big city paranoid people? I grew up in a small town and also lived in very
isolated areas for more than a few of my 55 years, and had more stuff ripped
off there out in the middle of nowhere, than I ever have in my "big city"
(of 50,000 population). Sounds like a pretty ignorant remark to me. know
what they say about making ASSumptions. And why would I worry about my bike,
when its going to be with me the whole time? Engage brain before opening
mouth. LOL


>From: "mtbdirt1" <mtbdirt1@...>
>Reply-To: Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com
>To: Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Bikerpelli] Re: How do we get back to colorado?
>Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2007 02:25:14 -0000
>
>-to many big city paronoid people left our grand cherokee for the may
>trip and no problem hell your bike is the # 1 thing to worry about--
>In Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com, "Barb Martin" <barbixy@...> wrote:
> >
> > so is there a locked gate or not? I'm confused now. I've got two people
> > answering emails sent to the same address.
> >
> >
> > >From: "Stan Hill" <StanBike@...>
> > >Reply-To: Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: <Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com>
> > >Subject: Re: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > >Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 03:07:02 -0600
> > >
> > >Okay, I was wrong 'bout the locked gate--maybe it just seemed like
>it 'cuz
> > >it seemed safe enough. Pay attention to Alex--He's Da Man!
> > >
> > >('Cept 'bout those fire ants ... ?)
> > >
> > >Stan
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Barb Martin<mailto:barbixy@...>
> > > To: Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 1:08 AM
> > > Subject: RE: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > >
> > >
> > > here is the message earlier from Stan, it indicates a locked
>gate...???
> > >
> > > Bikerpelli has arranged for parking on private land that is away
>from
> > >the
> > > public trailhead and is out of the public eye through a locked
>gate that
> > >is
> > > posted no trespassing. Nothing is assured, but I felt a lot
>better there
> > > than a public area.
> > >
> > > >From: "Alex Hearn" <alex@...<mailto:alex%40bikerpelli.com>>
> > > >Reply-To:
> > >Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > >To:
><Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > > >Subject: RE: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2007 13:14:49 -0600
> > > >
> > > >Hi Barb -
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Statistically your car is much more likely to be stolen from an
>airport
> > > >garage than a farm field. Still, I understand your concerns &
>respect
> > >if
> > > >you'd like to park elsewhere.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I can say that in 6 years the only incident we've ever had was
>a week
> > >ago,
> > > >in Salida (different trip), someone had a bike rack stolen off
>the back
> > >of
> > > >their car. I do not know if the rack was locked. Never had any
>vehicle
> > > >broken into. Never any incidents on the Kokopelli trip.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >We do alert the CSP & Sheriff that we'll be out there & request
>that
> > >they
> > > >do
> > > >drive-bys. There's also a residence about 200 meters away.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Just a note for accuracy - the field we park in is fenced &
>posted, but
> > >not
> > > >gated. It is, however, patrolled by a few goats. And the fire
>ants can
> > >be
> > > >vicious.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Alex Hearn
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >----------------------------------------------------------
> > > >------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >-----Original Message-----
> > > >From:
>Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>
> >
> >[mailto:Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>]
>On
> > > >Behalf Of Barb Martin
> > > >Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 11:28 AM
> > > >To: Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > >Subject: Re: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Hi Stan:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Your original reply did not state people would be leaving their
>cars
> > >behind
> > > >
> > > >a locked gate with a no trespassing sign, you just wrote they
>would be
> > >left
> > > >
> > > >near the trailhead. Knowing they'll be locked behind a gate is
> > >reassuring
> > > >
> > > >because I'm not so concerned with anyone breaking in, as just
>stealing
> > >my
> > > >
> > > >car outright. As well, having spent almost my entire life
>outdoors,
> > >I've
> > > >
> > > >seen some of the worst things happen at trailheads when no one is
> > >around
> > > >
> > > >because of the very fact that they are isolated and no one is
>around.
> > >Its
> > > >
> > > >not the norm, but it does happen. There are weird people
>everywhere.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Aside from that, what kind of town is grand junction? What is the
> > > >population
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >and composition? Does grand junction have an airport? How far
>exactly
> > >from
> > > >
> > > >the city/airport itself, is the trailhead? If the cars weren't
>locked
> > > >behind
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >a gate, I would be more inclined to leave my car in long term
>airport
> > > >
> > > >parking, which is usually gated and monitored 24/7 and is
>usually less
> > >than
> > > >
> > > >ten bucks a day, or make my own arrangements with someone in
>town to
> > >leave
> > > >
> > > >my vehicle on their premesis and then catch a bus or cab or
>something
> > >to
> > > >the
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >trailhead.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >The reason I'm concerned is, my car isn't a gas guzzling ford
>explorer,
> > > >
> > > >which no one really wants to steal. Its a Honda civic
>hatchback, which
> > >is a
> > > >
> > > >very popular car with a high performance motor that gets
>40+mpg. The
> > > >
> > > >bluebook value isn't high on my car, but the replacement value is
> > >because
> > > >
> > > >this make and model isn't common, esp in the condition mine is
>in, I
> > >know I
> > > >
> > > >couldn't find another one, and insurance would only give me
>blue book
> > >which
> > > >
> > > >wouldn't even come close to buying another car like it.
>Unfortunately,
> > > >
> > > >according to my insurance company, it is one of the most commonly
> > >stolen
> > > >
> > > >vehicles. I'm not sure if this is because I live close to a
>large urban
> > > >area
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >or what. This statistic might be different in Colorado than it
>is where
> > >I
> > > >
> > > >live.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >By the way, the Club can be removed in 20 seconds by spraying
>it with
> > > >canned
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >air, which freezes the metal which can then be hit with a
>hammer and it
> > > >
> > > >breaks like a candy cane. I've personally seen this done. I've also
> > > >
> > > >personally seen my car opened in less than 20 seconds by the
>Auto Club
> > >guy.
> > > >
> > > >Common sense of course dictates don't leave things in the car (who
> > >didn't
> > > >
> > > >know that), but that has little to do with anything if someone
>wants to
> > > >
> > > >steal the car itself.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >And I don't think local business with "minimum wage employees"
>at a
> > >place
> > > >
> > > >like a bike store are exactly gang members who steal cars. They're
> > >usually
> > > >
> > > >kids who love riding bikes and don't mind working for a lower
>wage just
> > >to
> > > >
> > > >do what they love. Just because someone is minimum wage,
>doesn't mean
> > > >
> > > >they're a thief.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I really want to do this ride, if the cars are on private
>property,
> > >behind
> > > >a
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >locked gate that says no trespassing, that is different than
>leaving
> > >them
> > > >in
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >a public area near a deserted trailhead for days.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >thanks for the tip about the gear, I usually travel pretty
>light in any
> > > >
> > > >case, because I know there is always a certain amount of
>carrying of
> > >gear
> > > >
> > > >involved.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I had a bad wipeout on the trail over a week ago, and injured
>my knee
> > >and
> > > >
> > > >hip, and am hoping both are in good enough condition to do the
>ride in
> > > >
> > > >September. As of today, they are still in pretty bad shape. The
>problem
> > > >
> > > >isn't so much the impact when you fall, and I don't know about
>other
> > > >people,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >but when I fall, on the side I fall on, seems the cleat never
>releases,
> > >and
> > > >
> > > >it usually twists my knee. I don't fall often, my skills are
>pretty
> > >good
> > > >but
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >when I do, its not the best situation.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I will be in touch, how many do you take on this ride? And how
>many
> > >have
> > > >
> > > >signed up so far?
> > > >
> > > >I would think doing this ride in Sep, the weather would be
>perfect...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >thanks for the additional information. I've wanted to do this ride
> > >forever.
> > > >
> > > >Am acquaintance of mine has done it, and said hands down, it
>beats any
> > >ride
> > > >
> > > >out there for scenery and experience.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I've done century rides before on my road bike, and mtb rides
>of 50+
> > >miles
> > > >
> > > >before, did the whitney trail hike in one day last Oct, the
>distance
> > >for
> > > >the
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >kokopelli ride will be more than doable.
> > > >
> > > >Barb
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >From: "Stan Hill" <StanBike@...<mailto:StanBike%40msn.com>>
> > > >
> > > > >Reply-To:
> > >Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > >
> > > > >To:
><Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > > >
> > > > >Subject: Re: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >
> > > > >Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2007 10:42:15 -0600
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >I 'spose everyone has their own sense of safety and security.
> > > >Concentrated
> > > >
> > > > >public parking areas
> > > >
> > > >tend to attract more vandals and thieves 'cuz they're easy, known,
> > >easily
> > > >
> > > >cased and have a reliable supply of targets. Arrangements with
>a local
> > > >
> > > >business simply provides notice to their minimum wage employees
>that
> > >they
> > > >
> > > >can let their friends know there will be free access to certain
>cars
> > >for
> > > >
> > > >several days. Even private security employees play that game.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >Bikerpelli has arranged for parking on private land that is
>away from
> > >the
> > > >
> > > > >public trailhead and is out of the public eye through a
>locked gate
> > >that
> > > >is
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >posted no trespassing. Nothing is assured, but I felt a lot
>better
> > >there
> > > >
> > > > >than a public area.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >Of course some common sense measures help as well: don't leave
> > >anything
> > > >of
> > > >
> > > > >obvious value in plain sight and perhaps put a Club lock on the
> > >steering
> > > >
> > > > >wheel--risk is a consideration for thieves as well, so why
>expend the
> > > >
> > > > >energy where there is little return or too much effort required?
> > >'Bout
> > > >the
> > > >
> > > > >only way I can think of that might be safer would be private
>enclosed
> > > >
> > > > >storage. Of course that would easily double or triple the
>cost of the
> > > >trip
> > > >
> > > > >as well as greatly complicate the getting to-and-from, but it's
> > >possible
> > > >
> > > > >that you could arrange it for yourself in Grand Junction.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >Stan Hill
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > >
> > > > > From: Barb
> > >Martin<mailto:barbixy@...<mailto:barbixy%40hotmail.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > To:
> >
>
>Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bikerpel\
li@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 11:16 PM
> > > >
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > to be honest, I'm not all that thrilled with leaving my car
> > >unattended
> > > >
> > > > > overnight for several days in an isolated area, whether
>there are
> > > >other
> > > >
> > > > >cars
> > > >
> > > > > there or not doesn't change the risk. If it were me
>organizing this
> > > >
> > > > >trip,
> > > >
> > > > > I'd make some arrangements for people to leave their cars in
>a safe
> > > >
> > > > >place in
> > > >
> > > > > Grand Junction itself, and them pick them up in town, and
>shuttle
> > >them
> > > >
> > > > >out
> > > >
> > > > > to the trail head. I'd arrange with a local business, 24 hour
> > > >
> > > > >restaurant,
> > > >
> > > > > some place where people would be around to notice if there
>were any
> > > >
> > > > > vandalism or break in attempts. Public parking lot, garage
>parking,
> > > >bike
> > > >
> > > > > shop parking lot, something.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >From: "Stan Hill"
> > ><StanBike@...<mailto:StanBike%40msn.com><mailto:StanBike%40msn.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > >Reply-To:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
>
>Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bikerpel\
li%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > >
> > > > > >To:
> >
>
><Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bikerpe\
lli%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > >Subject: Re: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >
> > > > > >Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 07:49:21 -0600
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >Barb,
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >You've probably already received a dozen replies, but I
>answer. The
> > > >
> > > > >trip is
> > > >
> > > > > >set up to leave your car near the trailhead near Loma (west of
> > >Grand
> > > >
> > > > > >Junction). While there are no guarantees, it's well removed
>from
> > > >
> > > > >populated
> > > >
> > > > > >areas and public parking areas so is probably safer than
>anywhere
> > > >else
> > > >
> > > > >you
> > > >
> > > > > >might leave it, plus it will be parked with others doing the
> > > >Bikerpelli
> > > >
> > > > > >trip. At the end of the trip in Moab, a shuttle (school
>bus) brings
> > > >you
> > > >
> > > > > >back to the start point where your car is located. Pretty
>easy! The
> > > >
> > > > >hardest
> > > >
> > > > > >part of this arrangement is: no one is going to load your
>stuff for
> > > >
> > > > > >you--you are responsible for moving your own stuff between
>your car
> > > >and
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >the
> > > >
> > > > > >transportation trucks (and of course camping)--so pack wisely.
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >Stan Hill
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > >
> > > > > > From:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
>
>barbixy<mailto:barbixy@...<mailto:barbixy%40hotmail.com><mailto:barbixy%40hotma\
il.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > > To:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
>
>Bikerpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bikerpel\
li%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bike
> > >
> > >
>
>rpelli@yahoogroups.com<mailto:rpelli%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:Bikerpelli%40yah\
oogroups.com>>
> > > >
> > > > > > Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 10:24 PM
> > > >
> > > > > > Subject: [Bikerpelli] How do we get back to colorado?
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > > If I do the september trip, I would drive to Grand
>Junction and
> > > >leave
> > > >
> > > > > > my vehicle there. Is there a safe place to leave my
>vehicle in CO,
> > > >and
> > > >
> > > > > > how would I get back from Moab, to GJ after the ride?
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > > thank you,
> > > >
> > > > > > Barb
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > > __________________________________________________________
> > > >
> > > > > Learn.Laugh.Share. Reallivemoms is right place!
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
>
>http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us<http://www.reallivemoms.com/?\
ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us><http://www.reallivemoms.c<http://www.reallivemoms.c/>
> > > >om/?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us>
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >__________________________________________________________
> > > >
> > > >More photos, more messages, more storage-get 2GB with Windows Live
> > >Hotmail.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
>
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> > > >n_HM_mini_2G_0507
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bikerpelli/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bikerpe\
lli/>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Individual Email | Traditional
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bikerpelli/join<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bik\
erpelli/join>
> > > >
> > > > (Yahoo! ID required)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
>
>mailto:Bikerpelli-digest@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli-digest%40yahoogroups\
.com>
> > > >
> > > >
> >
>
>mailto:Bikerpelli-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli-fullfeatured%4\
0yahoogroups.com>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
>
>Bikerpelli-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Bikerpelli-unsubscribe%40yahoogro\
ups.com>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
>http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________________
> > > Booking a flight? Know when to buy with airfare predictions on MSN
> > >Travel.
> > >
> >
>
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
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