Yeah take someone like David Eckstein who gets every mile out of his
ability or this Langoria kid who looked like hes been in the majors
all along on his first day. Nick blended in quite well from day 1
also.On the other hand you have someone like Daniel Cabrera with one
of the best arms ever,never getting the art of pitching.
--- In BaltimOrioles@yahoogroups.com, Scott Rendler <itzscott1@...>
wrote:
>
> I truly believe that the shortcoming in successful scouting lies in
the fact that there are a couple of things that should be measured,
but aren't measured because there are no tests for them. The first is
what I refer to as "Baseball IQ" and the second one is mental
toughness.
>
> Some players just innately see a game or play unfolding before them
and know how to anticipate and react accordingly and correctly. Some
players actually study the count and know the opposing pitcher's
repetoire to correctly anticipate what the next pitch will be and be
ready for it. Some players can recognize a defensive alignment and
know where a pitcher will try to throw a pitch.... and so on. This is
Baseball IQ and none of it is taken into consideration when
evaluating prospects.
>
> Surely speed, power and glovework are crucial.... but only part of
what makes a solid major leaguer. Most players are pretty much even
on specific physical abilities. Some are slightly better than others
and some are slightly worse. The difference is the intelligence to
know what to do with those talents in specific situations.
>
> And there's no measurement for it or even any attempt to include it
in the grading process of prospects.
>
> The other thing is mental toughness. Case in point is Rich Hill.
The guy has a curveball equal to Barry Zito in his prime. Yet if he
can't spot it absolutely perfectly the guy unravels and gives up
rather than fighting through it.... like a Ted Lilly does.
Consequently he's "soft" and not a player that has the heart of a
champion. Players like that are a cancer on their teams.
>
> And there's no measurement for it or even any attempt to include it
in the grading process of prospects.
>
> And that's why baseball drafts are the biggest crap shoots of all
pro sports.
>
> At least football requires all potential draftees to take a
Wonderlich Test. I'm not sure if basketball does or not. Baseball
doesn't even require their potential draftees to know how to read. 
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Tom Stewart III <tstewartiii@...>
> To: baltimorioles@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 10:35:23 PM
> Subject: RE: BaltimOrioles Re: Interesting....
>
>
>
> Now that's something worth discussing.. .This isn't something that
is specific to Cubs and O's, but lots of teams. What causes the draft
failures? Baseball drafts seem to be the biggest crap shoot of all
the pro sports, but some teams are consistently bad and some are
consistently good. I wish it was as easy as having the Ravens folks
go across the parking lot and give them some pointers.
>
> To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
> From: itzscott1@yahoo. com
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 09:04:49 -0800
> Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Re: Interesting. ...
>
> >> You can't blame MacPhail for the failure of position prospects,
but then give the current Cub GM the credit for the"successful" ones.
<<
>
> I wouldn't term either one of them succesful. The thing is that
over the years the Cubs, as well as the O's, have been in draft
positions to select prospects that could be considered the cream of
the crop, yet nothing remotely resembling solid major league position
players have come of it (at least from the Cubs).
>
> Where's the problem??
>
> Is it the scouting?... . the coaching in the minors??.... the level
of instruction? ?.... the commitment on behalf of the organization to
fund and staff their minor league affiliates properly??
>
> Something has been wrong within BOTH organizations to
have "achieved" the level of failure in regards to player development
over the course of YEARS. Every team eventually has a bad draft, but
to consistently have bad drafts year after year and not take the
actions to fix the problem only costs a team more in the long run by
requiring them to sign expensive free-agents to long term contracts
(and hope for the best) in order to field a contender.
>
> How is it that Tampa Bay, and other teams (Anaheim, etc) have been
able to figure it out but both the O's and Cubs have not??
>
> ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> From: Tom Stewart <hatepaste@gmail. com>
>
> To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 10:54:05 AM
>
> Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Re: Interesting. ...
>
> Ok. Well the blind squirrels running the O's organization hasn't
had much
>
> the past 10 years.
>
> But you can't have it both ways. You can't blame MacPhail for the
failure
>
> of position prospects, but then give the current Cub GM the credit
for the
>
> "successful" ones.
>
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 10:23 AM, Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo.
com> wrote:
>
> > Tom,
>
> >
>
> > That's 6 position players in how many years from within their
ENTIRE minor
>
> > league system. It could be argued that even a blind squirrel
finds a nut
>
> > every so often. It could also be argued that the current Cub GM
was Director
>
> > of Scouting at the time and selected these 6 players.
>
> >
>
> > To drill down further....
>
> >
>
> > Soto's had one year under his belt. Who knows if he can sustain
his
>
> > offensive output going forward? His minor league stats (except
for his final
>
> > year) say "no".
>
> >
>
> > Theriot has no range at ss and no arm. Spunky player, but average
>
> > offensively. Speculation is that he's not the longer term answer
and is on
>
> > the trading block.
>
> >
>
> > Pie.... Great minor league player, but has shown nothing at the
plate at
>
> > the major league level. The jury is still out on this guy but
he's run out
>
> > of options with the Cubs and he'll be traded or will have to
occupy a roster
>
> > spot on the team for the entire year, ready or not.
>
> >
>
> > Hoffpauir... . Great offense, slow afoot and sub-par defense at
1st. A great
>
> > DH candidate.
>
> >
>
> > Cedeno.... The guy's got it all except his baseball IQ would
suggest
>
> > retardation. Bonehead play after bonehead play either fielding or
running
>
> > the bases. The Cubs would love for this guy to learn from his
mistakes and
>
> > take over ss, but he keeps making the same gaffes.
>
> >
>
> > Eric Patterson ..... sorry, but he'll never make an impact and
he's more
>
> > like a Jerry Hairston Jr type. He'll drift around the majors as a
bench
>
> > player.
>
> >
>
> > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > From: Tom Stewart <hatepaste@gmail. com <hatepaste%40gmail. com>>
>
> > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com <BaltimOrioles%
40yahoogroups. com>
>
> > Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 8:48:18 AM
>
> > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Re: Interesting. ...
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > Now, I don't know the ins and outs of the Cubs minor league
system. And
>
> > since you completely dismissed my last fact filled e-mail, I'll
go over
>
> > this
>
> > real quickly. So he is Cubs president from 1994-2006. And looking
at
>
> > players that seemed to get drafted during that time:
>
> >
>
> > Geovany Soto - 2001 11th
>
> > Ryan THeriot - 2001 3rd
>
> > Felix Pie - 2001 amateur free agent
>
> > Michael Hoffpauier - 2002 13th
>
> > Ronny Cedeno - 1999 amateur free agent
>
> > Eric Patterson - 2004 8th round
>
> >
>
> > So all guys you've touted as top prospects, and so on. Plus Soto
played a
>
> > vital role on the Cubs this year. Theriot, Soto, Cedeno and
Patterson are
>
> > all in the majors. Pie is right there bouncing between AAA and
MLB and then
>
> > Hoffpauier is supposed to be a top prospect.
>
> >
>
> > And then of course there is always:
>
> > Corey Patterson - 1998 1st round
>
> >
>
> > I think the love for pitchers is pretty straight forward. It's
hard to
>
> > block pitchers, need 5 starters at every level, plus 5-6 bullpen
guys. If
>
> > you draft a top position prospect in the first round every year,
you gotta
>
> > start juggling people. For instance, wouldn't it look silly for
them to
>
> > draft a catcher int he first round next year?
>
> >
>
> > On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 7:40 AM, Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo.
com>
>
> > wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > I know that you're trying to get me going to unload on the O's
GM. In
>
> > > fairness to this group and not wanting to throw cold water on
anyone's
>
> > hopes
>
> > > beyond what I've posted in the past, I won't get sucked in. One
never
>
> > knows
>
> > > for sure and there's always the chance that the O's GM will
pull off
>
> > > something brilliant that'll render your credibility and mine to
be
>
> > > worthless.
>
> > >
>
> > > The only comment I have regarding your post is that it's deja
vu. The
>
> > > parallels are apparent. When the O's GM was the Cubs' GM he was
myopic
>
> > > towards pitching throughout the organization to the detriment
of position
>
> > > players. He always drafted pitchers (who somehow always
developed arm
>
> > > problems before making it to the bigs), traded for pitchers and
scoured
>
> > > other team's dumpsters hoping to find that diamond in the rough
pitcher.
>
> > >
>
> > > He did draft Kerry Wood & Mark Prior. Unfortunately their arms
fell off
>
> > due
>
> > > to bad mechanics and over-use and their careers were
meteoric.... they
>
> > were
>
> > > spectacular briefly and then burned out just as quickly. But
there was
>
> > > always the next "Messiah" that would be ready "next year".
Angel Guzman
>
> > was
>
> > > one until he needed Tommy John surgery before he threw a pitch
at
>
> > Wrigley.
>
> > > There were others.
>
> > >
>
> > > It was because the O's GM didn't draft or develop position
players
>
> > > throughout the organization when he was the Cub GM, that the
Cubs were
>
> > > forced to sign all of the free-agent position players they did
when he
>
> > was
>
> > > gone.... the cupboard was bare of anyone who swung a bat that
had any
>
> > > potential to see the majors at some point. The word on the Cubs
was that
>
> > > they were good at developing pitchers, but they sucked at
developing
>
> > > anything else. The Cub minor league system became a gulag for
any kid
>
> > they
>
> > > drafted who wasn't a pitcher. His non-pitcher draftees always
had some
>
> > sort
>
> > > of flaw in their game and fundamentals were never taught.
>
> > >
>
> > > He loved guys that could hit the ball a mile... but were slow
afoot,
>
> > lacked
>
> > > any defensive skills, were never taught the strike zone and had
low
>
> > baseball
>
> > > IQ's. Jason Dubois immediately comes to mind.
>
> > >
>
> > > His philosophy was that every team always needs pitching, thus
they were
>
> > > the most valuable commodity and that if he could develop
pitchers, he'd
>
> > > eventually be able to use them to trade for great position
players along
>
> > the
>
> > > way and avoid the expense of having to dip into the free-agent
market.
>
> > > Sounded like a solid plan at the time. Unfortunately two
factors played
>
> > into
>
> > > the failure of that plan....
>
> > >
>
> > > 1) His pitching prospects always seemed to develop arm problems
in the
>
> > > minors.
>
> > > 2) He had a hard time pulling the trigger on trades unless they
were
>
> > > no-brainers and fell into his lap (D.Lee and A. Ramirez).
>
> > >
>
> > > Hoping that he's learned from his previous debacle. Again....
you never
>
> > > know what's to be and he's only been at it for a bit over a
year.
>
> > >
>
> > > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > >
>
> > > From: joes06 <kingjoey@comcast. net <kingjoey%40comcast .net>>
>
> > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com <BaltimOrioles%
40yahoogroups. com>
>
> >
>
> > > Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 6:35:25 AM
>
> > > Subject: BaltimOrioles Re: Interesting. ...
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > > The O's have 28 pitchers on their 40 man roster which obviously
>
> > > exposes their lack of positional depth. So what does McPhail
want to
>
> > > do? Go out and get another OF when we don't have a SS,1st
baseman
>
> > > with some pop and no one behind Guthrie in the rotation.One of
the
>
> > > most alarming thing for me about McPhail among many others is
his tin
>
> > > ear towards postion players and his obsession with pitchers.Then
>
> > > people act like if he trades 1 or 2 of the pitchers it's the
end of
>
> > > his so called rebuilding plan.In McPhails world quanity=
quality.
>
> > >
>
> > > If he really planned on rebuilding he might as well trade
>
> > > Roberts,Markakis and Guthrie and get quality prospects for them
>
> > > instead of scouring the waiver wire for career bums.What good
does it
>
> > > do to keep these guys if he's going to take a nickle and dime
>
> > > approach to the rest of the team?
>
> > >
>
> > > He'll probably wind up letting Roberts play out his contract
and even
>
> > > possibly trading him at the deadline. He'll give Markakis a
token
>
> > > raise on a 1 year deal.The Baltimore media won't critisize him
one
>
> > > bit. It's funny how Roch got fired from the Sun and they kept
all the
>
> > > other horrible bum writers.Schmuck has become an absolute joke
as a
>
> > > writer and a comlete lapdog for McPhail's musings.Then again
I've
>
> > > always had a strong dislike of waffling indecisive people and
that's
>
> > > McPhail's MO.Even with all the handwringing he still winds up
with
>
> > > players that have bad fundementals.
>
> > >
>
> > > Young players coming into camp hoping they can steal a roster
spot
>
> > > can forget about it.Liz,Olson and DCab will be in the rotation
along
>
> > > with some bottom shelf starter McPhail signs in the waning days
of
>
> > > the off season.
>
> > >
>
> > > --- In BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com, Scott Rendler
<itzscott1@ ..>
>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > >
>
> > > > I don't think that the Cubs would do a Roberts deal without
him
>
> > > signing an extension. The same goes with the O's in respect to
>
> > > Greene. Maybe that "someone else" I'm referring to would be Mike
>
> > > Fontenot (originally an O who was a throw-in in the Sosa trade,
but
>
> > > has blossomed into a real good player). Maybe someone like
Scott or
>
> > > Huff goes to the Cubs since they're looking for a lefty
outfielder.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Funny how it all comes back to Roberts again.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > As far as the O's getting Peavy.... he's better than any of
the
>
> > > other free-agents out there except C.C. and he's signed thru
2012
>
> > > along with having what would now be considered a reasonable
contract.
>
> > > The only hang-up with him is that he has a clause in his
contract
>
> > > that provides for a club option for the 2013 season that would
pay
>
> > > him $22 million..... and his agent is insisting that he'd
refuse a
>
> > > trade to any team that won't guarantee that last year.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > He's the ideal type of pitcher that the O's could build
around.
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > > > From: Steve James <deafhearingdudeinm d@...>
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 1:22:53 AM
>
> > > > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Interesting. ...
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Hmm, that would be an interesting trade but in the real world
I
>
> > > don't see the O's getting Peavy. Would make sense that the Cubs
get
>
> > > Roberts although that's a lot for them to give up for a one year
>
> > > rental. Also, I wonder if the O's could get a second baseman
out of
>
> > > the deal instead of Greene.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > --- On Sun, 11/30/08, Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo. com>
wrote:
>
> > > >
>
> > > > From: Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo. com>
>
> > > > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Interesting. ...
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Date: Sunday, November 30, 2008, 12:59 AM
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Maybe it's the tip of the iceberg....
>
> > > >
>
> > > > I can see a 3-way where the O's get Peavy & Greene....
>
> > > > The Cubs get Roberts finally....
>
> > > > and the Padres get Pie (via the O's), Marshall, Cedeno, Olson
and
>
> > > someone
>
> > > > else.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > > > From: Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo. com>
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 12:47:11 AM
>
> > > > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Interesting. ...
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Pie could turn out to be another Lou Brock....
>
> > > >
>
> > > > He just needs the right kind of coaching and NOT being put in
a
>
> > > pressure cooker
>
> > > > situation as he's been with the Cubs.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Expectations can be a brutal, no-win thing to have to live up
to
>
> > > when thrown
>
> > > > into the fire as Pie has been.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > He's an outstanding defender with a great arm and blazing
speed.
>
> > > He's
>
> > > > smoked the minors offensively.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Typically for the Cubs, when he came up the coaches wanted
him to
>
> > > change
>
> > > > everything about his offense. I'm sure the kid's head was
spinning.
>
> > > > Another case of the Cubs F-ing up a 5-tool prospect. Pretty
much
>
> > > what they did
>
> > > > to Corey Patterson.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > > > From: Steve James <deafhearingdudeinm d @yahoo.com>
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 12:34:39 AM
>
> > > > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles Interesting. ...
>
> > > >
>
> > > > I saw this at the Scout.com forum and I said "pass." As you
said we
>
> > > > are overcrowded with outfielders now and we are short on young
>
> > > pitching. Also as
>
> > > > crazy as this sounds, I see this being another possible Maine
>
> > > situation. Olsen
>
> > > > is only 25 and there have been times that he's pitched well
enough
>
> > > to make
>
> > > > me think that he could be a solid pitcher in the back of a
>
> > > rotation.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Also, if the Orioles are going to get involved in a high
impact
>
> > > trade involving
>
> > > > Peavy, I want to see more than Pie getting shipped to us.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > --- On Sat, 11/29/08, Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo. com>
wrote:
>
> > > >
>
> > > > From: Scott Rendler <itzscott1@yahoo. com>
>
> > > > Subject: BaltimOrioles Interesting. ...
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Date: Saturday, November 29, 2008, 11:24 PM
>
> > > >
>
> > > > From the O's website.... 1st of all, why would the O's
want/need
>
> > > Pie?
>
> > > > 2ndly, why would the Padres want Olson?....
>
> > > >
>
> > > > O's may fit as third team in Peavy deal
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Reportedly discussing Pie with Cubs, who would get Padres ace
>
> > > >
>
> > > > By Steve Gilbert / MLB. com
>
> > > >
>
> > > >
>
> > > > The Orioles may end up as a third team in a three-way deal
that
>
> > > would send
>
> > > > Padres right-hander Jake Peavy to the Cubs, according to a
report
>
> > > in the
>
> > > > Baltimore Sun.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > The paper reported that the Orioles have started up trade
talks
>
> > > again with the
>
> > > > Cubs about outfielder Felix Pie, who -- with Baltimore second
>
> > > baseman Brian
>
> > > > Roberts -- was part of a rumored deal discussed between the
two
>
> > > teams last
>
> > > > offseason.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Sources told the Sun that Chicago would like a young pitcher
in
>
> > > return for Pie,
>
> > > > which could lead to the Orioles sending starter Garrett Olson
to
>
> > > the Cubs, who
>
> > > > would then trade the lefty to the Padres as part of a deal to
land
>
> > > Peavy.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > "We have a lot of different irons in the fire," Orioles
president of
>
> > > > baseball operations Andy MacPhail told the paper. "We're in
the
>
> > > > process
>
> > > > of determining who our trading partners might be and which
free
>
> > > agents we might
>
> > > > have a chance to sign. We're basically in the same position as
>
> > > everybody
>
> > > > else, waiting for a couple of big dominoes to fall."
>
> > > >
>
> > > > The Padres have been shopping Peavy, who is due to make $11
million
>
> > > next year,
>
> > > > but the uncertainty of whether his club can or will move
Peavy has
>
> > > left San
>
> > > > Diego general manager Kevin Towers in standby mode. Peavy is
owed
>
> > > $63 million
>
> > > > through 2012, and the team holds an option for 2013.
>
> > > > The Cubs are one of five National League teams that Peavy,
who has
>
> > > a limited
>
> > > > no-trade clause, has said he would be amenable to joining.
>
> > > > The Cubs' level of interest, though, is an open question, as
Chicago
>
> > > > manager Lou Piniella told the Chicago Sun-Times last week that
>
> > > after his team
>
> > > > re-signed Ryan Dempster to a $52 million deal, it would not be
>
> > > pursuing Peavy.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > "No," Piniella told the paper. "Starting [pitching is
something]
>
> > > > we don't need. We're set. We've got six good starters
[including
>
> > > > Sean Marshall], and they're all experienced. Getting Dempster
back
>
> > > was the
>
> > > > key. We're in good shape with our starting pitching. Bullpen-
wise,
>
> > > > [we're looking for] possibly one more experienced pitcher.
We've
>
> > > got a
>
> > > > lot of young kids out there."
>
> > > >
>
> > > > The Cubs have not been able to complete a deal with the Padres
>
> > > reportedly
>
> > > > because they don't have the young, Major League-ready talent
the
>
> > > Padres are
>
> > > > seeking. But that could change if Chicago can acquire Olson.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Olson, 25, is 10-13 with a 6.87 ERA in 33 Major League
starts. A
>
> > > California
>
> > > > native, he was the 48th overall pick in the 2005 First-Year
Player
>
> > > Draft. The
>
> > > > Padres are said to have made overtures about Olson in the
past.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Though Peavy was 10-11 with a 2.85 ERA last season, he is 86-
62 in
>
> > > his career
>
> > > > and won the National League Cy Young Award in 2007.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
>
> > > > From: SCZEPP <sczepp@yahoo. com>
>
> > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com
>
> > > > Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 7:26:41 PM
>
> > > > Subject: BaltimOrioles Re: What's Flanny's status?
>
> > > >
>
> > > > My comment in that room is that this shows Macphail is in
charge
>
> > > and
>
> > > > not PA like some of us worry about behind the scenes. Flanny
is a
>
> > > > nice guy but at the wrong place at the wrong time......Its not
>
> > > AMACS
>
> > > > team to screw up or turn this thing around. From what I hear
over
>
> > > the
>
> > > > next few weeks the roster will have a makeover that will
leave us
>
> > > > knowing this is a rebuilding project.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > --- In BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com, "Tom Stewart"
<hatepaste@
>
> > > > ....>
>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > > Well our pitching is so horrendous we don't want to trade
any of
>
> > > it
>
> > > > away
>
> > > > > anyways.
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > > The entire orioles regime past ten years all shopwed a lack
of
>
> > > > patience and
>
> > > > > due dilligence. Not waiting for maine, not examining luis
reivera
>
> > > > and on and
>
> > > > > on. We basically got raped on any trade we did except for
mora
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > > On Nov 29, 2008 2:48 PM, "joes06" <kingjoey@ .> wrote:
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > > Looking at the Maine deal is strictly hindsight. He didn't
show
>
> > > > much
>
> > > > > in the O's system.King of like John Stephens. Might have
more to
>
> > > do
>
> > > > > with the Mets pitching coach whos one if the best in the
>
> > > > > business.Besides I think Duquette pushed this more so than
Flanny
>
> > > > and
>
> > > > > they desperatley wanted to dump Julio.Flanny started the
>
> > > rebuilding
>
> > > > > of thefarm system which was absolutely decimated under
>
> > > Thrift.Plus
>
> > > > > flanny didn't have the automony that Mcphail seems to have.
Of
>
> > > > course
>
> > > > > Gibby's deal was a gaffe as was Baez.The legacy of the
Maine deal
>
> > > > is
>
> > > > > now the O's are afraid to trade any young pitchers for fear
>
> > > > they'll
>
> > > > > turn out to be another Maine. This is bad.It's really all
we hae
>
> > > to
>
> > > > > trade from.
>
> > > > >
>
> > > > > --- In BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com <BaltimOrioles%
>
> > > > 40yahoogroups. com>, "Tom
>
> > > > > Stewart" <hatepaste@>
>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > I wasn't saying I exactly liked the trades but the
players ok.
>
> > > > > Wright here
>
> > > > > > in2007? So only a year removed.
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > The thing that ticks me off about maine was it was leaked
that
>
> > > > > benson for
>
> > > > > > julio was a deal. Then all of a sudden maine too.
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > So now that brings some sense to macphails love of young
>
> > > > pitching.
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > On Nov 29, 2008 10:13 AM, "Matt Jergensen" <mwjergs@>
>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > Jaret Wright?
>
> > > > > > You trade for a guy with a history of shoulder problems.
Now
>
> > > you
>
> > > > > trade Chris
>
> > > > > > Britton, no big deal there but the O's pick up almost
half his
>
> > > > > contract 3
>
> > > > > > million. Last time he had a decent year was 2005 with the
>
> > > Braves.
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > Benson. Guy never won more than 11 games in a season. Was
a
>
> > > > league
>
> > > > > leader in
>
> > > > > > home runs given up. Julio was done here anyway but go
ahead
>
> > > > Flanny
>
> > > > > we don't
>
> > > > > > need young pitching anyway send Maine packing.
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > Again people explain away the absolute awfulness that was
Mike
>
> > > > > Flanagan's
>
> > > > > > tenure.
>
> > > > > > Should we bring up the $50 mill. fiasco on bullpen
mediocrity?
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > --- On Sat, 11/29/08, Tom Stewart <hatepaste@< hatepaste%
>
> > > > > 40gmail.com> >
>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > From: Tom Stewart <hatepaste@ <hatepaste%40gmail. com>>
>
> > > > > > Subject: Re: BaltimOrioles What's Flanny's status?
>
> > > > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com <BaltimOrioles%
>
> > > > 40yahoogroups. com><BaltimOriol es%
>
> > > > > 40yahoogroups. com>
>
> > > > > > Date: Saturday, November 29, 2008, 9:56 AM
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > I was ok for trading for Jaret Right...Thought it had some
>
> > > > upside.
>
> > > > > Benson I
>
> > > > > > was ok with too, I ju...
>
> > > > > > > --- On Fri, 11/28/08, joes06 <kingjoey@comcast.
>
> > > > net<kingjoey%
>
> > > > > 40comcast
>
> > > > > > .net>>
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > From: joes06 <kingjoey@comcast. net <kingjoey%40comcast
>
> > > > ...net>>
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > Subject: BaltimOrioles What's Flanny's status?
>
> > > > > > > To: BaltimOrioles@ yahoogroups. com <BaltimOrioles%
>
> > > > > 40yahoogroups. com>
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > Date: Friday, November 28, 2008, 6:45 AM > > Didn't
>
> > > > his
>
> > > > contract
>
> > > > > expire
>
> > > > > > after this year? My gu...
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > >
>
> > > > > >
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> > > >
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> > > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
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> > > >
>
> > > > Fantasy League still open:
>
> > > > League ID# - 134385
>
> > > > Passw0rd - 1234
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Maryland Terps Group:
>
> > > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/Terrapin_ City
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Baltimore Ravens Group:
>
> > > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/BaltimoRav ensYahoo! Groups
Links
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> > > >
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> > > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
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> > > >
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> > > > Fantasy League still open:
>
> > > > League ID# - 134385
>
> > > > Passw0rd - 1234
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Maryland Terps Group:
>
> > > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/Terrapin_ City
>
> > > >
>
> > > > Baltimore Ravens Group:
>
> > > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/BaltimoRav ensYahoo! Groups
Links
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