> really exist, and dramatically limits your choice of holsters.

Well, I guess that makes three of us who haven't really answered his
question.  Are there any real benefits of purchasing the Bridadier
Upgrade?



I'd say, practically, NO.  It was a solution to a problem that didn't
really exist, and dramatically limits your choice of holsters.



Mike



-----Original Message-----
From: Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Berry
Sent: Monday, December 26, 2005 9:35 PM
To: Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Combat-Handgun] Re: Beretta 92FS - Brigadier vs regular



> Has anyone had any experience with the Brigadier model vs the resular
> one. I've shot the regular 92fs and am curious if there are any real
> benefits of purchasing the Brigadier upgrade.
>
> Any thoughts?

Wow, two responses and neither one got it right.

A 'Brigadier' model Beretta refers to a slide that is heavier than the
standard slide.  The easiest way to ID it is the 'humps' in the slide in
the
same area as the slots for the locking block.  It is also slightly wider
than a standard slide, just enough that the slide stop on some pistols
rubs
the finish off the slide.  It also has a heavier ring at the front so
that
the front sight is in a dovetail and can be replaced with an aftermarket
sight if you want.

The slide was requested by the Border Marshalls, who also requested a
barrel
that was flush with the front of the slide instead of sticking out just
a
little bit and the 'Border Marshall' series of Berettas have a 4.7"
barrel
instead of a 4.9" barrel.  This is the barrel that Simon referred to,
but it
is specific to the BM Berettas and has nothing to do with the Brigadier
designation.

Rezmedic54 referred to different grips and I'm not sure what he meant.
Most
of the 'normal' Brigadier models I've seen came from the factory with
Hogue
grips instead of hard plastic so maybe that's what he meant.  He also
may
have been thinking of the Beretta Vertec pistols which are the same as a
92
except that they have a smaller grip with a straight backstrap, have a
light
rail on the front and have a dovetailed front sight even on the normal
slides.  The "Elite 1A" uses a Vertec frame with a heavier Brigadier
slide
and is meant to be a competition pistol.



"...there is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb, and that
can best be made by the Winchester rifle." - Teddy Roosevelt, 1887




   _____

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS



*          Visit your group "Combat-Handgun
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Combat-Handgun> " on the web.


*          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  Combat-Handgun-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:Combat-Handgun-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>


*          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .



   _____



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Texas Tactical will be holding the 90 round IDPA
classifier on Saturday December 31st 2005 at the
Texas Tactical Range between Austin and San
Antonio, Texas. Everyone is welcome to attend!!

Sign up: 0830-0915

We highly recommend that you come out and get
classified. There are many benefits to being
classified. It allows you to compete with people
of your own skill level and classification. It
also allows you to track your progress and
improvement over time. So if you want to get
classified, or maybe you think your skill level
has improved enough to move up to the next
classification level, or you just want some good
trigger time. Come out and shoot with us!!

IDPA requires all shooters to shoot the
Classifier at least once a year. You are also
required to be classified in each division that
you plan on competing in at the Regional, State
and  National level.


Hope to see Y'all there!!




Michael "Iron Mike" Webb
Texas Tactical
WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET




__________________________________
Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year.
http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

> Has anyone had any experience with the Brigadier model vs the resular
> one. I've shot the regular 92fs and am curious if there are any real
> benefits of purchasing the Brigadier upgrade.
>
> Any thoughts?

Wow, two responses and neither one got it right.

A 'Brigadier' model Beretta refers to a slide that is heavier than the
standard slide.  The easiest way to ID it is the 'humps' in the slide in the
same area as the slots for the locking block.  It is also slightly wider
than a standard slide, just enough that the slide stop on some pistols rubs
the finish off the slide.  It also has a heavier ring at the front so that
the front sight is in a dovetail and can be replaced with an aftermarket
sight if you want.

The slide was requested by the Border Marshalls, who also requested a barrel
that was flush with the front of the slide instead of sticking out just a
little bit and the 'Border Marshall' series of Berettas have a 4.7" barrel
instead of a 4.9" barrel.  This is the barrel that Simon referred to, but it
is specific to the BM Berettas and has nothing to do with the Brigadier
designation.

Rezmedic54 referred to different grips and I'm not sure what he meant.  Most
of the 'normal' Brigadier models I've seen came from the factory with Hogue
grips instead of hard plastic so maybe that's what he meant.  He also may
have been thinking of the Beretta Vertec pistols which are the same as a 92
except that they have a smaller grip with a straight backstrap, have a light
rail on the front and have a dovetailed front sight even on the normal
slides.  The "Elite 1A" uses a Vertec frame with a heavier Brigadier slide
and is meant to be a competition pistol.

The tanfoglio is a cz clone isn't it?  THe frame is
nothing similar to a 1911 or glock, which I believe
are the only 2 frames that will fit those carbine
kits.  Find out if someone makes one for a cz.  Good
luck





__________________________________
Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year.
http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

i have a few tanfoglios and want a mech tech carbine kit for the 10 mm
i know they make them for 10mm 1911 colts will that unit fit on my
tanfoglio?

Hi to everyone on this list just want to wish everyone here a very Happy and
Merry Christmas! Too our Jewish friends a very Happy Hanukkah. To all I hope
you have an excellent Christmas/holiday season

Steve in Colorado


--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.7/214 - Release Date: 12/23/2005

The brigadier barrel is  slightly shorter, flush with
the front of the slide instead of slightly protruding.
  The 92 family, with the exception of the m type that
uses a single stack mag all use the same frame.  You
would be well served with either model, I love my 96.





__________________________________
Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year.
http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

I believe the only diff. is the grips.





--- In Combat-Handgun@yahoogroups.com, "Jerrod" <comdygas@y...> wrote:
>
> Has anyone had any experience with the Brigadier model vs the resular
> one. I've shot the regular 92fs and am curious if there are any real
> benefits of purchasing the Brigadier upgrade.
>
> Any thoughts?
>

Has anyone had any experience with the Brigadier model vs the resular
one. I've shot the regular 92fs and am curious if there are any real
benefits of purchasing the Brigadier upgrade.

Any thoughts?

On Dec 16, 2005, at 2:28 PM, Karl Rehn wrote:

> The comments in On Combat on the subject of what makes kids violent
> are much more accurate, in my opinion,

I'll order this one when we get back. Sounds like he's more into real
evaluation in this one than the bad science he was playing in On
Killing.

--
Geoff Beneze
Tempe, AZ
Target Stands
beast-enterprises.com
-----
Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist
the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
--H.L. Mencken
-----
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we KNOW that ain't so.
--Will Rogers

>I don't doubt it. There is much in "On Killing" to agree WITH (and I
>do in large part). Maybe it was just the book presentation that left
>(several years now) a really bad taste in my mind.

His audio tapes "The Bullet Proof Mind" have a lot of good stuff in them.
The example he uses about the school shooter making a bunch of head
shots "for real" despite having never fired a real gun before in his
life, when compared to gunfight hit ratios of trained personnel, is
interesting.
But the school shooter was not in a gunfight. He was executing
unarmed kids which isn't really "fighting". And as the aggressor he
really didn't have any shoot/no-shoot decisions to make since he'd
already decided to shoot anyone and everyone.

>What interests me is how he could do good research, and turn up some
>really valuable information, then get off into the Agenda Drum side
>of it as well. That's where his stock took a dump for me.

The comments in On Combat on the subject of what makes kids violent
are much more accurate, in my opinion, than what he wrote in On
Killing or the (dreadful propaganda book) "Stop Teaching Our Kids To Kill".
In On Combat he says what I and others have been saying for quite
some time (and what follows logically from his own work):  kids that
participate in aggressive activities (sports, martial arts, shooting,
paintball, etc.) that have adult supervision, discipline and rules
learn discipline, empathy and maturity. They learn how to control
their aggression - which is the thing he claims separates 'warriors'
from bad guys.  They revisit the profiles of the school shooter kids
and discover that most of those kids had little adult supervision,
were not involved in group activities where they could learn
"disciplined aggression" - basically they never learned how to play
nice, respect their training partners, shake hands after the game and
all that stuff most kids learn.

Basically that huge difference in development has a lot to do with
how kids react to violent video games and what kind of influence they
have on behavior.  If a kid is missing all the important positive
things, removing the negative input (violent video games) isn't going
to help them down the right path.

InSights Training occasionally runs a seminar course analyzing an Al
Qaeda training video that was discovered/recovered in Afghanistan
awhile back.  CNN showed parts of it but the whole tape shows what
students at the AQ training camp were learning to do. At the end of
the tape there is a snippet of "home movie" footage shot by one of
the AQ instructors, who was recording the footage of their training,
probably for editing and distribution to others.  That part of the
tape shows the AQ instructor's children handling daddy's guns.  In
one part he tells his young son (translated) "that is the gun you
will use to kill the infidel".  We tell our kids "guns are bad" and
suspend them for drawing pictures of army men even if their parents
are in the military in a combat zone.  Which culture is growing a new
generation of warriors ready to defend us?  The InSights instructor's
comment was that all the military themed games - particularly those
that have a lot of attention to detail and tactics - are where our
new warriors are coming from.  Some of those "kids learning to kill"
that Grossman's worried about might very well be overseas in a combat
zone now and video games probably played as a big a role in their
decision to enlist as the games played in motivating bad kids to
shoot up a school.

Karl

On Dec 16, 2005, at 12:02 PM, Stephen Grasso wrote:

> maybe so... I have seen him speak on a couple of occasions and I found
> myself agreeing with him.
>
> Steve

I don't doubt it. There is much in "On Killing" to agree WITH (and I
do in large part). Maybe it was just the book presentation that left
(several years now) a really bad taste in my mind.

What interests me is how he could do good research, and turn up some
really valuable information, then get off into the Agenda Drum side
of it as well. That's where his stock took a dump for me.

I haven't ready any of his others.


--
Geoff Beneze
Tempe, AZ
Target Stands
beast-enterprises.com
-----
Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist
the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
--H.L. Mencken
-----
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we KNOW that ain't so.
--Will Rogers

maybe so... I have seen him speak on a couple of occasions and I found
myself agreeing with him.

Steve

On Dec 16, 2005, at 12:00 PM, geoff beneze wrote:

>
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 7:02 AM, Stephen Grasso wrote:
>
>> On Killing & On Combat from Dave Grossman... every cop and warrior
>> should read these.
>>
>> http://killology.com/
>
> Stephen,
> This is interesting. I found Grossman to be a bleater of the Chicken
> Little variety. A bit of solid research and good fact, then the
> voyage off into personal evangelism and theory thumping.
>
> I suspect we could have a solid thread on this book alone.
>
>
>
> --
> Geoff Beneze
> Tempe, AZ
> Target Stands
> beast-enterprises.com
> -----
> Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist
> the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
> --H.L. Mencken
> -----
> It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we KNOW that ain't
> so.
> --Will Rogers
>
>
>
>
> "...there is but one answer to be made to the dynamite bomb, and that
> can best be made by the Winchester rifle." - Teddy Roosevelt, 1887
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

>I've been meaning to assemble a list for a while.  ISBN's, and in some
>cases authors are missing where the books are either loaned out or in
>the reloading room where I was too lazy to retreive them from.

That list jogged my memory for a few other shooting related books
well worth reading:

Practical Shooting - Brian Enos
Perfect Practice - Saul Kirsch
Steve Anderson's dry firing book

all available from
www.brianenos.com

Guns Bullets and Gunfights - Jim Cirillo  (won 17 gunfights while on
NYPD, lots of interesting observations. Not sure if this is still in
print or not)

Training At the Speed of Life - Ken Murray - available from his
website.  Fantastic book about force on force training, Ken developed
a lot of the core concepts that everyone else is using now.


re: On Killing.
On Combat is a far better book because of his co-authors' input. Some
of the more extreme positions Grossman took in On Killing
(particularly about video games and other cultural factors) are toned
down and revised.

Karl

Rick Shay wrote:

>Well, it's time to ask the members of the group about what books they hold
>in personal high esteem - and be willing to recommend to members of the
>group.
>
>Your book recommendations can be on ANY subject, a new release,
>out-of-print, a classic standard, fiction, non-fiction, whatever...
>
>Please give title, author, publisher and ISBN number, if possible. It would
>be nice to have a short précis of the book, or the reason you think it is so
>good.
>
>I'll put my personal list together and post it to the group later today. I'm
>looking at books that enthralled me as a young man, books I've bought more
>recently, technical books, fiction, science fiction, gun books, etc.
>
>So, please take a look at that book shelf and share your treasures with the
>rest of us.
>
>Thanks, and Merry Christmas!
>
>Rick
>Colorado
>=========
>
>
>

I've been meaning to assemble a list for a while.  ISBN's, and in some
cases authors are missing where the books are either loaned out or in
the reloading room where I was too lazy to retreive them from.

"A Rifleman Went to War", Herbert W. McBride
"Unintended Consequences", John Ross
"Alas, Babylon"
"The Devil's Advocate", Taylor Caldwell
"Shots Fired in Anger", John George
"Sixguns", Elmer Keith, 55-11694
"The Influence of Sea Power upon History", A.T. Mahan, 0-935998-42-X
"Boyd, the Fighter Pilot who Changed the Art of War", Robert Coram,
0-316-88146-5
"Hatcher's Notebook", Julian S. Hatcher, 0-8117-0795-4
"No Second Place Winner", Bill Jordan, 0-936279-09-5
"Competitive Shooting", A.A Yur' Yev, 0-935998-53-5
"Meditations on Hunting", Jose Ortegy Y Gasset, (tape) 0-7366-0305-0
"The Moon is a Harsh Mistress", Robert A. Heinlein
"Flight of the Intruder", Stephen Coonts, 0-87021-200-1
"The Long Walk", Slavomir Rawicz, 1-55821-634-0
"To Ride, Shoot Straight, and Speak The Truth", Jeff Cooper, 0-87364-973-7
"The Dogs of War", Frederick Forsyth
"The Day of the Jackal", Frederick Forsyth
"Marine Sniper", Charles Henderson, 0-425-10355-2
"Marine"
"Gates of Fire, the battle at Thermaplae"
"Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting", Ed McGivern, 0-695-80557-6
"The Rescue of BAT 21", Darrel D. Whitcomb, 1-55750-946-8
"Sniping in France", Major H. Hesketh-Prichard, 0-85052-426-1
"Unrepentant Sinner", Charles Askins
"Modern African Adventures", Ed Matunas,
"Death in the Long Grass", Peter Hathaway Capstick
"Use Enough Gun", Robert Ruark
"African Rifles and Cartridges", John Taylor,
"The Complete Guide to Handloading", Phil Sharpe
"A Fine and Pleasant Misery", Patrick F. McManus, 0-8050-0032-1
"90 Minutes at Entebbe", William Stevenson, 0-553-10482-9
"The German Sniper 1914-1945", Peter R. Senich, 0-87364-223-6
"The Long-Range War, Sniping in Vietnam", Peter R. Senich, 0-87364-789-0
"To Hell and Back"
"The Hobbit", J.R.R. Tolkein,
"The Lord of the Rings", J.R.R. Tolkein,
"The Ilaid" and "The Oddessy", Homer,
"In the Gravest Extreme", Massad Ayoob,

For younger readers:
Citzen of the Galaxy, RAH
Have Spacesuit, Will Travel, RAH
Willard Price "... Adventure" series
"The Heroes of Asgard", A.&E. Keary, 0-8317-4475-8

--Mark

On Dec 16, 2005, at 7:02 AM, Stephen Grasso wrote:

> On Killing & On Combat from Dave Grossman... every cop and warrior
> should read these.
>
> http://killology.com/

Stephen,
This is interesting. I found Grossman to be a bleater of the Chicken
Little variety. A bit of solid research and good fact, then the
voyage off into personal evangelism and theory thumping.

I suspect we could have a solid thread on this book alone.



--
Geoff Beneze
Tempe, AZ
Target Stands
beast-enterprises.com
-----
Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist
the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
--H.L. Mencken
-----
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we KNOW that ain't so.
--Will Rogers

At 08:02 AM 12/16/2005, you wrote:

>On Killing & On Combat from Dave Grossman... every cop and warrior
>should read these.
>
>http://killology.com/


I think "On Combat" is the better of the two because it combines
Grossman's material with Loren Christensen's and Alexis Artwhol's
material.  C&A have another good book called "Deadly Force
Encounters" which also covers similar material.

I also recommend "The World Is Flat" by Thomas Friedman. Actually all
of his books are worth reading. Friedman writes about world politics
but it's not partisan sniping. He's one of the few people making any
attempt to step above the politics (for the most part) and look at
the big picture.  The World is Flat is mostly about how the US fits
in with the global economy and his predictions for where we are
headed and what we need to do to avoid some major problems.

Karl